WWI Digest 4224 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) MAC D.VII again by tbittners@sprintmail.com 2) R: Off topic computer question by a.casirati@cornali-trasporti.it 3) RE: MAC D.VII again by "Marcio Antonio Campos" 4) Viruses by "ZELNICK, KENNETH T" 5) HB-B.1 bites the dust by "Michael Kendix" 6) RE: HB-B.1 bites the dust by Crawford Neil 7) RE: HB-B.1 bites the dust by "Michael Kendix" 8) RE: MAC D.VII again by tbittners@sprintmail.com 9) Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? by "stefenk" 10) Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter "Comic" cowl colour? by "Michael Kendix" 11) RE: Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? by "Diego Fernetti" 12) Re: Off topic computer question by Fraser May 13) Re: roll French contest! by "Brent Theobald" 14) Weekly Online Contests by "Brent Theobald" 15) Albatros fuselages by "Hans Trauner" 16) temporary e-mail ? by Tom Plesha 17) virus by Jasta38DD@aol.com 18) RE: Colour of Fokker EV/DVIII Wings by "Hans Trauner" 19) Re: Awesome Nieuports at MM by REwing@aol.com 20) Re: Awesome Nieuports at MM by "mdf@mars.ark.com" 21) Re: Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? by "Hans Trauner" 22) Re: virus by "Lee M." 23) Re: Colour of Fokker EV/DVIII Wings by "mdf@mars.ark.com" 24) Where's Another Dave? by "David C. Fletcher" 25) RE: Colour of Fokker EV/DVIII Wings by "mdf@mars.ark.com" 26) Extra Cool News from Jager by Todd Hayes 27) RE: Extra Cool News from Jager by "Graham Hunter" 28) Fokker D VIII colours by "Hans Trauner" 29) RE: Extra Cool News from Jager by Todd Hayes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:33:37 -0500 (EST) From: tbittners@sprintmail.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: MAC D.VII again Message-ID: <20020228143337.6D41C4681D@eclipse.qis.net> After looking it over again, there is one saving grace for the MAC D.VII. The decals. MAC provides you with decals so you can build *any* of the Jasta 18 "Rabens". Including lozenge that is the best kit-supplied lozenge to date. Ah well... Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:29:11 +0100 From: a.casirati@cornali-trasporti.it To: Subject: R: Off topic computer question Message-ID: <43EB244779F3D411966E0060082C59E90F0583@SERVER1> Yes, Matt, such a software exists. It is generally called "OCR" and is usually sold together with a scanner... Ciao Alberto -----Messaggio originale----- Da: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org]Per conto di tbittners@sprintmail.com Inviato: giovedě 28 febbraio 2002 15.04 A: Multiple recipients of list Oggetto: [WWI] Off topic computer question Does anyone know if software exists that will "view" a graphic file, and move the "text" from the graphic into an actual text file? TIA! Matt Bittner --- [Questa mail e' stata controllata dai software antivirus e antispamming di Planet Service srl - www.planetservice.biz ] --- [Questa mail e' stata controllata dai software antivirus e antispamming di Planet Service srl - www.planetservice.biz ] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:20:08 -0300 From: "Marcio Antonio Campos" To: Subject: RE: MAC D.VII again Message-ID: <004101c1c06b$6adb11a0$5d1ba8c0@officesp.starmedia> > MAC provides you with decals so you can build *any* of the > Jasta 18 "Rabens". Aha! *This* is great for me!!! All the best from Brazil Marcio Antonio Campos Redator do GuiaSP StarMedia do Brasil +55 11 30436421 marcio.campos@starmedia.net http://www.guiasp.com.br http://www.guiarj.com.br http://www.nacidade.com.br ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 09:24:33 -0600 From: "ZELNICK, KENNETH T" To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Viruses Message-ID: <15888960D28CD211AD1900105A24907803EC95AD@ano-exs02.ano.entergy.com> Believe me Dave, if I get an e-mail from you entitled, "See me nude", I'll delete it no matter what. Fully clothed, Ken Zelnick ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:26:36 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: HB-B.1 bites the dust Message-ID: Probably due to my impatience and trying to rush (without any reason), I made too many mistakes on the RVHP Hanasa Brandenburg B.1 kit. Sure the kit has shortcomings but that didn't cause some of the fundamental errors on painting and detailing that I made. The kit is now history except for a few spare parts that might come in handy should I attempt one of the Hansa Brandenburg vacs I own. Too bad but I need to learn not to rush things. Michael _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 16:31:35 +0100 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: HB-B.1 bites the dust Message-ID: That's a pity, I thought that looked like it would be rather an attractive little trainer. How about building a Spad instead? ;-) /Neil C ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:36:42 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: HB-B.1 bites the dust Message-ID: >From: Crawford Neil > >That's a pity, I thought that looked like it would >be rather an attractive little trainer. >How about building a Spad instead? ;-) Neil: Actually, it's not that small an aeroplane. As for SPADs, I only have the Airfix SPAD VII kit, so forget it:)! Michael _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:37:36 -0500 (EST) From: tbittners@sprintmail.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: MAC D.VII again Message-ID: <20020228153736.C9432468C2@eclipse.qis.net> On Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:17:44 -0500 (EST), Marcio Antonio Campos wrote: >Aha! *This* is great for me!!! That's right! However, if you're looking at it just for the decals, be sure you track it down for less money than what it retails for here, in the US. Ah, we have to love Squadron, right? Right? I'm convinced... ;-) Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 10:35:56 -0500 From: "stefenk" To: "WWI Modeling List" Subject: Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? Message-ID: Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? Modern English and German apparently share "stropp" in their ancient kindred forebears of Old English and Anglo-Saxon, wherein "strope" and "stropp" referred to a strip (perhaps cognate) of cord or leather [perhaps with a specific sense of a piece used for hefting or binding that has been retained in nautical terminology, as in Hans' sense (a)]. Its (later?) extension of meaning to include a leather instrument used for honing of razors or tanning of backsides may account for the English and Rhenish colloquialisms of an abrasive (young) person (probably male) who would be the better for undergoing such discipline. The English "strapping" (young fellow) may be related. Strap (Strap) n. [OE. strope, AS. stropp, L. stroppus, struppus, perhaps fr. Gr. a band or cord, fr. to twist, to turn Cf. Strop a strap, a piece of rope.] 1. A long, narrow, pliable strip of leather, cloth, or the like; specifically, a strip of thick leather used in flogging. A lively cobbler that . . . had scarce passed a day without giving her [his wife] the discipline of the strap. Addison. 2. Something made of such a strip, or of a part of one, or a combination of two or more for a particular use; as, a boot strap, shawl strap, stirrup strap. 3. A piece of leather, or strip of wood covered with a suitable material, for sharpening a razor; a strop. 4. A narrow strip of anything, as of iron or brass. Specifically: — (a) (Carp. & Mach.) A band, plate, or loop of metal for clasping and holding timbers or parts of a machine. (b) (Naut.) A piece of rope or metal passing around a block and used for fastening it to anything. 5. (Bot.) (a) The flat part of the corolla in ligulate florets, as those of the white circle in the daisy. (b) The leaf, exclusive of its sheath, in some grasses. 6. A shoulder strap. See under Shoulder. Strap (Strap), v. t. [imp. & p. p. Strapped ; p. pr. & vb. n. Strapping.] 1. To beat or chastise with a strap. 2. To fasten or bind with a strap. Cowper. 3. To sharpen by rubbing on a strap, or strop; as, to strap a razor. Strop (Strop) n. [See Strap.] A strap; specifically, same as Strap, 3. Strop (Strop), v. t. [imp. & p. p. Stropped ; p. pr. & vb. n. Stropping.] To draw over, or rub upon, a strop with a view to sharpen; as, to strop a razor. Strop (Strop), n. [Cf. F. estrope, étrope, fr. L. struppus. See Strop a strap.] (Naut.) A piece of rope spliced into a circular wreath, and put round a block for hanging it. Strapping (Strap"ping) a. Tall; strong; lusty; large; as, a strapping fellow. [Colloq.] Strip (Strip) v. t. [imp. & p. p. Stripped ; p. pr. & vb. n. Stripping.] [OE. stripen, strepen, AS. strpan in bestrpan to plunder; akin to D. stroopen, MHG. stroufen, G. streifen.] 1. To deprive; to bereave; to make destitute; to plunder; especially, to deprive of a covering; to skin; to peel; as, to strip a man of his possession, his rights, his privileges, his reputation; to strip one of his clothes; to strip a beast of his skin; to strip a tree of its bark. Best wishes from New York, Stefen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:51:29 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter "Comic" cowl colour? Message-ID: The Toko kit for the Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter "Comic Nightfighter shows a blue cowl in the instructions. However, the Datafile profile has it in metal - the same as the rest of the forward fuselage. The picture in the Datafile is sort of mildly inconclusive - I suppose it colud be blue but who knows? Anyone have any other information on this cowl colour? Michael _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:52:48 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: RE: Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? Message-ID: <000f01c1c06f$f95e6360$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Wow Stef! Great post, and very educative! D. Now what can I concoct from these data?, ha ha ha ha! ----- Original Message ----- From: stefenk To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 12:42 PM Subject: [WWI] Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? > Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 17:09:00 +0100 From: Fraser May To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Off topic computer question Message-ID: <61UP3X1TTSB0TRVQ1Y32PNW64B7OLZT.3c7e561c@pc145681> >From what you say, I think Alberto's suggestion is about your best bet, assuming the text is reasonably contrasted with the image. Fraser ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 17:33:48 +0000 From: "Brent Theobald" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: roll French contest! Message-ID: Howdy! >How about a grand prize of a lot of French kits in the winner's desired >scale, I.E., in 1/48 you could choose from the Nieuport 11, 21 & 17 & the >Dragon SPAD 13, in 1/32 the Hobbycraft N.17 & SPAD 13, and in 1/72 Those are all good suggestions. I'm saving the email for future use. >So what are the rules of the contest? When will it be needed to submit >entrys? You have a long time, so there is no excuse for us all not to flood the contest with OT entries. Here is the link explaining everything. http://www.modelingmadness.com/contests/frcntst/frcontest.htm Later! Brent _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 16:53:16 +0000 From: "Brent Theobald" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Weekly Online Contests Message-ID: Howdy Gang, I hate to push my website over-much, but I thought ya'll might enjoy the surfing. I am hosting two online contests this week. One for armor and one for aircraft. There is nothing OT there yet (HINT). Sure, the prizes are ot, but you can use the value of the kit as store credit for something OT. The aircraft contest is here: http://www.rollmodels.net/contest/su22/su22.php The armor contest is here: http://www.rollmodels.net/contest/kubel/kubel.php I am accepting photo submissions thru tomorrow night and votes thru Sunday night. The offer is still open for a strictly WWI contest. Have fun! Brent _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 20:09:29 +0100 From: "Hans Trauner" To: Subject: Albatros fuselages Message-ID: <009001c1c08b$72a83d20$44a072d4@FRITZweb> > I was hoping one of our German contributors or list Historians would venture > along the lines of > "Because they liked it that way, that's why" > > which may be most accurate... > > Ken Belonging to category a) I would say: No. Unless I find out that the paintshop boss at Albatros was a guy named Ira I am convinced that the solution lays in the laquers. I really can't proof anything, but what I know is that shellac and copal laquer both give 'blond' wood a distinctive dark, reddish hue. And day for day it becomes darker and more reddish. Both laquer types are based on organic materials and both are bound to became rarer and rarer after 1916. Albatros fuselages were made from birch ply. Birch ply is still available today and is definetely 'blond'. Unless you use shellac or copal varnishes. There must be a change, otherwise the change in color can't be explained. And the old 'orthochrome' argument is rubbish. And as I don't believe that Albatros used mahagony in 1916 and changed to birch, I think they changed the varnish, maybe to one of the brand new cellulose varnishes or any other 'Ersatz'. Just my two Euro cents. Hans ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 11:16:24 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Plesha To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: temporary e-mail ? Message-ID: <20020228191624.65106.qmail@web20508.mail.yahoo.com> Hi All- Just a note to let you know I obtained a temporary? e-mail address with yahoo, comcast just does not work!!! For those interested my new e-mail is: plesha3@yahoo.com I also re-subscribed with the new yahoo address. I hope this note is in text!!!! Later Tom __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 14:26:40 EST From: Jasta38DD@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: virus Message-ID: <30.22e3f450.29afde70@aol.com> If you recognise "leif@swing.be" as part of your e-mail address you have the badtrans virus. Listees recieving mail from this address take extra care ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 20:34:33 +0100 From: "Hans Trauner" To: Subject: RE: Colour of Fokker EV/DVIII Wings Message-ID: <00ef01c1c08e$f3071060$44a072d4@FRITZweb> >Maybe the best to > clearify this is Hans, as DSA (I think in that Aerodrome thread) promised to > send him some photots to prove the theory. Not sure whether he did. Volker, you seems to have a memory like an elephant. You remember my 1981 sins in Modellmagazin and you remember my struggle with DSA. OK, here are the facts: DSA sent me a colored drawing made by himself which emphasized his theory, but proofed nothing. And he sent a xerox copy of a photo. On this xerox copy the 'streaked' look of some of the D VIII wings was highlighted due to this extreme contrast. But it simply shows the well known: No 'light' undersides, no color segments, not for the lower wing side, nore the upperside. There are versions of D VIII wings which are more streaked than others, but definetely no color segments!! For me the streaking is a weathering aspect. And to be honest. I could believe in a brown/green camo for the upper sides, but a segmented lower side camo of azure blue with light blue is highly unlikely. Hans ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 14:35:02 EST From: REwing@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Awesome Nieuports at MM Message-ID: <159.9be2bbe.29afe066@aol.com> Matt said, "I completely agree! The only "ugly" Nieuport I can think of is the Nieuport triplanes. Someone was smoking something when they came up with that design. ;-)" ROTFL!! I have always liked the Nieuport triplanes. They are really different and catch the eye. I wish someone would do a conversion set for the Eduard kits. It probably wouldn't be too difficult to scratch build, but I would rather take the lazy road. ~Rick~ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 14:45:54 -0500 From: "mdf@mars.ark.com" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Awesome Nieuports at MM Message-ID: <3C7E88F2.C2390B88@mars.ark.com> I think the only European country not to fly Nieuport Vee strutters was Spain... But they had a monoplane, and later had 29's and 52's. The Turks got their hands on at least one SPAD, probably after 1918. No A-H SPAD's as far as I know though I suspect almost as many countries got to try out the Fokker D.VII after the war. The Avro 504 also got used by a great many countries though I doubt it got much more than a few test flights while in German markings. Mike Fl. Matt Bittner wrote: > > On Thu, 28 Feb 2002 00:31:22 -0500 (EST), Rory Goodwin wrote: > > > Yes, but nearly every nation flew 'em... > > I can't think of any that did *not*. Germany? Yup. > Austro-Hungarian? At least to try them out. Turks? Now you > have me stumped. Not sure about that one. But all other > belligerants did. What other type of aircraft is that true of? > SPAD? No, I'm almost positive A-H didn't get their hands on any. > Probably the Turks, neither. > > A truly unique aircraft. > > Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 20:43:29 +0100 From: "Hans Trauner" To: Subject: Re: Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? Message-ID: <014701c1c090$327d9880$44a072d4@FRITZweb> Good point, Stefen! What I noticed also, is that the Cologne University translated Stropp as Schlingel ( =Rascal). And Schlingel has the same 'core' as Schlinge. And Schlinge is 'loop'. And a 'Stropp' as a knot is nothing else than a special loop. There seems to be a common root. Hans The Hobby Linguistic ----- Original Message ----- From: "stefenk" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 4:42 PM Subject: [WWI] Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? > Stropp, Strop, Strap, or What's in a Name? > > Modern English and German apparently share "stropp" in their ancient > kindred forebears of Old English and Anglo-Saxon, wherein "strope" and > "stropp" referred to a strip (perhaps cognate) of cord or leather [perhaps > with a specific sense of a piece used for hefting or binding that has been > retained in nautical terminology, as in Hans' sense (a)]. Its (later?) > extension of meaning to include a leather instrument used for honing of > razors or tanning of backsides may account for the English and Rhenish > colloquialisms of an abrasive (young) person (probably male) who would be > the better for undergoing such discipline. The English "strapping" (young > fellow) may be related. > > Strap > (Strap) n. [OE. strope, AS. stropp, L. stroppus, struppus, perhaps fr. Gr. > a band or cord, fr. to twist, to turn Cf. Strop a strap, a piece of rope.] > 1. A long, narrow, pliable strip of leather, cloth, or the like; > specifically, a strip of thick leather used in flogging. > A lively cobbler that . . . had scarce passed a day without giving her [his > wife] the discipline of the strap. > Addison. > > 2. Something made of such a strip, or of a part of one, or a combination of > two or more for a particular use; as, a boot strap, shawl strap, stirrup > strap. > 3. A piece of leather, or strip of wood covered with a suitable material, > for sharpening a razor; a strop. > 4. A narrow strip of anything, as of iron or brass. Specifically: - > (a) (Carp. & Mach.) A band, plate, or loop of metal for clasping and > holding timbers or parts of a machine. > (b) (Naut.) A piece of rope or metal passing around a block and used for > fastening it to anything. > 5. (Bot.) (a) The flat part of the corolla in ligulate florets, as those of > the white circle in the daisy. (b) The leaf, exclusive of its sheath, in > some grasses. > 6. A shoulder strap. See under Shoulder. > > Strap > (Strap), v. t. [imp. & p. p. Strapped ; p. pr. & vb. n. Strapping.] > 1. To beat or chastise with a strap. > 2. To fasten or bind with a strap. Cowper. > 3. To sharpen by rubbing on a strap, or strop; as, to strap a razor. > > Strop > (Strop) n. [See Strap.] A strap; specifically, same as Strap, 3. > > Strop > (Strop), v. t. [imp. & p. p. Stropped ; p. pr. & vb. n. Stropping.] To draw > over, or rub upon, a strop with a view to sharpen; as, to strop a razor. > > Strop > (Strop), n. [Cf. F. estrope, étrope, fr. L. struppus. See Strop a strap.] > (Naut.) A piece of rope spliced into a circular wreath, and put round a > block for hanging it. > > Strapping > (Strap"ping) a. Tall; strong; lusty; large; as, a strapping fellow. > [Colloq.] > > Strip > (Strip) v. t. [imp. & p. p. Stripped ; p. pr. & vb. n. Stripping.] [OE. > stripen, strepen, AS. strpan in bestrpan to plunder; akin to D. stroopen, > MHG. stroufen, G. streifen.] > 1. To deprive; to bereave; to make destitute; to plunder; especially, to > deprive of a covering; to skin; to peel; as, to strip a man of his > possession, his rights, his privileges, his reputation; to strip one of his > clothes; to strip a beast of his skin; to strip a tree of its bark. > > Best wishes from New York, > Stefen ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:58:44 -0600 From: "Lee M." To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: virus Message-ID: <3C7E8BF4.9C9D1419@x25.net> Please notice the Address below. It is not leif@swing.be When it was stolen by the virus it puts a _ ahead of the address right after the <_ ... I have it below as it really looks. It is harmless as it is shown. The virus was in the attachment not the address. "Liefferinckx Frederic" <_leif@swing.be> I copied this directly from the message and made a file of it. No virus here...ever.... If you try to use this address as a reply the e-mail will bounce and come right back to you as an undeliverable message. The virus also underlines the address so you do not notice the _ as it becomes part of the underline. This is one way to detect a problem message.... Delete any that come with a _ ahead of the actual address... Pay attention to the senders address, and, it can save you a lot off trouble. Lee M. New Braunfels, Tx Jasta38DD@aol.com wrote: > > If you recognise "leif@swing.be" as part of your e-mail address you have the > badtrans virus. Listees recieving mail from this address take extra care ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:05:46 -0500 From: "mdf@mars.ark.com" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Colour of Fokker EV/DVIII Wings Message-ID: <3C7E8D9A.99DB3465@mars.ark.com> If I was mixing olive, I'd skip the blue and the mauve. They are on the wrong side of the colour spectrum to turn green into olive. Olive is a yellow-green mixture and you're shifting it towards the blue-green end of the spectrum. Mixed in equal parts, the colour I get from these four is a dark bluish grey colour, though the effect of the light blue may be somewhat over-represented. Mike Fl. (results may vary) xtv16@dial.pipex.com wrote: > > Quoting James Fahey : > > > Greetings All > > I was dredging through the 2000 archives on the 'other' forum and found > > an > > interesting comment by Dan San Abbott regarding the correct colour > > scheme > > for the Fokker EV/DVIII wing: > > > > "A piece of information for the model builders. The upper plywood > > surface of > > the wing was stained with dark green and mocha brown and the under > > surfaces > > was stained sky blue and lilac after which it was clear lacquered. > > Interesting, yes, no? The Fokker Flugzeug Werke wing drawing lists these > > stains. They are listed in the Fokker D.VIII Datafile. It bugged me for > > a > > long time until I re-examined 3 photos of Vzfw. Karl Scharon's Fok.E.V > > 137/18 and the pattern is shown for both the top and bottom surfaces of > > the > > wing, brown, olive, brown, olive on the top and lilac, sky blue, lilac, > > sky > > blue. The lilac matches to the brown and the sky matches to the olive. > > After > > that discovery I went back and revisited all other E.V data. They were > > all > > done the same way, with variations in the pattern " > > > > I saw this and thought "Hmmmmmmm". If you mix those colours you get a > reasonable match for the accepted 'Olive-grey green'. My take was any > dirrerences in colour tone would be due to this being a stain, rather than a > paint. on a rough surface. Anyone who has 'stained' a raw finished fence or > shed will have seen how the 'paint' drags and makes streaky bands. Think about > how the streaky finish looked on Fokker linen, and apply the same method of > finish to plywood (Front to back in this case). > > Dave F ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:08:38 -0800 From: "David C. Fletcher" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Where's Another Dave? Message-ID: <00cd01c1c093$b629c200$af884318@cc.shawcable.net> Anybody on the list got an e-address for Dave Vosburgh, who has been unsubscribed for a while? Dave Fletcher ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:14:41 -0500 From: "mdf@mars.ark.com" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Colour of Fokker EV/DVIII Wings Message-ID: <3C7E8FB1.A6FA7B67@mars.ark.com> If they are stains - the wood would normally darken (would it not?), reducing much of the contrast the blue would have given. They could also have been sprayed, which would further reduce the contrast. I always thought the D.VIII was a strange bird - nearly every other German aircraft by that stage was carrying some sort of disruptive camouflage on the wings, but this machine gets olive green? The Polish used these after the war in overall green - do the same patterns show up on these machines? Also was there any intelligence reports on this machine that mentioned colours? Mike Fl. Hans Trauner wrote: > > >Maybe the best to > > clearify this is Hans, as DSA (I think in that Aerodrome thread) promised > to > > send him some photots to prove the theory. Not sure whether he did. > > Volker, you seems to have a memory like an elephant. You remember my 1981 > sins in Modellmagazin and you remember my struggle with DSA. > > OK, here are the facts: DSA sent me a colored drawing made by himself which > emphasized his theory, but proofed nothing. And he sent a xerox copy of a > photo. On this xerox copy the 'streaked' look of some of the D VIII wings > was highlighted due to this extreme contrast. But it simply shows the well > known: No 'light' undersides, no color segments, not for the lower wing > side, nore the upperside. > > There are versions of D VIII wings which are more streaked than others, but > definetely no color segments!! For me the streaking is a weathering aspect. > > And to be honest. I could believe in a brown/green camo for the upper sides, > but a segmented lower side camo of azure blue with light blue is highly > unlikely. > > Hans ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 12:50:39 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Extra Cool News from Jager Message-ID: <20020228205039.27387.qmail@web11102.mail.yahoo.com> Hi all, The Jager site has some welcome news for Fokker D.VII fans. One of Justin's next releases is a Fokker D.VII (OAW). Specifically Rudolf Stark's machine. Todd __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 15:02:21 -0600 From: "Graham Hunter" To: Subject: RE: Extra Cool News from Jager Message-ID: <000801c1c09b$38b16be0$770101c0@ghunter> is that 48th scale???!!?? Graham < To: Subject: Fokker D VIII colours Message-ID: <004501c1c09b$7419db40$62ab72d4@FRITZweb> Mike, home brewed re-mixes with Humbrol or Tamiya won't work. Directly copied from the Datafile: E.V paint schedule ( from Factory Drg. No 33050) Item no item 43 12,5 kg Oil enamel ( prime quality) 41 8 kg 'Crown' ( brand name) priming varnish 47 1 kg Ersatz turpentine ( notice by me: that's simple white spirit) 48 400 gr Signature black 49 500 gr Covering white ( for the crosses) 50 20 gr Mocha Brown ( Wood Stain) 51 20 gr Azure Blue 52 20 gr Azine (brand name) violet 53 20 gr New True Green Regrettably I don't have the text in untranslated german. To re-translate it is senseless. This listing was part of the 'Stückliste' for a set of wings. i.s. these are the parts necessary to complete a wing. The black and white listings are paints, as the weights are relative high. And this paint is more than enough not to paint the crosses only to the wings, but also the complete national insignia of the whole bird. The Brown to Green colors are pigments. Pigments are of light weight, and small amounts may cover a surprisingly large area. And there are *no* special pigments for staining! Staining depends on the bonding agent of the paint and the solvent! A lot of solvent and a tiny small part of bonding agent makes the stain, not a special pigment. And Brown plus Green plus Blue makes a perfect dark olive. But the violet makes no sense. At the first glance. Remember that pigment resource problems were a main reason to change to lozenge printed fabric. ( And in WWII to change to those mythical late RLM colors). Maybe the violet was taken to reach 80 gr pigment, no other reason. I will contact a professional paint developer/engineer. My friend Jürgen Kiroff is a complete paint maker wiz, who re-developed the complete RLM paints. The Me 110 in the Berlin Museum is painted with his products. Maybe he knows more than all of us. Hans ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2002 9:02 PM Subject: [WWI] Re: Colour of Fokker EV/DVIII Wings > If I was mixing olive, I'd skip the blue and the mauve. They are on > the wrong side of the colour spectrum to turn green into olive. > Olive is a yellow-green mixture and you're shifting it towards the > blue-green end of the spectrum. > > Mixed in equal parts, the colour I get from these four is a dark bluish > grey colour, though the effect of the light blue may be somewhat > over-represented. > > Mike Fl. > (results may vary) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2002 13:38:37 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Extra Cool News from Jager Message-ID: <20020228213837.53748.qmail@web11101.mail.yahoo.com> Oh yeah! --- Graham Hunter wrote: > is that 48th scale???!!?? > Graham > > < D.VII > D.VII > <(OAW). Specifically Rudolf Stark's machine. > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - Send FREE e-cards for every occasion! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 4224 **********************