[WWI] "Accurate colours"

Mon Jun 4 09:51:25 EDT 2007

I have to second your thoughts on Mr. Kit PC-10.  I was astonished and have
to wonder what was the basis for this mix?

Steve

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From: Brad & Merville [mailto:bigglesrfc at sympatico.ca] 
Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 6:06 AM
To: World War I Modeling Mailing List
Subject: Re: [WWI] "Accurate colours"

The same thing goes for PC10.  Lately I've been re-reading a lot of the
classics, William Fry, Cecil Lewis, Arthur Lee, etc...  I've found at least
three accounts of RFC aircraft, SEs, SPADs, in the field, described as
"chocolate" in colour.  Of course there are many shades of 'chocolate' but
few, if any of them, incorporate green.  If you mix PC10 according to the
formula in Robertson's Bombing Colours there is a decided green tinge to it.
But it seems that various factories and individual squadrons came up with
their own formulas based on what pigments were available in varying
quantities and the result, like the Methuen colour guides, was that almost
no two batches of aircraft would have exactly the same shade. Personally, I
favour a PC10 leaning to brown but I won't criticize anyone using, say, a
brown tinged Dunkelgrun.  I do still say that the guy who mixes the Mr. Kit
PC10 is smoking the same stuff they're using on Stephen's mesa!  : ) 

  Incidentally William Fry describes picking up an all white SPAD (a VII I
think) at the depot which he flew in that condition until ordered to paint
it.  It sounds likely that it was in fact a very pale/white CDL.  Has anyone
heard of any other instances of SPAD using white linen with clear enough
dope to allow it to keep it's white appearance?  

Brad

----- Original Message ----- 

From: michael wuyek <mailto:mawuyek at yahoo.com>  

To: Model List WWI <mailto:wwi at wwi-models.org>  

Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 6:48 AM

Subject: [WWI] "Accurate colours"

OK, enough about comics,  I've been reading a lot about "Accurate colours"
and "documentation" for those colours, especially for IPMS contents and
such. and how models at such contents should be judged for accurate colours
AND documentation, especially for WWI models. And I wonder how many of us
have a copy of the Methuen book for a reference guide. ( I don't, by the
way).

 This accuracy seems a bit moot when I remember an article (In WWI Aero I
believe) in which someone went to three different garment districts (in
England or the U.S, can't remember) and acquired three different copies of
the Methuen book. Lo and behold, when he compared them, the colour chips
were all slightly different, no doubt due to the variations of ink used at
various times. Has anyone thought of comparing FS colour standards in the
same way?

 Memories of colour change. Pigment on fabric changes, even the pigment
itself varies. Where is MisterKIt's documentation? Where are any of the
paint makers documentation when it comes to "WWI colours"? Speaking of
colours, here's a little story about our old friend MvR and his "red"
Albatros:

 In an article on Richthofen's Albatros D.III in Scale Models, August 1982,
several members of Jasta 11 told the author that the colour red used was "
very dark..blood red, 'coagulated blood'". Ecck..

 Now remember that Italian book Colour Profiles of World War One Combat
Planes. In the Albatros section, it mentions that all British pilots knew of
the "Pink Lady" a German pilot of rather effeminate features in a pink
Albatros, supposedly a woman pilot out to avenge the death of her pilot
husband?

 One of the recent (within 10 years) books on MvR (Once again can't recall
which one)stated one of the British officers RvM shot down survived and was
taken to field headquarters. The officer insisted he had been shot down by
the "pink lady" and demanded to meet her. MvR was in headquarters and simply
stated "I shot you down!" So much for the "Blood Red Colour"  I could
imagine the coat of red pained faded in the sun would appear pink. I can
also imagine MvR storming off to his mechanics and demanding that the colour
red be reapplied much thicker, so thick that the black crosses were painted
out and white outline to these crosses had to be repainted on the still wet
paint (which, by the way, would look......PINK). In a humorous vein, I can
imagine the mechanics and pilots before hand discussing among themselves
"Are YOU gonna tell him it looks pink?" "I'm not gonna tell him. YOU tell
him!" "Not me!" 

 This would make an interesting model for the IMPS judges to look at: Von
Richthofen's PINK Albatros???!!?? Now all we need to figure out is WHICH
colour pink.

  And speaking of CDL, whenever I'm in my local hardware store (here in
Maryland, USA), I go to the spray paint section and check out the colours.
The latest I've found was the brand "Premium Decor" Gloss, made by a company
GPM, PDS-16 Almond. Used it on my Eduard early Spad XIII and it looks good.
By the way, I'm preparing a group of photos of my models, including the
Spads, on my web site. Will let you when as I am not going to post anymore
photos on this list.

Excuse me, sorry for the rant; I woke up very early this morning (while it
was still dark) and now I see it getting light out side. I'm going back to
bed!

Mike W

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