WWI Digest 4853 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: What colour is this? by "Steven Perry" 2) What child is this? by Ken Schmitt 3) Re: Discovery Unsolved History - now Aerodrome version by Ray 4) Re: What colour is this? by "Ross & Wendy Moorhouse" 5) RE:New ezine by "Bob Pearson" 6) Environmental Technology Protecting Our Future by "Enstech Inc." 7) Re: Quiet today by Crawford Neil 8) Re: Discovery Unsolved History by "NEIL EDDY" 9) Re: What colour is this? by "NEIL EDDY" 10) Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. by "Ross & Wendy Moorhouse" 11) Re: Discovery Unsolved History - now Aerodrome version by "NEIL EDDY" 12) Future problems by "Michael Kendix" 13) RE: Future problems by "Harris, Mack" 14) Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. by "Grzegorz Mazurowski" 15) Peter Kempf's Armor Site by tbittners@sprintmail.com (Matt Bittner) 16) RE: Future problems by "Michael Kendix" 17) Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. by "Steven Perry" 18) re: Peter Kempf's Armor Site by "Grzegorz Mazurowski" 19) Re: Future problems by "Steven Perry" 20) Re: Future problems by Crawford Neil 21) Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. by "Lance Krieg" 22) Re: Who was Green tail? by "Diego Fernetti" 23) Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. by "Steven Perry" 24) Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. by "Lance Krieg" 25) RE:New ezine by "Diego Fernetti" 26) Re: Future problems by John Huggins ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 23:18:00 -0500 From: "Steven Perry" To: Subject: Re: What colour is this? Message-ID: <006201c2a7de$c8c49560$20244918@tampabay.rr.com> > I see I have brought the toad plague upon myself. I ask a very serious > question and I can't get an answer. Well not one that answers the > question. ;-) I have played the village idiot once to many times here. > ;-) > > Cheers > > Ross Moorhouse That's an interesting photo Ross. It raises a question that I have wondered about. How to tell which is mauve and which is green. I have heard "mauve" defined as a purple or violet all the way to a redish/purplish/brownish hue. Photographed on Ortho film a bluer "mauve" might render lighter than the green, while a more redish "mauve" might render darker. I heard from Bulient on the subject of Ottoman, (not Turkish when referring to pre 1918), AEG C.IVs. Bulient says that they were used in the colors they were in when received from the factory in Germany. The black square Ottoman markings were painted to exacty cover the German crosses. If the cross had a white outline, the square had one. Red squares were abandoned due to the red paint didn't cover the black crosses well and was scarce to boot. Another interesting note on Ottoman AEG C.IVs from Bulient. There was only one welding unit on the Palestine Front available for repairs to the steel tube structures. In spite of this they managed an outstanding record of keeping the machines in service up till the end. So to determine he colors of Ottoman C.IVs, it is necessary to know the serial, (they kept the factory applied ones), and then from that, where and when the machine was manufactured and hopefully from that what the colors were supposed to be. Does the datafile list the series and which contractor built which serials and when? And is there any info available on which colors were used on which series? sp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:28:48 -0600 From: Ken Schmitt To: Subject: What child is this? Message-ID: Mista Merrill hops out- > (although thankfully, in Minnesota this time > of year, any possible toads are frozen solid til spring.) Don't you be counting no toads 'fore they hatch, now. could get Biblical... -Qweeekstraw Ross, the *proper terminology* for your colour requisite are: Imperial German Toad Mauve Imperial German Toad Green Pedro well knows this and is being something of a scamp. Barry sells MistaToad® paints and these two are (thoughtfully) included in that superbly researched and executed product line. Speculation is that *this* is what irked the French, in particular, as they were experimenting with an aluminized-Toad Dope at the time. One brave hero was gunning for the Nom de Guerre "Toad Of Marseilles" until someone pointed him back toward the Marne where the war was (and the imported Toads were not). How it came to pass that someone thought to lick them (imported Toads) is a tale for another wintry day. Some think it relates to a shortage of water in the fortress at Verdun, but personally, I don't credit these provocateurs, various dramatists and other Discovery simulators. This, come to mention, is why Toads fit down chimneys on Christmas eve. FWIW, YTMV, IMTHO. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 22:26:22 -0800 From: Ray To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Discovery Unsolved History - now Aerodrome version Message-ID: <200212192226.22515.Ray_Boorman@telus.net> I just popped over to the aerodrome site to see what was being posted on MVR. Wow talk about some Vitriol being handed out. I dont look on there very often, is it always that ugly and heated over there.... http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/YaBB.cgi?board=aces&action=display&num=1039442080&start=75 Watch the wrap Ray ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 17:54:52 +1100 From: "Ross & Wendy Moorhouse" To: Subject: Re: What colour is this? Message-ID: <000c01c2a7f4$b58de7b0$f5482dcb@future> I don't have the data file. Dan-San on the Drome has listed some serials. I will have to go have a look at that. Ross Moorhouse Matrix Games Director of Game Development. www.matrixgames.com -----Original Message----- From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org] On Behalf Of Steven Perry Sent: Friday, 20 December 2002 3:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: [WWI] Re: What colour is this? > I see I have brought the toad plague upon myself. I ask a very serious > question and I can't get an answer. Well not one that answers the > question. ;-) I have played the village idiot once to many times here. > ;-) > > Cheers > > Ross Moorhouse That's an interesting photo Ross. It raises a question that I have wondered about. How to tell which is mauve and which is green. I have heard "mauve" defined as a purple or violet all the way to a redish/purplish/brownish hue. Photographed on Ortho film a bluer "mauve" might render lighter than the green, while a more redish "mauve" might render darker. I heard from Bulient on the subject of Ottoman, (not Turkish when referring to pre 1918), AEG C.IVs. Bulient says that they were used in the colors they were in when received from the factory in Germany. The black square Ottoman markings were painted to exacty cover the German crosses. If the cross had a white outline, the square had one. Red squares were abandoned due to the red paint didn't cover the black crosses well and was scarce to boot. Another interesting note on Ottoman AEG C.IVs from Bulient. There was only one welding unit on the Palestine Front available for repairs to the steel tube structures. In spite of this they managed an outstanding record of keeping the machines in service up till the end. So to determine he colors of Ottoman C.IVs, it is necessary to know the serial, (they kept the factory applied ones), and then from that, where and when the machine was manufactured and hopefully from that what the colors were supposed to be. Does the datafile list the series and which contractor built which serials and when? And is there any info available on which colors were used on which series? sp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2002 20:30:10 -0800 From: "Bob Pearson" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE:New ezine Message-ID: <104036799201@smtp-1.vancouver.ipapp.com> Hasn't it come to light that their D.VIII/E.V is actually a Pfalz D.VII or some such? Bob ---------- >From: Volker Haeusler >> > The photos actually show the Museo Caproni D VIII - note it's written > somewhere in the text. Note also the ot SM 79 somewhere in the background. > > BTW, the Museo Caproni is IMHO one of the most beautiful aircraft museums > one can imagine - beautiful location as well... > > Volker > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 01:32:25 -0600 From: "Enstech Inc." To: Subject: Environmental Technology Protecting Our Future Message-ID: <3DFACCCC002BF6C5@mta3.wss.scd.yahoo.com> (added by postmaster@mail.san.yahoo.com) Enstech Inc

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------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 08:52:34 +0100 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Re: Quiet today Message-ID: > Of the Day shift, Diego has transferred to Evenings and I've > been working away > this week, so poor old Neil's been left with Matt - at least > they haven't bored > us all with SPADs!! > Yes hard times indeed, I've even scraped the bottem and talked about albitri! /Neil C. (and I shouldn't have said it was cold here either, the weather flipped, and and we lost our lovely snow, so happy green christmas everybody!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 19:11:44 +1100 From: "NEIL EDDY" To: Subject: Re: Discovery Unsolved History Message-ID: <009201c2a7ff$6fa0bf60$a6fa32d2@default> All aboard the Rapide, Don Diego! Parker ----- Original Message ----- From: "D_Fernetti" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 12:02 PM Subject: [WWI] Re: Discovery Unsolved History > Ross wrote, > >Might sound harsh but > > that's what the airmen where there for. To kill each other. > > How shocking! I would never believe that of the fine young gentlemen, > knights of the skyes and all that, dear... > D. > Anybody has a bottle of decent port in this place? ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 19:16:29 +1100 From: "NEIL EDDY" To: Subject: Re: What colour is this? Message-ID: <00c501c2a800$19ab0560$a6fa32d2@default> Ross; German Topside Green and German Purple would be my guess. Green being the darker of the two colours in the photo as someone else said. I always thought the Toad Mauve was too pink.... All the Best Neil E (Tie me kangaroo (not an Elk)down....please) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ross & Wendy Moorhouse" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 12:45 PM Subject: [WWI] Re: What colour is this? > I see I have brought the toad plague upon myself. I ask a very serious > question and I can't get an answer. Well not one that answers the > question. ;-) I have played the village idiot once to many times here. > ;-) > > Cheers > > Ross Moorhouse > Matrix Games Director of Game Development. > www.matrixgames.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org] On Behalf Of Pedro > Soares > Sent: Friday, 20 December 2002 12:17 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: [WWI] Re: What colour is this? > > Ross, > > Toad brown or Mauve would be my guess, the other colour being Toad > green. > > Cheers > > Pedro > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Ross & Wendy Moorhouse > To: Multiple recipients of list > Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 10:49 PM > Subject: [WWI] What colour is this? > > > > > http://www.militarygameronline.com/CloseCombatFuture/ross'smodels/whatco > > lourAEG.gif watch the word wrap on the URL. > > > > My question is from the above pic, plus what colour would the colour I > > haven't pointed out been? > > > > Cheers > > > > Ross > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 19:21:26 +1100 From: "Ross & Wendy Moorhouse" To: Cc: "'Steven Perry'" Subject: Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. Message-ID: <000e01c2a800$cd7a83e0$f5482dcb@future> I had a look at that list of serials against planes you sent me the other day Steven, and there are no AEG's listed. Maybe Bulient could provide those? Cheers Ross -----Original Message----- From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org] On Behalf Of Steven Perry Sent: Friday, 20 December 2002 3:19 PM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: [WWI] Re: What colour is this? > I see I have brought the toad plague upon myself. I ask a very serious > question and I can't get an answer. Well not one that answers the > question. ;-) I have played the village idiot once to many times here. > ;-) > > Cheers > > Ross Moorhouse That's an interesting photo Ross. It raises a question that I have wondered about. How to tell which is mauve and which is green. I have heard "mauve" defined as a purple or violet all the way to a redish/purplish/brownish hue. Photographed on Ortho film a bluer "mauve" might render lighter than the green, while a more redish "mauve" might render darker. I heard from Bulient on the subject of Ottoman, (not Turkish when referring to pre 1918), AEG C.IVs. Bulient says that they were used in the colors they were in when received from the factory in Germany. The black square Ottoman markings were painted to exacty cover the German crosses. If the cross had a white outline, the square had one. Red squares were abandoned due to the red paint didn't cover the black crosses well and was scarce to boot. Another interesting note on Ottoman AEG C.IVs from Bulient. There was only one welding unit on the Palestine Front available for repairs to the steel tube structures. In spite of this they managed an outstanding record of keeping the machines in service up till the end. So to determine he colors of Ottoman C.IVs, it is necessary to know the serial, (they kept the factory applied ones), and then from that, where and when the machine was manufactured and hopefully from that what the colors were supposed to be. Does the datafile list the series and which contractor built which serials and when? And is there any info available on which colors were used on which series? sp ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 19:31:43 +1100 From: "NEIL EDDY" To: Subject: Re: Discovery Unsolved History - now Aerodrome version Message-ID: <00f201c2a802$3a55d5e0$a6fa32d2@default> Ahh, another day at the office at The Aerodrome... :-) arguing about suppositions is a very serious business.... All the Best Neil ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 5:49 PM Subject: [WWI] Re: Discovery Unsolved History - now Aerodrome version > I just popped over to the aerodrome site to see what was being posted on MVR. > Wow talk about some Vitriol being handed out. I dont look on there very > often, is it always that ugly and heated over there.... > > http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/YaBB.cgi?board=aces&action=display&num=103 9442080&start=75 > > Watch the wrap > > Ray ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 13:49:18 +0000 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Future problems Message-ID: Most of the time, I've had good experience with Future but must admit some frustration using it on my current project - on off-topic subject that is overall dark blue ("Say no more, nod's as good as a wink to a blind horse!") I simply was unable to get the stuff to work on the fairly smooth surface, trying to lay down a nice glossy finish for the decals. I tried putting a pool under the decals but then I'm using acrylics, so trying to wipe the excess Future away resulted in paint loss. I guess that some paints just don't like Future. I also tried spraying Future - that was horrendous! Beading globules of the wretched stuff. After intensive clean-up efforts and being reprimanded by my wife for being in the basement for 3 hours, I finally used Testors Clear Gloss. Several coats and a hairdryer implementation between each coat resulted in success and no silvering of the decals. Of course, by that time it was 12:30AM and I was probably half blind from fatigue, so maybe there was silvering. Michael _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 3 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail&xAPID=42&PS=47575&PI=7324&DI=7474&SU= http://www.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg&HL=1216hotmailtaglines_stopmorespam_3mf ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 07:52:37 -0600 From: "Harris, Mack" To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: Future problems Message-ID: Michael writes: I simply was unable to get the stuff to work on the fairly smooth surface, trying to lay down a nice glossy finish for the decals. I tried putting a pool under the decals but then I'm using acrylics, so trying to wipe the excess Future away resulted in paint loss. I guess that some paints just don't like Future. Michael, what brand of paint were you using? Mack ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 14:56:06 +0100 From: "Grzegorz Mazurowski" To: Subject: Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. Message-ID: <015f01c2a82f$8b6e8300$0200a8c0@grzesiek> Hi boys! There's a problem here. Even Ray Rimell doesn't know. Dan-San seems to know, but... I have the Datafile, and he gives only some suppositions, based on three contemporary capture reports, but only one of them is really about C.IV (brown and green), and two others about AEG J.I (dark green/dark purple and dark ruby 12E8 and dark grey brown 8F3). So everything is possible! Dave, there were no AH AEGs. For sure. About sub-contractors: only AEG and Fokker were building AEG C.IV. And Fokker built planes were streaked like Dr.I. I can send some scans. G. ***************r-e-k-l-a-m-a************** Masz dosc placenia prowizji bankowi ? mBank - zaloz konto http://epieniadze.onet.pl/mbank ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 07:46:16 -0600 (CST) From: tbittners@sprintmail.com (Matt Bittner) To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Peter Kempf's Armor Site Message-ID: <200212201346.gBKDkG712674@king1.kingsnake.com> For those who haven't visited Peter Kempfs WW1 armor site, you're missing a bunch. Lately Peter has been on an artillery kick, so there are plenty of big guns added to his site. Here's the URL, although it is available via the Links page: http://www.landships.freeservers.com/ Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 14:03:18 +0000 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Future problems Message-ID: >From: "Harris, Mack" >Michael, what brand of paint were you using? Testors acrylic or something like that. I've had success with Testors' paints before using Future on top of it. I know that different colour paints have different chemical compositions. The best thing was that the Testors Clear gloss really worked well, so I'll keep using that. Michael _________________________________________________________________ Add photos to your messages with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail&xAPID=42&PS=47575&PI=7324&DI=7474&SU= http://www.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg&HL=1216hotmailtaglines_addphotos_3mf ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:10:43 -0500 From: "Steven Perry" To: Subject: Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. Message-ID: <001501c2a831$95a3d080$20244918@tampabay.rr.com> > Hi boys! > There's a problem here. What? In WWI Aviation history? Unheard of, you gotta be kidding ;-) > > Even Ray Rimell doesn't know. > Dan-San seems to know, but... > > I have the Datafile, and he gives only some suppositions, based on three > contemporary capture reports, but only one of them is really about C.IV > (brown and green), and two others about AEG J.I (dark green/dark purple and > dark ruby 12E8 and dark grey brown 8F3). > So everything is possible! > Dave, there were no AH AEGs. For sure. > About sub-contractors: only AEG and Fokker were building AEG C.IV. And > Fokker built planes were streaked like Dr.I. Well that is an easy way to determine contractor. Looks like the Ottoman AEGs were AEG built. Dan-San says that around 7100 they lengthened the fuselage. There were designated AEG C.IV v.R. "verlangerter Rumpf", lengthened body. I'm not sure what fuselage length the CSM kit is based on. The Ottoman decals in the kit are for C.7122 which should be a long version if DSA is correct. DSA also says C.7123 was a pastel grayish green and grayish ruby 2 color scheme. I'd expect the same scheme for C.7122. Anyone have examples of these colors? Methuen #s? > I can send some scans. I'd sure like some. sp ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 15:17:11 +0100 From: "Grzegorz Mazurowski" To: Subject: re: Peter Kempf's Armor Site Message-ID: <01a101c2a832$7d5440e0$0200a8c0@grzesiek> > For those who haven't visited Peter Kempfs WW1 armor site, you're missing a > bunch. Lately Peter has been on an artillery kick, so there are plenty of > big guns added to his site. Not THAT big guns. I've got a few days ago a really big OT gun - Extratech (Czech resin) 1/72 Austro Hungarian 42cm Skoda M.17 Haubitze. Barrel is bigger than Dr.I fuselage! BTW, Peter's Website is excellent! G. > Here's the URL, although it is available via the Links page: > http://www.landships.freeservers.com/ > > > Matt Bittner > > ***************r-e-k-l-a-m-a************** Masz dosc placenia prowizji bankowi ? mBank - zaloz konto http://epieniadze.onet.pl/mbank ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 09:25:12 -0500 From: "Steven Perry" To: Subject: Re: Future problems Message-ID: <002101c2a833$9c471da0$20244918@tampabay.rr.com> > > I also tried spraying Future - that was horrendous! Beading globules of the > wretched stuff. Probably not enough air pressure. A damp rag will clean it off right away. Try experimenting with different pressures until you get the ideal fine mist. If it still beads because of the surface, wash it and then lightly rub the paint surface with a 4000 grit polishing pad. If after all else fails, I've had it happen more than once, and the Future still beads, then blast it just shy of making runs, connect the beaded globs and trust Future's leveling properties to do their thing. hth sp ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 15:33:27 +0100 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Re: Future problems Message-ID: I haven't managed to spray Future very well either, but I found that I don't need to, brushing on works just as well. /Neil C (surprised to see that you lot are still around, thought I'd got unsubbed, so I went over to the Aerodrome and read their flame war, guess everyone else was doing that too!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:11:44 -0600 From: "Lance Krieg" To: Subject: Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. Message-ID: Gents, the silence is so deafening I might have to do some work. I guess everyone is on holiday. The latest WWIAero has DS Abbott's pronouncements on the colors of AEG C.IVs, and comes with all the relevent Methuen codes; I assume that was what Steve Perry was talking about? If not, I can dig these up pretty easily. CSM's C.IV is the short-fuselaged version, IIRC, and so may not be right for some of the finishes. As for Ross' picture, I think that one got addressed, too, between the barrage of smart-assed comments? ;-) I guess everyone is a little bored... Lance ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 16:10:34 +0000 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Who was Green tail? Message-ID: Volker wrote: >The booklet I have in mind was one of the three in the Albatros "Aces & >Aeroplanes" (or so I think) series. The other two were on Voss and >Guynemer. Neat! I must look for these at the usual net bokstores. Too bad they haven't followed the series with more pilots. How sad is not to have a whole volume on the life and exploits of Karl Otto Titzlinger! D. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 11:18:56 -0500 From: "Steven Perry" To: Subject: Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. Message-ID: <005301c2a843$7f882820$20244918@tampabay.rr.com> > > The latest WWIAero has DS Abbott's pronouncements on the colors of AEG > C.IVs, and comes with all the relevent Methuen codes; I assume that was > what Steve Perry was talking about? If not, I can dig these up pretty > easily. I haven't seen that reference. I suppose I should subscribe. I'd sure like to see some methuen numbers that would put me in the range for mixing paint. > > CSM's C.IV is the short-fuselaged version, IIRC, and so may not be > right for some of the finishes. Hmmm. Anyone know where and how much the fuselages were lengthened? Thanks sp ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:34:12 -0600 From: "Lance Krieg" To: Subject: Re: Ottoman serials for AEGs.. Message-ID: The estimable sp would: "... like to see some methuen numbers that would put me in the range for mixing paint." And this I can provide; what serial ranges are you interested in? "Anyone know where and how much the fuselages were lengthened?" Yup, same reference, I have no doubt. I will research this over the weekend and let you know on Monday. Lance ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 16:34:15 +0000 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE:New ezine Message-ID: Mike! > Can someone tell me where this restoration is >taking place and the aircraft's precedents? I checked my copy of Ray >Rimell's "World War One Survivors" and no Fokker E.V is listed. He >lists one D.VIII, the fuselage and engine only, being in the Museo >Caproni in Italy. Of course, this book was copyrighted in 1990 so maybe >this is a more recent development? AFAIK it's the same. I've asked some friends in Italia about this and the restoration was unfortunately stopped at some point, for a variety of reasons. Hopefuly they will continue with it some day in the future. D. _________________________________________________________________ Protect your PC - get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 20 Dec 2002 10:38:15 -0600 From: John Huggins To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Future problems Message-ID: <6FCC06D8-1439-11D7-8C0F-0003934C8626@huggins-leahey.com> There are a couple of things going on here that are all probably related. 1st. The beading will happen if you are trying to spray Future on a gloss surface. The Future doesn't have any thing to grab hold of or bite on. The work around is either a light roughing up of the surface with 4000 grit paper as mentioned or to mist a tack coat on first. This just puts a very light layer of Future down. It will look kind of rough, but that is what you want. I usually start with a lower wing tip and work my way around the model ending up back on the original starting point. By this time, the tack coat has surface dried and I start the process over again with a wet coat. This covers completely. The Future by its own working properties will soften the lower coat and blend it all together and self level. 2nd, related to the first issue, If you are using a gloss paint, DO NOT put Future on top of it. For some reason, the paint and the Future expand and contract at different rates due to the current weather conditions (way too complicated to try and explain) and after two or three days you will start to see very fine cracks in the paint surface. These will continue to grow for a few days and you will end up with what looks like a spider web covering on the painted surface. I use Future over flat and semi gloss paints all the time, but never put it on top of a gloss color. This was all covered in n earlier issue of Fine Scale Modeler. JP ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 4853 **********************