WWI Digest 4933 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Otis by "Bob Pearson" 2) Re: Wright flyer by Ken Schmitt 3) Re: WWI digest 4932 by Ken Schmitt 4) Re: lego duplo and more by Ken Schmitt 5) OT Synchronicity by dave.fleming@dial.pipex.com 6) Re: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane by dave.fleming@dial.pipex.com 7) Re: German translation - help! by a.r.martin@t-online.de (Rita) 8) Re: Fok E.III model added to site by "Mike Muth" 9) Re: Wright flyer by "Paul Schwartzkopf" 10) markings by Ken Schmitt 11) Feeling Good by "Matt Bittner" 12) Re: Feeling Good by Tom Plesha 13) RE: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane by "Shane Weier" 14) Re: German translation - help! by "Michael Kavanaugh" 15) RE: Albatros kits - DI and DII (Pt.1) by "Shane Weier" 16) RE: Albatros kits - DI and DII (pt 2) by "Shane Weier" 17) Re: Feeling Good by "Michael Kavanaugh" 18) Re: German translation - help! by Tom Plesha 19) Re: markings by "Shane Weier" 20) RE: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane by "Michael Kavanaugh" 21) RE: Albatros kits - DI and DII (Pt.1) by "Lance Krieg" 22) Re: Fok E.III model added to site by "Ross & Wendy Moorhouse" 23) RE: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane by "Shane Weier" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 11:04:56 -0800 From: "Bob Pearson" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Otis Message-ID: <104308973901@smtp-1.vancouver.ipapp.com> Actually the "Mad Major", was Chris Draper of Naval Eight who was given the title after flying under the bridges in London at the end of the war. He later wrote a book on his experiences titled the same. Bob ---------- >From: Crawford Neil > > When I made that comment about Mannock being mad, it was just > a joke about him being about as mad as the rest of us, so perfect > for honorary list membership. If he really was mad is the same kind > of question as who shot down MvR. He was called the mad Major, and > the book I read about him last year, sort of vaguely implied that > he was mano-depressive, OTOH it also quoted someone as saying that > had he survived he might have become a prime-minister. He was much > loved by his men, which McCudden wasn't (according to the foreward > in Flying Fury), there may have been some upper-class disapproval > causing the "mad" label, I agree with Bob about this, anyone with a > working-class background would likely be regarded as strange by the > upper-class officers. That could well be what happened to McCudden, > and come to think of it perhaps Fonck too, the French officer class > was just as bad as the British. It's all idle speculation anyway, > but quite interesting! > /Neil C. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:26:31 -0600 From: Ken Schmitt To: Subject: Re: Wright flyer Message-ID: Michael: Didn't Glencoe also do one in 48? Not teasing about scale but speculating.... > 1/72nd scale Renwal > 1/16th scale Hasegawa > > What about others? Ken ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:29:09 -0600 From: Ken Schmitt To: Subject: Re: WWI digest 4932 Message-ID: Pedro- We here in the states are divided about this. I too share your admiration, respect. In event, I have worked every MLK day since inception... > Pedro (who gets goose skin every time he sees MLK on a docummentary > delivering his "I have a dream" speech) Ken ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:30:56 -0600 From: Ken Schmitt To: Subject: Re: lego duplo and more Message-ID: Andreas! > Hi listmembers, > > found this while surfing in the www. > > http://www.1000steine.de/gallery2/g137/ > Now, if you could just find Duplo, we'd have a set! Ken ....by any means necessary ; ) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 15:26:57 +0000 From: dave.fleming@dial.pipex.com To: Subject: OT Synchronicity Message-ID: <1043076417.3e2c154111f95@netmail.pipex.net> On Friday, when searching the AWM on-line archive for info about the Junkers J1, and any chance of a captured one (There were at least two at Grain in 1919), I canme across some photos taken at Bickendorf nr Cologne when occupied by RAF/AFC which inculded a Fried. GIIIa and a Gotha GLVII in RAF markings. Today I buy Air Enthusiast 103 for Jan 2003, and inside there is a selection of photos found in an attic that includes a cracking shot of the same Gotha!! This is the second time recently that a new-to-me piece of info has turned up unbidden in unexpected places! (The other related to a pt2 captured subject) Now, anyone built Sierra's 1/72 Gotha GLVII ? Dave Fleming ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 15:20:05 +0000 From: dave.fleming@dial.pipex.com To: Subject: Re: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane Message-ID: <1043076004.3e2c13a500fac@netmail.pipex.net> Quoting Michael Kendix : > If I'm ever going to do it this has to be the year to make a Wright > Flyer, > so I was wondering about the range of kits available in different > scales, > and the quality of said kits. I know of the > > 1/72nd scale Renwal > 1/16th scale Hasegawa > > What about others? There is a Monogram one in a fit-the-box scale that comes with a diorama of the 'launcher' as well Must be the year for a proper 1/72 version! > > P.S. Just in case folks thought it was quiet today - most of the U.S. is > > off-work for the Martin Luther King Day holiday. > Cue Stevie Wonder: "Happy Birthday to ya!" dave F ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 17:31:41 +0100 From: a.r.martin@t-online.de (Rita) To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: German translation - help! Message-ID: <18aepp-0DsQ26C@fwd04.sul.t-online.com> Hi Tom, if you can send me the text I will try to translate. But beware my English is not the best. Greetings Andreas Morg17ms@aol.com schrieb: > > --part1_198.1435f6fa.2b5cd2fd_boundary > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Can any German reading soul out there help me with some picture caption > translations from "Cockpit Profile 1", by Peter Cohausz? The English > glossary helps only a little. I am especially interested in the captions for > the various Halberstadt aircraft on pages 16 - 18. I bet I'm not the only > list member who would really value a good translation of this books 3 dozen > WW I photos. > > Tom Morgan > > --part1_198.1435f6fa.2b5cd2fd_boundary > Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > FACE="Arial" LANG="0">Can any German reading soul out there help me with > some picture caption translations from "Cockpit Profile 1", by Peter > Cohausz?  The English glossary helps only a little.  I am > especially interested in the captions for the various Halberstadt aircraft > on pages 16 - 18.  I bet I'm not the only list member who would really > value a good translation of this books 3 dozen WW I photos.
>
> Tom Morgan > > --part1_198.1435f6fa.2b5cd2fd_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 15:19:12 -0500 From: "Mike Muth" To: Subject: Re: Fok E.III model added to site Message-ID: <003401c2c0c1$40bdd900$3906bacc@ptdprolog.net> Buddeke? Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: Ross & Wendy Moorhouse To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 12:54 AM Subject: [WWI] Re: Fok E.III model added to site > Yes it's got the correct markings on it. ;-) Black on white squares. > Nice build too. If you do another one with the marking for sure you can > do it in a light grey as what's his face that is famous for flying this > plane for the Turks had a light grey one. > > Cheers > > Ross > > -----Original Message----- > From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org] On Behalf Of Mike > Muth > Sent: Monday, 20 January 2003 1:34 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: [WWI] Re: Fok E.III model added to site > > Sanjeev > Thanks. > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: ot811 > To: Multiple recipients of list > Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2003 5:47 PM > Subject: [WWI] Fok E.III model added to site > > > > Mike Muth sent in a Fok E.III in Turkish colours. > > See > > http://www.wwi-models.org/Images/Muth/Fokker/index.html > > or news. > > regards > > Sanjeev > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 14:25:47 -0600 From: "Paul Schwartzkopf" To: Subject: Re: Wright flyer Message-ID: IIRC, the Glencoe Flyer was in something like 1/100 or 1/144 scale. Paul -----Original Message----- From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org]On Behalf Of Ken Schmitt Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 1:27 PM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: [WWI] Re: Wright flyer Michael: Didn't Glencoe also do one in 48? Not teasing about scale but speculating.... > 1/72nd scale Renwal > 1/16th scale Hasegawa > > What about others? Ken ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 14:46:34 -0600 From: Ken Schmitt To: Subject: markings Message-ID: Folks- http://www.rodenplant.com/HTML/045.htm What does everyone think of the markings for Mannock's SE 5a? I have never had a good look at his aircraft and was wondering if anyone could comment on this kit as a source. Have a completed Blue Max waiting for markings, on this basis. thanks- Ken ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 15:08:36 -0600 From: "Matt Bittner" To: "wwi@wwi-models.org" Subject: Feeling Good Message-ID: Cool! Since I do have today off, I thought I would venture back into on topic modeling. I now have the SPAD A.2 sprayed CDL. 'Bout time, too (right, guys? ;-))!! There are a few flaws to fix, then I'll spray it another coat, give it two or three days to dry, then mask and spray the yellow (hopefully I'll have the nacelle ready to paint by then). Granted, I still have an off topic to finish as well, but it's good wrapping up another on topic kit. I haven't finished one since the Eduard Jasta 12 Dr.I. Matt ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 13:13:59 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Plesha To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Feeling Good Message-ID: <20030120211359.99570.qmail@web40310.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Matt- Sounds good. Hurry up! Pictures!!!! Later Tom .. --- Matt Bittner wrote: > Cool! Since I do have today off, I thought I would > venture back > into on topic modeling. > > I now have the SPAD A.2 sprayed CDL. 'Bout time, > too (right, > guys? ;-))!! There are a few flaws to fix, then > I'll spray it > another coat, give it two or three days to dry, then > mask and > spray the yellow (hopefully I'll have the nacelle > ready to paint > by then). > > Granted, I still have an off topic to finish as > well, but it's > good wrapping up another on topic kit. I haven't > finished one > since the Eduard Jasta 12 Dr.I. > > > Matt > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 07:22:30 +1000 From: "Shane Weier" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane Message-ID: Pedro and Michael: > > P.S. Just in case folks thought it was quiet today - most of > > the U.S. is > > off-work for the Martin Luther King Day holiday. > > >IMHO the type of thing that should be commemorated all over the world Agreed, but it's a bit much when it leads to serious list slowdowns..... Good grief, I was forced to spend Monday *working* !!!! Shane ******************************** My Strine is a Toad in Disguise ******************************** _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 15:40:39 -0600 From: "Michael Kavanaugh" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: German translation - help! Message-ID: I would also be very interested in receiving a copy of the translated captions. It might be easier if it were done by a list member fluent in German that has a copy of the book. However, Tom, if you don't have a scanner, I have a copy and can scan some pages to Andreas if you will LMK which ones you want. I'm shamelessly greedy . . . I would willingly accept a translation of all the captions in the book if someone was willing to do them. ;-) Regards, Mike Kavanaugh >From: a.r.martin@t-online.de (Rita) >Reply-To: wwi@wwi-models.org >To: Multiple recipients of list >Subject: [WWI] Re: German translation - help! >Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 14:58:03 -0500 (EST) > >Hi Tom, > >if you can send me the text I will try to translate. But beware my English >is >not the best. > >Greetings >Andreas > >Morg17ms@aol.com schrieb: > > > > > Can any German reading soul out there help me with some picture caption > > translations from "Cockpit Profile 1", by Peter Cohausz? The English > > glossary helps only a little. I am especially interested in the >captions for > > the various Halberstadt aircraft on pages 16 - 18. I bet I'm not the >only > > list member who would really value a good translation of this books 3 >dozen > > WW I photos. > > > > Tom Morgan _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 07:52:23 +1000 From: "Shane Weier" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Albatros kits - DI and DII (Pt.1) Message-ID: Pedro, in reply to Alberto: >I've not touched the DI and the DII, but I'm putting together a couple >of >DIIIs. Me too, or rather mine are a D.III and a W.4 which I started at work ;-) during Christmas >Apart from some fitting problems (I got one with a warped fuselage >half and on the other the ventral seam became somehow concave) No fit problems whatsoever on mine, but the D.III has a mild concavity along the ventral seam below the cockpit and guns >only thing I had trouble with so far was the >"semi-spherical" front fuselage panel: I'm not sure what Pedro means here - the ring at the nose? Mine fit exactly though I had to be carefull that all the flash was removed from the fuselage sides Here are my findings so far 1. Seat is probably a bit too small. I used it anyway :-) 2. Not a lot of interior detail aside from a nice stick and clunky rudder bar. I replaced the rudder bar, added the aileron torque rod to the stick, removed the shelves at seat bottom level and replaced with rod added seat support crossbars added throttle, pump, magneto, gun support arch, ammo box added firewall (waste of time, can't see it) seatbelts (end part 1) ******************************** My Strine is a Toad in Disguise ******************************** _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 07:52:51 +1000 From: "Shane Weier" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Albatros kits - DI and DII (pt 2) Message-ID: (Start part 2) 3. The engine/gundeck/cockpit surrounds part fits exactly *but* it's really critical that the flash be removed from it and both sides, and it's a little unclear what is flash and what is part. Also, I found it necessary to slightly twist the two forward edges out at the top, and also down towards the nose - all done before gluing anything. 4. Also thinned *greatly* the edges of the engine cowl to improve the looks, but this is also necessary for the engine to sit correctly. Incidentally, the engine support "bearers" need about .5mm removed from their edges, otherwise the engine *will* fit but it will *also* push the sides of the fuselage outwards and then you almost certainly will have a battle to put the engine cowls on without puttying. No putty used there and no detail lost in sanding *but* I ended up scraping off the moulded "rolled metal" edging on the engine cowl edges. It's just way too overscale and if I replace it at all it'll be with very thin sprue. 5. Also drilled out the central hole in the six small square plates (that fit the ends of the gun arch and so on)to make them sharper - and the same for the screw holes on the engine cowling, or paint alone will make them disappear. The cowl ring fitted fine on both of mine and test fitting shows the prop shaft is nicely centred - something I had been worried about before starting >Other than that it's no problem at all and since the cockpit opening is >quite big I'm sure you'll have a field day detailling the office to >exhaustion, as ever ;-) LOL On my D.III I decided *after* it was all closed up that the seatbelts didn't drape as I wished. So....I prodded them with the end of my tweezers and dislodged the seat. It took about an hour of bad language to get it out of that big hole with the 4 seatblets in the way, manouevre it back into place and re-lay the belts, which now look worse than when I started. There's a lesson in there some place :-) And *that* is as far as I've gone. Since the wings on Albertos D.I and D.II are different I doubt if I can add much more anyway! Shane ******************************** My Strine is a Toad in Disguise ******************************** _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 15:52:19 -0600 From: "Michael Kavanaugh" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Feeling Good Message-ID: Any OT model completion is great . . . in any scale. ;-) As Tom said, photos please. I have the Spin kit and can look at the photos and fantasize about what I would do if I built it. Mike Kavanaugh >From: "Matt Bittner" >Reply-To: wwi@wwi-models.org >To: Multiple recipients of list >Subject: [WWI] Feeling Good >Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 16:10:38 -0500 (EST) > >I now have the SPAD A.2 sprayed CDL. 'Bout time, too (right, >guys? ;-))!! There are a few flaws to fix, then I'll spray it >another coat, give it two or three days to dry, then mask and >spray the yellow (hopefully I'll have the nacelle ready to paint >by then). > _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 14:01:37 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Plesha To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: German translation - help! Message-ID: <20030120220137.79059.qmail@web40312.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Mike- You beat me to the offer, but of course I would also like to have any translations from the book. .. Later Tom --- Michael Kavanaugh wrote: > > I would also be very interested in receiving a copy > of the translated > captions. It might be easier if it were done by a > list member fluent in > German that has a copy of the book. However, Tom, > if you don't have a > scanner, I have a copy and can scan some pages to > Andreas if you will LMK > which ones you want. I'm shamelessly greedy . . . I > would willingly accept > a translation of all the captions in the book if > someone was willing to do > them. ;-) > > Regards, > Mike Kavanaugh > > >From: a.r.martin@t-online.de (Rita) > >Reply-To: wwi@wwi-models.org > >To: Multiple recipients of list > > >Subject: [WWI] Re: German translation - help! > >Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 14:58:03 -0500 (EST) > > > >Hi Tom, > > > >if you can send me the text I will try to > translate. But beware my English > >is > >not the best. > > > >Greetings > >Andreas > > > >Morg17ms@aol.com schrieb: > > > > > > > Can any German reading soul out there help me > with some picture caption > > > translations from "Cockpit Profile 1", by Peter > Cohausz? The English > > > glossary helps only a little. I am especially > interested in the > >captions for > > > the various Halberstadt aircraft on pages 16 - > 18. I bet I'm not the > >only > > > list member who would really value a good > translation of this books 3 > >dozen > > > WW I photos. > > > > > > Tom Morgan > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online > http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 08:05:42 +1000 From: "Shane Weier" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: markings Message-ID: Ken says: >What does everyone think of the markings for Mannock's SE 5a? Can't help with this from here (work) but in looking at the Roden website I've just noticed they seem to have produced the inspection windows for the aileron pulleys as decals. Cool, but maybe a bit oversize. >I have never had a good look at his aircraft and was wondering if >anyone >could comment on this kit as a source. Have a completed Blue Max >waiting >for markings, on this basis. All I can tell you about the B-M markings is that the upper roundels are wrong for McCuddens aircraft which was an early build with no white surround on the top roundels. I'd guess they're right for the later machines including Mannocks Shane ******************************** My Strine is a Toad in Disguise ******************************** _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 16:07:35 -0600 From: "Michael Kavanaugh" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane Message-ID: >From: "Shane Weier" > >Agreed, but it's a bit much when it leads to serious list slowdowns..... > >Good grief, I was forced to spend Monday *working* !!!! Pity. Being twice retired, my heart bleeds for you. When gainfully employed, I had much more time available for the requisite recreation. Now, SWMBO, and the other women in my extended family, firmly believe, "the devil finds work for idle hands" and are always finding things for me to do that have a much higher priority than a "that's nice, dear" modeling hobby that rightfully belongs to children. Strangely, they don't seem to mind how much time I spend at the computer. Being virtually computer illiterate, I suppose they think I'm actually doing something meaningful. and *we* know better, don't we? Mike Kavanaugh _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 20 Jan 2003 16:32:38 -0600 From: "Lance Krieg" To: Subject: RE: Albatros kits - DI and DII (Pt.1) Message-ID: Shane has: "...removed the shelves at seat bottom level and replaced with rod..." I'm busy with an Albatros D.II in the (preferred) 1/48 scale and believe that the Albatros D.I and D.II had squared timber seat supports on which adjustment rails rested. I believe this was markedly different from the metal rods found in the D.V. This was based on the relpacement parts illustrations as reprinted in the Datafile. It doesn't make a bit of difference what the modeler includes, as it is very difficult to see, but what information did you use to determine to make this switch? Am I understanding your modification correctly? Lance ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 09:53:12 +1100 From: "Ross & Wendy Moorhouse" To: Subject: Re: Fok E.III model added to site Message-ID: <003801c2c0d6$b6204e20$f5482dcb@future> Yep that's the name. Cheers Ross -----Original Message----- From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org] On Behalf Of Mike Muth Sent: Tuesday, 21 January 2003 7:20 AM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: [WWI] Re: Fok E.III model added to site Buddeke? Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: Ross & Wendy Moorhouse To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Monday, January 20, 2003 12:54 AM Subject: [WWI] Re: Fok E.III model added to site > Yes it's got the correct markings on it. ;-) Black on white squares. > Nice build too. If you do another one with the marking for sure you can > do it in a light grey as what's his face that is famous for flying this > plane for the Turks had a light grey one. > > Cheers > > Ross > > -----Original Message----- > From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org] On Behalf Of Mike > Muth > Sent: Monday, 20 January 2003 1:34 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: [WWI] Re: Fok E.III model added to site > > Sanjeev > Thanks. > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: ot811 > To: Multiple recipients of list > Sent: Sunday, January 19, 2003 5:47 PM > Subject: [WWI] Fok E.III model added to site > > > > Mike Muth sent in a Fok E.III in Turkish colours. > > See > > http://www.wwi-models.org/Images/Muth/Fokker/index.html > > or news. > > regards > > Sanjeev > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jan 2003 08:59:14 +1000 From: "Shane Weier" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: slightly off-topic but still very early aeroplane Message-ID: Mike, > >Good grief, I was forced to spend Monday *working* !!!! > > >Pity. Being twice retired, my heart bleeds for you. When gainfully >employed, I had much more time available for the requisite >recreation. >Now, SWMBO, and the other women in my extended family, firmly believe, "the >devil finds work for idle hands" and are always finding things for me to do LOL. The dreaded "honeydo" >Strangely, they don't seem to mind how much >time I spend at the computer. Being virtually computer illiterate, I >suppose they think I'm actually doing something meaningful. Heck, I'm virtually computer illiterate and I manage to get paid to sit at a computer screen in an IT department. Bosses are a bit like wives. Or is that a redundancy.... Shane ******************************** My Strine is a Toad in Disguise ******************************** _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 4933 **********************