WWI Digest 5032 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Favorite OT aircraft by Clay W Fulcher 2) Re: Favorite OT aircraft by "Pedro N. Soares" 3) Re: Favorite OT aircraft by Clay W Fulcher 4) É¢»§±¦E×é³ÉÁ¢£¬Ð´º´óÌػݣ¬Ãû¶îÓÐÏÞ£¬¿ìÈ¥Ë÷È¡ÐÂÕ³̰ɣ¡ by xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@163.com 5) Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post by "WW1" 6) Re: flat sanding n all by Ken Schmitt 7) RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G by "Greg Balzer" 8) RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G by RadspadMike@netscape.net 9) RE: Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post by RadspadMike@netscape.net 10) Re: Modelling Satisfaction by "Michael Kendix" 11) Re: Favorite OT aircraft by "peter leonard" 12) RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G by "Michael Kendix" 13) Re: Favorite OT aircraft by tbittners@sprintmail.com (Matt Bittner) 14) Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post by "Carlos Carreira" 15) RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G by "Michael Kendix" 16) Re: Favorite OT aircraft by grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl 17) RE: Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post by "Philippe Spriesterbach" 18) E.IV - topside famework by "Michael Kendix" 19) Re: E.IV - topside famework by MARK MILLER 20) Re: Cool Albie by Volker Haeusler 21) Re: E.IV - topside famework by Crawford Neil 22) N29, was Favorite OT aircraft by "peter leonard" 23) n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework by grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl 24) Re: n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework by grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl 25) Re: E.IV - topside famework by SSH 26) Re: N29, was Favorite OT aircraft by grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl 27) Re: n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework by SSH 28) Re: n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework by "Diego Ferneti" 29) OT Naval book by MFlake@TarrantCounty.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 03:37:09 -0700 From: Clay W Fulcher To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: <20030221.033710.3528.4.mtngoat01@juno.com> Oh No! I meant Hansa-Brandenburg W.29. W29! Not W.12. Clay (is a nong). On Fri, 21 Feb 2003 05:31:52 -0500 (EST) Clay W Fulcher writes: > > Finally, the Hansa-Brandenburg W.12 seaplane is another favorite. It > as a > low, sleek profile. Somewhere on the web I found a photo of a > squadron of > W.12's swooping into a bay to land after a patrol. It was an > awesome > picture....I wish I could remember where I saw it. ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 10:37:49 -0000 From: "Pedro N. Soares" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: <12AEB3D996DDD311B98A00508B6D75B302BBE4B0@TUFAO> Clay confesses: Another favorite is all the Gothas. Although bigger than the little fighters, it is smaller than some of the other bomber beasts, and looks very graceful to me. Roden's G.V kit has the lozenge decals to cover the entire aircraft. They were hard to work with, but the finished product is beautiful. So how come we haven't seen any photos of that, Clay?!!!!!! Pedro ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 03:47:59 -0700 From: Clay W Fulcher To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: <20030221.034759.3528.5.mtngoat01@juno.com> It was one of my first....before I started rigging. I am afraid to rig it now, after it is built. But I will some day. Also, I don't have a good camera yet. I will send in a few pix of my later ones when I borrow a neighbor's camera. Maybe I will buy a cheap throw-away camera, so as not to show too much detail. Then you can't see all the flaws. But I still think it is beautiful. On Fri, 21 Feb 2003 05:40:22 -0500 (EST) "Pedro N. Soares" writes: > > Clay confesses: > > Another favorite is all the Gothas. Although bigger than the little > fighters, it is smaller than some of the other bomber beasts, and > looks > very graceful to me. Roden's G.V kit has the lozenge decals to cover > the > entire aircraft. They were hard to work with, but the finished > product is > beautiful. > > > > So how come we haven't seen any photos of that, Clay?!!!!!! > > Pedro > > > > ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:27:11 From: xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx@163.com To: wwi@zg169.net Subject: É¢»§±¦E×é³ÉÁ¢£¬Ð´º´óÌػݣ¬Ãû¶îÓÐÏÞ£¬¿ìÈ¥Ë÷È¡ÐÂÕ³̰ɣ¡ Message-ID: <200302211122.h1LBM2Ji005695@mustang.sr.unh.edu> É¢»§±¦E×é³ÉÁ¢£¬Ð´º´óÌػݣ¬Ãû¶îÓÐÏÞ£¬¿ìÈ¥Ë÷È¡ÐÂÕ³̰ɣ¡ ÏÈ»ñÀûºó¸¶·Ñ£¡ ÎȽ¡»ñÀû£¬É¢»§±¦ÔÙÒ»´ÎÀûÓÃÎÒÃǵÄʵÁ¦£¬ÓÐЧµÄ¹æ±Ü´óÅ̵ķç ÏÕ¡£2002ÄêÏ°ëÄêµÄ²Ù×÷½áÊøÁË£¬ÔÚ´óÅ̵ø·ù´ï20.8%µÄ´óÐÜÊУ¬Ï °ëÄêÉ¢»§±¦¸÷ÕË»§µÄ¾ùÖµ»ñÀûÒÀ¾É´ïµ½ÁË8.92%£¬×î¼ÑÕË»§»ñÀû´ï17. 4% 2003ÄêµÄÐÐÇéÒÀ¾É²»ÈÝÀÖ¹Û£¬Ö»ÓжÔÏûÏ¢ÃæµÄ׼ȷ°ÑÎÕ£¬ ¼¼ÊõÃæ µÄ͸³¹Àí½â£¬²ÅÄÜʵÏÖÕË»§ÊÐÖµµÄÎȽ¡ÔöÕÇ¡£ËÄÄêÀ´µÄ»áÔ±·þÎñʵÁ¦ £¬¶ÔÖйú¹ÉÊÐÐÐÇéµÄÓÐÁ¦°ÑÎÕ£¬ÕâÒ»Çж¼±íÃ÷É¢»§±¦ÕæÕæÕýÕý·þÎñÓÚ ¹ã´óÉ¢»§£¬ÊÇÄúÖµµÃÐÅÈεĴó¹Ü¼Ò¡£Ñ¡ÔñÎÒÃÇ£¬Ò²¾ÍÑ¡ÔñÁËÎȽ¡Ó¯Àû £¬ÎÞÓdz´¹ÉµÄδÀ´£¡ÕæÕý°Ñ¡°×¬Ç®¾ÍÊÇÓ²µÀÀí¡±Â䵽ʵ´¦£¡ÏÈ»ñÀûºó ¸¶·Ñ£¬Õâ¾ÍÊÇÎÒÃÇʵÁ¦µÄ³Ðŵ£¡ É¢»§±¦E×é³ÉÁ¢£¬Ð´º´óÌػݣ¬Ãû¶îÓÐÏÞ£¬¿ìÈ¥Ë÷È¡ÐÂÕ³̰ɣ¡ ÏÈ»ñÀûºó¸¶·Ñ£¡ ¹ÉÊзçÔƱä»Ã£¬¶ÔÓÚÔÚ×ʽð¼¼ÊõÏûÏ¢µÈ·½ÃæÕ¼ÁÓÊƵÄÄúÀ´½²Äܵà ɢ»§±¦½ðÅ£×ÊѶµÄÖ¸µ¼ÎÞÒÉÊǸöºÃÑ¡Ôñ¡£Ì¤Ì¤ÊµÊµµÄ·ÖÎöºÍÃ÷È·µÄÖ¸ µ¼£¬ÊÇÓÃʱ¼ä»»È¡Îȶ¨ÊÕÒæµÄͶ×ÊÀíÄҲÊDZ¾¹¤×÷ÊÒµÄ×ÚÖ¼£»ÏàÐÅ ±¾¹¤×÷ÊÒµÄְҵˮ׼±Ø½«Ê¹Äú°ÚÍÑ¡°»¨Á¦Æø¡¢Å⾫Á¦¡¢¿÷Àϱ¾¡±µÄ¾Ö Ã棬ÕæÕý°Ñ¡°×¬Ç®¾ÍÊÇÓ²µÀÀí¡±Â䵽ʵ´¦£¡ÏÈ»ñÀûºó¸¶·Ñ£¬Õâ¾ÍÊÇÎÒ ÃÇʵÁ¦µÄ³Ðŵ£¡ ÏÈ»ñÀûºó¸¶·Ñ£¡ Ò»ÑùµÄÅÌÃ棬²»Ò»ÑùµÄÊÕÒ棬À´°É£¬Ñ¡ÔñÎÒÃÇ£¬Ñ¡ÔñÄãÃÇÎÞÓÇÓ¯Àû µÄ½«À´£¡ºÍÎÒÃǵĻáÔ±Ò»ÆðÏíÊÜÎÞÓdz´¹É£¬ÇáËÉÓ¯ÀûµÄÀÖȤ°É£¡ ÓÐÒâÕßÇëÁ¢¼´ÖÂÐÅsanhubao2002@vip.163.comË÷È¡Èë»áÕ³̣¨º¬ É¢»§±¦µÄÒµ¼¨£©¡£ É¢»§±¦½ðÅ£×Éѯ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 08:20:29 -0300 From: "WW1" To: Subject: Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post Message-ID: Hi Clay! > Who else has experience with vacform? Can you share some tips and > possible "gotchas" before I turn my Lloyd into a heap of plastic > shavings? Thanks. I have never actually finished any vac kit yet. At least I can say in my defense that I ruined a few! But there is good advice on the net, the main point are explained here: http://www.swiftsite.com/rosemonthobby/vacform.htm and here: http://www.aeroclub-models.com/Aeroclub/files/VacForm.pdf Hope it helps! D. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:26:12 -0600 From: Ken Schmitt To: Subject: Re: flat sanding n all Message-ID: Greg: > Just don't hold your breath waiting for that build to hit the gallery anytime soon! Unlike some of these blithe encouragers, I would humbly suggest you extend the research portion of that particular arcane endeavor. You've got your whole life ahead of you, sir, don't do it! Ken ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:27:19 -0500 From: "Greg Balzer" To: Subject: RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G Message-ID: <002801c2d9a4$946ef9c0$45a44644@Greg> Neil, During Clay's recent fire sale I won the award for the fastest finger in the West, and was rewarded with a Lone Star resin/vac Fokker E III, a C.A. Atkins Fokker Dr. 1, and Sierra Scale Nie 11. All vacs. I'm looking forward to building them, just that right now, with school and other extra-curricular activities, the amount of effort required is prohibitive. I graduate in August, and have promised myself a years sabbatical! Greg ----- Original Message ----- From: "Crawford Neil" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 3:42 AM Subject: [WWI] RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G > Greg, Can you tell us what it is! > /Neil C. > > > Well, > > After looking at them, I don't know if my nerves or my > > stomach are up to the > > effort! Vacs look to be a far cry from my typical building > > experience. But > > hey, like everyone, nothing more enticing that the raw > > potential in every > > kit as you open it for the first time, lift out the pieces, and try to > > envision what the finished product might look like! Just > > don't hold your > > breath waiting for that build to hit the gallery anytime soon! > > Greg > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:40:08 -0500 From: RadspadMike@netscape.net To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G Message-ID: <492F14F2.0EBCC0F4.3E0364A1@netscape.net> Clay, Take a look at: http://www.aeroclub-models.com Click on Modelling Articles at the top of the page. Then click on Vacform Modelling by John Adams. This is the best I've seen on vacforms; John certainly knows what he is writing about. It is an easily downloaded .pdf file so you can print it out or store it on your hard drive for easy reference. HTH, Mike Kavanaugh Clay W Fulcher wrote: >Who else has experience with vacform? Can you share some tips and >possible "gotchas" before I turn my Lloyd into a heap of plastic >shavings? Thanks. > >--Clay > __________________________________________________________________ The NEW Netscape 7.0 browser is now available. Upgrade now! http://channels.netscape.com/ns/browsers/download.jsp Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 08:01:32 -0500 From: RadspadMike@netscape.net To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post Message-ID: <5748F24C.6796DC46.3E0364A1@netscape.net> Duh! Forgot to look for earlier replies. Sorry. Mike Kavanaugh "WW1" wrote: >I have never actually finished any vac kit yet. At least I can say in my >defense that I ruined a few! But there is good advice on the net, the main >point are explained here: >http://www.swiftsite.com/rosemonthobby/vacform.htm >and here: >http://www.aeroclub-models.com/Aeroclub/files/VacForm.pdf > >Hope it helps! >D. > __________________________________________________________________ The NEW Netscape 7.0 browser is now available. Upgrade now! http://channels.netscape.com/ns/browsers/download.jsp Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:16:28 +0000 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Modelling Satisfaction Message-ID: >From: "Bob Pearson" > >Hmmn. . now I feel guilty for subjecting Michael to those kits. > >Bob > >From: "Michael Kendix" > >Flying Egg SSW DDr.1. - Ack! Also, the Ilya tested my sanity but I'm > >glad I built that. Really!:) The SSW DDr.1 lookedso interesting and nice in the packet: who could've known it would take me 3 goes to get the interplane struts on so that they were aligned correctly? Further, I think I amde those struts too long, so the whole thing was out of whack including the boom. As for the Ilya - that was my second attempt, and again, I took that on willingly - I thought I'd never finish it:). Michael _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:18:52 +0000 From: "peter leonard" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: <20030221131852.21778.qmail@mail.com> I'm getting booted every couple of days at the moment so I missed the start of this one. My favourite OT aircraft is whichever one I'm working on at the time. Unfortunately I don't finish half of those I start so my passion is usually short lived. cheers Peter L nb: N29 nl: bob wills ne: salt beef and pickle -- __________________________________________________________ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:21:04 +0000 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G Message-ID: >From: "Greg Balzer" >... just that right now, with school and other extra-curricular > >activities, the amount of effort required is prohibitive. I >graduate in August, and have promised myself a years sabbatical! I thought you were going to use that year tow rite your doctoral thesis:)! Michael _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 07:27:52 -0600 (CST) From: tbittners@sprintmail.com (Matt Bittner) To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: <200302211327.h1LDRq549842@king1.kingsnake.com> Peter: > nb: N29 Whose Nie.29 kit? Matt ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:30:22 -0000 From: "Carlos Carreira" To: Subject: Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post Message-ID: <009101c2d9ad$627fafa0$6901a8c0@duron> Clay, I can't say I'm experienced, I'm still trying to complete my first (Sierra Albatros C.VII) and it requires a lot of preparation work, but after that it is not so different from an injection kit. Basic rules I learned from the pages Diego pointed: - Make a sanding board. I made mines from 1 cm particle board, with the wet and dry paper fixed on the underside with pins; - Use a thin permanent marker; - Score around the part at a 45 degree angle. I wish I learned that before ruining a Blackburn Iris wing, many years ago. By the way, it's a lot easier to achieve a thin and realistic trailing edge in wwi planes with vac wings than trying to improve, say, an Airfix one. And it is also a lot easier to detail the cockpit, due to the thin plastic. I also have a Lloyd smiling at me, Joystick's C II. Best regards, Carlos ---- Original Message ----- From: "Clay W Fulcher" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Friday, February 21, 2003 9:59 AM Subject: [WWI] RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G > I have one vac in my pile of unbuilts, a Lloyd CV in 1/72. I also get > butterflies in my stomach when I am tempted to begin on it. Until this > one gets built, no others are allowed on my pile. It seems there is a > larger variety of aircraft types in vac than resin or injection. Is this > true? > > Who else has experience with vacform? Can you share some tips and > possible "gotchas" before I turn my Lloyd into a heap of plastic > shavings? Thanks. > > --Clay > > On Fri, 21 Feb 2003 03:42:43 -0500 (EST) Crawford Neil > writes: > > Greg, Can you tell us what it is! > > /Neil C. > > > > > Well, > > > After looking at them, I don't know if my nerves or my > > > stomach are up to the > > > effort! Vacs look to be a far cry from my typical building > > > experience. But > > > hey, like everyone, nothing more enticing that the raw > > > potential in every > > > kit as you open it for the first time, lift out the pieces, and > > try to > > > envision what the finished product might look like! Just > > > don't hold your > > > breath waiting for that build to hit the gallery anytime soon! > > > Greg > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ ____ > Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today > Only $9.95 per month! > Visit www.juno.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 13:34:02 +0000 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Kallmunzer's lost post WAS:One more in the Rogues G Message-ID: >From: Clay W Fulcher >I have one vac in my pile of unbuilts, a Lloyd CV in 1/72. I also get >butterflies in my stomach when I am tempted to begin on it. Until this >one gets built, no others are allowed on my pile. It seems there is a >larger variety of aircraft types in vac than resin or injection. Is >this >true? Hard for me to say but I think that the balance is tipping in favour of injection and resin, at least in terms of what can be bought retail. Secondhand, who knows? >Who else has experience with vacform? Can you share some tips and >possible "gotchas" before I turn my Lloyd into a heap of plastic >shavings? Thanks. I assume you have a Sierra Llyod C.V. I have a vac of theirs and it looks good, plus reports from those who've built them are positive. So that's the first step - get a decent vac kit. Read the articles referred to by other folks and that should be sufficient. The main problem with vacs is not really cutting out the pieces from the sheet. That can be accomplished fairly easily with sandpaper taped to a plexiglass sheet, a knife or whatever. My problem, is having sanded it out, you are left with a bare bones entity that requires a fair amount of scratchbuilding to make. A good set of references is helpful at this point. One thing though, your modelling abilities will improve as you proceed through the build because you have to make a lot of the pieces from plastic card etc. You have control over the amount and type of detail you want to add but that means there's more opportunities to make mistakes - it's somewhat analogous to using a manual versus an automatic transmission. Michael _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 14:45:05 +0100 From: grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: I've forgotten the Fokker D.VI. Real beauty. I'd like to fly it. Some kind of the "German Pup" G. --------------r-e-k-l-a-m-a----------------- Tanie bilety lotnicze! http://samoloty.onet.pl ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 20 Feb 2003 14:50:53 +0100 From: "Philippe Spriesterbach" To: Subject: RE: Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post Message-ID: Try this link : http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/vacformbg_1.htm IMHO, this one is the best explanation on "how to built a vac" I've ever seen. This next link is more specific and explain how to cut vacform canopies : http://www.clubhyper.com/reference/vacformbg_1.htm HTH Regards Philippe Spriesterbach http://users.skynet.be/fa233213 -----Message d'origine----- De : wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org]De la part de WW1 Envoyé : vendredi 21 février 2003 12:27 À : Multiple recipients of list Objet : [WWI] Vac tips WAS: Kallmunzer's lost post Hi Clay! > Who else has experience with vacform? Can you share some tips and > possible "gotchas" before I turn my Lloyd into a heap of plastic > shavings? Thanks. I have never actually finished any vac kit yet. At least I can say in my defense that I ruined a few! But there is good advice on the net, the main point are explained here: http://www.swiftsite.com/rosemonthobby/vacform.htm and here: http://www.aeroclub-models.com/Aeroclub/files/VacForm.pdf Hope it helps! D. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 14:04:27 +0000 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: I am at the point where my E.IV is ready to be weathered. One issue I have is whether or not there should be any of the interior framework showing through on the top and underside of the fuselage. Eduard's fuselage has nice raised detail on the fusealge sides that represents the fabric being pulled over the fuselage's framework. However, Eduard does not put any such detail on the top or underside. Some modellers have left this as is but others have added their own topside and underside detail (Bob Laskodi on his 1/48th scale Eindeckker). Any opinions on this? Michael ^^^^^^^^^/\/\/\/\/\/-/-/- :) _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 06:19:12 -0800 (PST) From: MARK MILLER To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: <20030221141912.88490.qmail@web80011.mail.yahoo.com> Michael I recently saw a photo in one of the N17 related data files that demonstrated that there was a "sucking in" effect on the fuselage of WW1 in flight. which resulted in the ribs showing through the fabric. Not sure if this is limited to radial equiped AC or not The photo showed the Canadian n17 in flight and it was a pretty pronounced effect. I had never heard of this before, but it explains a lot Not sure if this answers your question, but at least it gives some explanantion as to why you see any rib detail at all. Mark --- Michael Kendix wrote: > I am at the point where my E.IV is ready to be weathered. One > issue I have > is whether or not there should be any of the interior > framework showing > through on the top and underside of the fuselage. Eduard's > fuselage has > nice raised detail on the fusealge sides that represents the > fabric being > pulled over the fuselage's framework. However, Eduard does > not put any such > detail on the top or underside. Some modellers have left this > as is but > others have added their own topside and underside detail (Bob > Laskodi on his > 1/48th scale Eindeckker). > > Any opinions on this? > > Michael > > ^^^^^^^^^/\/\/\/\/\/-/-/- :) > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 22:25:07 +0800 From: Volker Haeusler To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Cool Albie Message-ID: <000701c2d9b5$09b41520$0301a8c0@com1> Hans, > If this is really a Jasta 77b machine, it should be possible to confirm > that. I will contact my bavarian friends. > 'Bavarian' blue is not light blue. It's some sort of a darkish cornflower > blue. snip > > Dan San says: > > The white rudder and elevator were Jasta 77b markings along > > with the fins,rearfuselage and stabilizer in light blue. There > > appears to be some change in tonal value in this area with a > > wavy line at the leading edge of the fin and tailplane. What is > > inconsistant is the white spinner and ring cowl. Those were > > light blue in Jasta 77b? Save your time on that - I don´t think DSA is correct in that one: 1. To the best of my knowledge, the white rudder and elevator for J 77b can only be shown for aircraft after 03/18 (ie, with the Balkenkreuz),. Examples: Pollingers D IIIa, Moosbacher´s D Va, Gossner´s D XII. 2. There are examples of J 77 b´s aircraft clearly without the white marking, for example Fuchs´ D Va (which incidentally is an aircraft with Iron Crosses). In total, I don´t think there´s any indication this is a J 77b aircraft - the white front is quite clear, and that is a contradiction. There are at least three or four Jastas which are a better alternative. Jasta 53 is a good one (definitely used white tails and noses at a later time at least), but there are others as well, where this marking could be a combination of personal and unit marking. As for the lozenge question: Again, this is *not* consistent for the whole batch, the Canberra D Va is a good example. Volker ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:25:56 +0100 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Re: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: Yes this is something that has made me think. I scanned a Spad in flight photo recently, with a very pronounced rib effect. Although I have seen photos of crashed Spads with equally pronounced effect. Certainly something that should be taken into consideration. /Neil C. > > Michael > > I recently saw a photo in one of the N17 related data files that > demonstrated that there was a "sucking in" effect on the > fuselage of WW1 in flight. which resulted in the ribs showing > through the fabric. > Not sure if this is limited to radial equiped AC or not > > The photo showed the Canadian n17 in flight and it was a pretty > pronounced effect. > I had never heard of this before, but it explains a lot > > Not sure if this answers your question, but at least it gives > some explanantion as to why you see any rib detail at all. > Mark > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 14:31:58 +0000 From: "peter leonard" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: N29, was Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: <20030221143158.20798.qmail@mail.com> Matt: "Whose Nie.29 kit?" Sorry, scratch. I hadn't bought a datafile for about a year, I don't even know what the '03 program is. So when I stumbled across DF97 at the Huddersfield show it got the juices flowing. This being half term I had a week off to get cracking on the fuselage to which I have just added the tail. Fingers crossed. chers Peter L -- __________________________________________________________ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:43:00 +0100 From: grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: Hi Folks! One have to be carefull here, as in-flight effects are more complex than "sucking the fabric" only. For example there are photos of the planes (one of them is Fokker D.VII) which are "hanging" on their wings during flight - I mean that it is clearly seen that the plane's weight "hangs" on the wings, and the wings have visible (hm, what to the hell is that word? "vertical sweepback" - I mean that the wing ends are higher than center). It looks like Roden's wing is correct for the flying plane. You can observe this on the modern planes too, sometimes even more, taking-off B-52 or Rutan's Voyager comes to mind. Or circling sailplanes. Think also about fabric on the wings, especially on the bottom if you don't have raised ribs on your kit (like Roden's Pfalz). Cheers! G. --------------r-e-k-l-a-m-a----------------- Tanie bilety lotnicze! http://samoloty.onet.pl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:50:22 +0100 From: grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: >Hi Folks! >One have to be carefull here, as in-flight effects are more complex than "sucking the fabric" only. Also you can expect the "no prop" effect during flight, not counting the "pilot-in-the-cockpit" effect. ;-) G. --------------r-e-k-l-a-m-a----------------- Tanie bilety lotnicze! http://samoloty.onet.pl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 09:49:54 -0500 From: SSH To: Subject: Re: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: <20030221145223.6CFA04640A8@mail.mailsnare.net> Michael, In my opinion, and this is pure guesswork: If the craft is in flight, I would imagine that the fabric distortion effect would be approx the same all around. If the craft is at rest, the fuselage is subject to a different set of stresses. The fabric on the side is more likely to show stretch folds, than the top and bottom. If the fabric is newly applied, it will show less folding. If the fabric is old, or if the aircraft hasnt been trued in a long time, it will show more folding. regards Sanjeev ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 15:52:44 +0100 From: grzegorz_mazurowski@poczta.onet.pl To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: N29, was Favorite OT aircraft Message-ID: >Matt: "Whose Nie.29 kit?" Choroszy makes a good one. In proper scale. G. --------------r-e-k-l-a-m-a----------------- Tanie bilety lotnicze! http://samoloty.onet.pl ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 09:57:05 -0500 From: SSH To: Subject: Re: n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: <20030221145935.F17634640C1@mail.mailsnare.net> word? "vertical sweepback" - I mean that the wing ends are higher >than center ---- dihedral. Negative dihedral is sometimes called anhedral. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 12:04:08 -0300 From: "Diego Ferneti" To: Subject: Re: n-flight effects/was: E.IV - topside famework Message-ID: <00d301c2d9ba$7bea6ae0$4817a8c0@sssp.rosario.gov.ar> Grzes! >the "pilot-in-the-cockpit" effect. If it's in flight, must have its scarf flowing in the wind. D. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 21 Feb 2003 09:02:28 -0600 From: MFlake@TarrantCounty.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: OT Naval book Message-ID: <71EA257E03C4D511B8ED00065B04BF9404AF3AF9@itcrex001.tarrantcounty.com> I just finished "Blooding of the Guns" by Allan Fullerton, a fiction piece following three Englishmen on three different types of ships through the Battle of Jutland. As I understand it, it is already a popular series in England, with subsequent sequels now taking place in the second unpleasantness. Here in the USA, however, we only have this one, with the next installment not due out till August -- this one describing the Zeebruge raid. I can understand its popularity, I zipped right through it. The battle scenes are compelling and horrific. There is no attempt to flesh out the entire battle, with the author showing how the battle looked from three different perspectives, from the bridges of a destroyer, armored cruiser and battleship. From time to time I referred to my Osprey "Jutland" in an attempt to keep track of the big picture. A very good read, highly recommended. Makes me want to build WW1 ships -- unfortunately models of them are almost as rare as Naglos and Boblinks. Been waiting for a pair from Germany now for a month. Marc Flake ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 5032 **********************