WWI Digest 4104 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Speaking of Pfalzes A real surpise in a package by "Graham Hunter" 2) Revell SE5 and D VII -shivering again...- by "Hans Trauner" 3) Welcome back by "ZELNICK, KENNETH T" 4) Re: New 1/72 Fokker DVII Kit by "Brent Theobald" 5) Re: back with news by "Diego Fernetti" 6) Re: goodies in the mail by "Diego Fernetti" 7) Re: control surface positioning by "Diego Fernetti" 8) Re: Revell SE5 and D VII -shivering again...- by KnnthS@aol.com 9) Re: New 1/72 Fokker DVII Kit by "ibs4421" 10) Re: goodies in the mail by "ibs4421" 11) =?big5?Q?=B1z=B1I=B9=E6=B5L=B2=E1=B6=DC=3F?= by LOVE.CLUB 12) MMaster Sand for CDL? by "robert owens" 13) Is the List Down? by Todd Hayes 14) Group Order Details by Todd Hayes 15) Re: Is the List Down? by Allan Wright 16) dazed and confused; was quick Hanriot 5 color camo question by Myles Miller 17) big stuff by "Michael Kendix" 18) RE: back with news by "Marcio Antonio Campos" 19) I'm outta here... by "Lance Krieg" 20) Hobbycraft Fokker Dr.1 by "Fraser" 21) RE: dazed and confused; was quick Hanriot 5 color camo question by "Tomasz Gronczewski" 22) RE: back with news by "Gaston Graf" 23) RE: dazed and confused; was ...etc., 5-color camo by "Mark Shannon" 24) Re: back with news by xtv16@dial.pipex.com 25) Laser toner cartridges save up to 40% from retail price by 26) message to marcio by "Gaston Graf" 27) Re: Hobbycraft Fokker Dr.1 Problems by "robert owens" 28) Re: Hobbycraft kits by "snbpink" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 11:28:58 -0600 From: "Graham Hunter" To: Subject: RE: Speaking of Pfalzes A real surpise in a package Message-ID: <000101c1a4fc$9bb181e0$770101c0@ghunter> Volker wrote; < To: Subject: Revell SE5 and D VII -shivering again...- Message-ID: <004b01c1a4fd$5b44c800$62ab72d4@FRITZweb> Listees, I have just got the reply from Revell and it does not sound good: Guten Morgen Herr Trauner, vielen Dank für Ihre Mail. Bedingt durch die freien Tagen zum Jahresende und - anfang sowie die Messevorbereitungen kommen wir erst heute dazu Ihnen zu antworten. Sie liegen richtig mit der Annahme, daß die Fokker D VII sowie die S.E. 5 aus Monogram-Formen stammen. MfG S. Haller Good Morning, Herr Trauner, many thanks for your mail. Due to the holidays at the years's end and -beginnung and due to the preparations for the Toy Fair we were not able to answer earlier. You are right with your assumption that the Fokker D VII and the S.E.5 are coming from the Monogram-moulds. Yours S.Haller In my opinion they don't know what they are doing... Volker has figured it out. The measurements which are published on their website matches perfectly the DML/Dragon kit. Hans ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 11:36:54 -0600 From: "ZELNICK, KENNETH T" To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Welcome back Message-ID: <15888960D28CD211AD1900105A24907803EC955C@ano-exs02.ano.entergy.com> Welcome back, Gaston. Old Vietnamese proverb: Roll your tongue three times before you speak. ;) Ken Zelnick ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:38:24 +0000 From: "Brent Theobald" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: New 1/72 Fokker DVII Kit Message-ID: Howdy gang! I just called SMO and this kit does exist and is available. Unlike certain other kits (kit of the year no less!) Anyhow, they declined letting me have a review sample so I'll have to purchase one from my local plastic pusher tomorrow. I'll let you know how it looks. I'm curious about the lozenge in the kit. After the "halloweeny" looking stuff from Roden I'm ready for some better kit supplied lozenge. Later! Brent _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:48:25 +0000 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: back with news Message-ID: Welcome back Gasterix! I'm very glad to have around again. And you carry excellent news as well! I may reduce the scans of the money on your website to the proper scale and put them in the glove compartment of the Albatros D.II, just in case that the pilot wants to get a can of Coke between sorties... D. _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:57:44 +0000 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: goodies in the mail Message-ID: Thanks a lot for the pointers, Matt! > Both, unfortunately, have very small cockpit openings (although the >Rosemont is a better start, in that regard). The Luedemann being the >smaller of the two. > Well, I guess I find a method to fix that, as I've been working by the swimming pool with a luedemann resin trying to remedy that... More news a few days later, I hope to get the fuselage tamed before returning to work next week. >If money is no object, then from what I can tell from scans, it appears >that the Choroszy Nieuports will be the better bet. I'm not too enthusiastic on having too many different copies of the same subject, unless Eduard would come up with a brand new Nieuport 24 bis in 1/72 (yeah, right!) D. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 18:00:15 +0000 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: control surface positioning Message-ID: Alvie! Please don't feel offended, I was just making a bad joke... D. who's the only local glider pilot credited on gliding downwards while turning into a thermal of 4m/s! >From: "Michael and Sharon Alvarado, NSWCC" >Reply-To: wwi@wwi-models.org >To: Multiple recipients of list >Subject: [WWI] Re: control surface positioning >Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 17:26:53 -0500 (EST) > >Diego, > >My flying career started in sailplanes, Scweitzer 2-22, 2-32, 1-26 and >Libelle >301. > >Alvie > >Diego Fernetti wrote: > > > Alvie wrote: > > >This is true. The rudder on my C152 was next to useless. The plane >could > > >very > > > > well be flown with the feet planted firmly on the floor. > > > > These cessna pilots are all a bunch of slackers. Get a glider and try >the > > same stunt. You'll loose a few meters on each turn. > > psst! > > D. > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. > > http://www.hotmail.com > _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 13:07:24 EST From: KnnthS@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Revell SE5 and D VII -shivering again...- Message-ID: <116.b1e027d.2981a75c@aol.com> Hans writes: << In my opinion they don't know what they are doing... >> Mein Gott thanks Hans- Ken ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 12:16:14 -0600 From: "ibs4421" To: Subject: Re: New 1/72 Fokker DVII Kit Message-ID: <001501c1a503$36535380$313dfad1@dwfjv01> I'm thinking of putting this kit on my birthday list. I got one each of the Phonix D.I and D.II a while back. They are nice looking kits. That was why I asked about their Pfalz. I had seen a couple of the Mac Pfalz D.III/IIIa reviews, but not on the Roden. I've got two or three of the Meikraft Pfalz D.III kits that John sent me. He had them lying around, out fo the box, and not decals. I was thinking of using whatever comes, decal-wise, with either the Mac of Roden kits to build them, IF I get to feeling adventurous. Warren ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 12:18:26 -0600 From: "ibs4421" To: Subject: Re: goodies in the mail Message-ID: <001d01c1a503$84c3e480$313dfad1@dwfjv01> as I've been working by the > swimming pool with a luedemann resin trying to remedy that Does anybody in the Northern Hemisphere feel any sympathy for this man?? :) Have a cool one for me Amigo. I trust the lovely and talented Wanda is pool-side as well? Warren ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 13:27:42 -0500 (EST) From: LOVE.CLUB To: Love, finder Subject: =?big5?Q?=B1z=B1I=B9=E6=B5L=B2=E1=B6=DC=3F?= Message-ID: ±z±I¹æµL²á¶Ü? ±z¬O¤£¬O¨S¦³¶É¶Dªº¹ï¶H©O ? ±q²{¦b°_±z¦A¤]¤£¥Î­±¹ï¦Û¤v¨ºªÅªÅ¿º¿ºªº¤ßÆF¤F ! §i¶D±z¤@­Ó±H±¡ªº¼ö½u ¼·¤@³q¹q¸Ü´N¥i¥HÅý±z³qÅéµÎºZ®@!!! ´NÅý§Ú¬°±z±Æ¼~¸Ñ´e ^_^ 90060-578-677 ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 12:35:42 -0600 From: "robert owens" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: MMaster Sand for CDL? Message-ID: Recently heard Model Master Sand was a good representation of Clear Doped Linen. Problem is which one? (my local hobby shop has 3-4 MM "Sand" Also would it be near correct for French CDL?? heard that was a "browner" shade, due to some additive to the dope. Thanks, Rob Owens _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 11:22:57 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Is the List Down? Message-ID: <20020124192257.89111.qmail@web11102.mail.yahoo.com> Is the list down? Todd __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 11:23:51 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Group Order Details Message-ID: <20020124192351.6372.qmail@web11104.mail.yahoo.com> For all interested parties, Looks like a Hobbyshop.cz moment to me! We'll do an order and see how it works out. Please decide what you want by February 4, '02 and let me know. Anything goes except 'made to order' items. Checks or MO should be made out to: Betty Hayes My address is: Todd Hayes 2910 Market Burlington, IA. 52601 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:25:32 -0500 (EST) From: Allan Wright To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Is the List Down? Message-ID: <200201241925.OAA67288@mustang.sr.unh.edu> Nope > > Is the list down? > > Todd > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! > http://auctions.yahoo.com > =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | Without love life's just a long fight - Southside University of New Hampshire +-------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@wwi-models.org Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://www.wwi-models.org =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 13:30:58 -0800 From: Myles Miller To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: dazed and confused; was quick Hanriot 5 color camo question Message-ID: <4.1.20020124111332.009ea3b0@pop.thc.state.tx.us> Hello First of all, I wish to thank everyone who responded to my question both on- and off-list. Witold was also kind enough to send me a scan of Ian Stair's datafile profile. Tomasz and Alvie make strong and convincing arguments that black was not part of the 5 color camo pattern applied to the fuselage. This seems appropriate considering all the Spads and Breguets with 5 color camo - none of which to my (still very limited) knowledge have black applied the forward fuselage or any portion of the fuselage. As noted by Andreas, the datafile profile I'm looking over (thanks to Witold) almost exactly matches the Eduard painting instructions. Both show bands of black color across the cowling and fuselage sides around the cockpit. However, the datafile illustration includes the following qualifying statement: "The scheme illustrated is based mainly on tonal values of available photographs. The division of Black and Chestnut Brown areas around cockpit is not confirmed by any documentary evidence but is believed to be authentic." It is interesting to note in the datafile profile and Eduard instructions that the demarcation point between the chestnut and black does not follow an irregular, wavy or curved line as is typical for all other boundaries between camo colors. Instead, the two colors separate along a straight line that follows the panel lines below and to the rear of the cockpit. Perhaps this indicates the difference in tonal values between the aluminized and non-aluminized chestnut brown paints applied to fabric and metal surfaces, instead of different black and chestnut camo bands? I'd be interested in the opinions of the listmembers on this. Finally, Alberto informs us: "..... as for the Hanriot Datafile, please note that a completely new edition of it, by Gregory Alegi, is due out soon...." OK, so how long do I have to wait until I can finish painting? :) Many thanks again to everyone, Myles ******************************************************************** >From: "Tomasz Gronczewski" >AFAIR Eduard scheme is very inaccurate. It assumes that the pattern on >the fuselage was mirrored. It is all-wrong. Also, one of the rules of >French 5-color scheme was that there were NO black areas on metal >surfaces. Black was used ONLY on fabric surfaces and had NO aluminum >powder added. AFAIK in the case of Hanriots black was present on the >port lower wing and as a "footstep" on the upper wing only. >Tomasz >From: "Michael and Sharon Alvarado, NSWCC" >If i remember correctly, there is no black on the fuselage of a Hanriot in 5 >color camo. The fuselage colors shoud be Chestnut (dark brown), dark green, >light green and beige, under suface either "ecru" or aluminized dope. In the >french 5 color system each airframe component upper wing, port lower wing, >starboard lower wing, fuselage, stabilizer/elevators, fin used four of the five >colors. Each component used a different combination of the five colors four at >a time (stabilizer/elevators only three colors. This does not include the >under surface colors which were either "ecru" or aluminum dope. >HTH >Alvie >From: a.r.martin@t-online.de (Rita) >The Windsock Datafile (No. 12) shows the usual 5 color camo for the Hanriot. >Black is here also used for the fuselage, round the cockpit. >Andreas ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 20:12:44 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: big stuff Message-ID: Tired of labouring away in that teeny-weeny 1/32nd (toe) scales? Try a "real man's" size - a one-fifth scale Phönix D.III flying model. See: http://www.gsilink.com/user/florian/phoeman.pdf Michael _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:04:45 -0300 From: "Marcio Antonio Campos" To: Subject: RE: back with news Message-ID: <001701c1a51c$67c47480$5d1ba8c0@officesp.starmedia> Gaston, It's wonderful to have you back! And, about your website, well... I'm ashamed to say that some Brazilian hacker groups are among the top 10 in the world :-( but, no matter how much programming they know, their language skills are awful - even in Portuguese. Sorry anyway, friend. All the best from Brazil Marcio Antonio Campos Redator do GuiaSP StarMedia do Brasil +55 11 30436421 marcio.campos@starmedia.net http://www.guiasp.com.br http://www.guiarj.com.br http://www.nacidade.com.br ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:42:51 -0600 From: "Lance Krieg" To: Subject: I'm outta here... Message-ID: Diego is rubbing it in: "...I've been working by the swimming pool with a luedemann resin..." Since I'm stuck in the cold anyway, I'm heading for Salt Lake to try out the downhill before the rest of the world shows up. I believe I have discharged all promises before leaving; if not, I'll catch up on my return in a week or so. Since I'm going skiing, "Hals und beinbruch!" is NOT an appropriate sendoff. Anything OT in or around that corner of Utah? Hobby shops? TIA Lance ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 21:43:51 +0100 From: "Fraser" To: Subject: Hobbycraft Fokker Dr.1 Message-ID: <001e01c1a518$09fc1c80$5c6814d4@fraserinprague> Hi, Yes I'm in the middle of subduing an irascible Hobbycraft Camel. Lots of ejector marks but we'll get there...eventually, I completely redid the turtle deck as, according to my photos, its a facet short... bit of scored 5thou copper sheet. Regards Fraser in digested mode, so slow on the uptake... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 22:16:05 +0100 From: "Tomasz Gronczewski" To: Subject: RE: dazed and confused; was quick Hanriot 5 color camo question Message-ID: > Perhaps this indicates the difference in tonal values between the > aluminized and non-aluminized chestnut brown paints applied > to fabric and > metal surfaces, instead of different black and chestnut camo bands? Myles, this is the same conclusion that I had taken before I started my Hanriot. Most French scouts had dark noses, but one side was painted chestnut brown while opposite olive green. Also, now I tink that standard Hanriot scheme might have had black patch on the vertical stabilizer, but the latter was usually obscured by flamboyant Belgian markings. Tomasz ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 22:20:09 +0100 From: "Gaston Graf" To: Subject: RE: back with news Message-ID: Hi Marcio, thanks for the warm welcome. I have other news for you. Albeit the hacker attack was annoying, it did no harm to my site other than overwriting and deleting two pages that could be restored from backup indeed. But way more annoying is the behaviour of the US Chess Federation. I had ordered that magnetic fridge chess board - remember? It got delivered to me today. Yesterday I had already received my latest statements of my bank accounts. I was very surprized to see they have charged my VISA card with 40.- US$ for that game that in fact costs 15(!). Today I checked the voucher and found that the game was 15 $ and 14 $ was added for shipping. Well, albeit shipping was expensive too, this does not make 40 bucks yet, but only 29 in total so I wonder where the additional 11 bucks went. I was sending a mail to US Chess Federation to complain about the topic and when they will not response I will sure see to report it to US Police or FBI or whatever organisation is accepting such complains. And one thing is sure too - I will post a message at my website to inform my visitors about the fraud committed by that organisation. It's not that 11 bucks will make me a poor guy, but I hate it to be cheated. all the best Gaston > -----Original Message----- > From: wwi@wwi-models.org [mailto:wwi@wwi-models.org]On Behalf Of Marcio > Antonio Campos > Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 9:15 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: [WWI] RE: back with news > > > Gaston, > > It's wonderful to have you back! > > And, about your website, well... I'm ashamed to say that some Brazilian > hacker groups are among the top 10 in the world :-( but, no > matter how much > programming they know, their language skills are awful - even in > Portuguese. > > Sorry anyway, friend. > > All the best from Brazil > > Marcio Antonio Campos > Redator do GuiaSP > StarMedia do Brasil > +55 11 30436421 > marcio.campos@starmedia.net > http://www.guiasp.com.br > http://www.guiarj.com.br > http://www.nacidade.com.br > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:37:37 -0600 From: "Mark Shannon" To: Subject: RE: dazed and confused; was ...etc., 5-color camo Message-ID: Tomasz and Myles pondered: >> Perhaps this indicates the difference in tonal values between the >> aluminized and non-aluminized chestnut brown paints applied >> to fabric and >> metal surfaces, instead of different black and chestnut camo bands? >Myles, this is the same conclusion that I had taken before I started >my Hanriot. Most French scouts had dark noses, but one side was >painted chestnut brown while opposite olive green. > >Tomasz I have used the paint mixtures that were published by Neil Robinson in SM back in the early 80's. (Please see my Spad XIIIC.1 on the website gallery) As originally formulated, the Chestnut Brown for the fabric was a rustier color than the metal formulation, which was fairly dark. Similarly, the way the Dark Green worked also made the fabric lighter than the metal part color. These formulations are reproduced on the website, but the fabric Chestnut color there has black added, the same as the metal. I chickened out when using these for the Spad, and only used a 1 part aluminum/silver to 4 parts other paints in my formulations (when I painted test cards, the published ratios gave rather 'Christmas-y' lame effect of metallized fabric, in my eyes). The Beige came out a bit of a bile green, even so. In the flesh, so to speak, the aluminization in these appears as a haze effect that dulls the color, relative to the metal-use formula. There is no 'glitter' effect. Anyway, I'm planning to play with these a bit when I get to my Hanriot and the Glencoe Nieuport 28 on my to-do pile. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 21:48:49 +0000 From: xtv16@dial.pipex.com To: Subject: Re: back with news Message-ID: <1011908929.3c5081412ffdd@netmail.pipex.net> Quoting Gaston Graf : > Dear list, > > after a while of abstinence I decided to resub to the list again. But > first > of all I would like to apologize to the British list members regarding > my > stupid remarks about the Queen that I made. Donno what devil was riding > me > back to the time of puberty again as this happened. I later felt so > ashamed > that I decided to leave the list for good. But some of you asked me to > come > back and now I have some news for you that might be of interest. > Welcome back, apology accepted, no problems. Dave ------------------------------ Date: Mié, 23 Ene 2002 17:28:45 From: To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Laser toner cartridges save up to 40% from retail price Message-ID: <824.591867.71304@cable.net.co> Please forward to the person responsible for purchasing your laser printer supplies. GT toner supplies To order by phone please call 770-623-9780 order by email: gts@cable.net.co email removal: gts@cable.net.co with subject: remove Laser printer toner cartridges, copier and fax cartridges save up 40% from retail price. University and/or school purchase orders welcome. (no credit approval required) Pay by check, c.o.d, or purchase order (net 30 days). 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If you are ordering by e-mail or c.o.d. please fill out an order form with the following information: phone number company name first and last name street address city, state zip code If you are ordering by purchase order please fill out an order form with the following information: purchase order number phone number company or school name shipping address and billing address city, state zip code All trade marks and brand names listed above are property of the respective holders and used for descriptive purposes only. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 24 Feb 2002 23:36:52 +0100 From: "Gaston Graf" To: Subject: message to marcio Message-ID: sorry for doing the mistake to send a message to the list that was intended to go off list to marcio gaston ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:57:00 -0600 From: "robert owens" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Hobbycraft Fokker Dr.1 Problems Message-ID: Ejector pin marks on DR.1 mostly confined to 4-5 inside each fuselage half, would need filling if you're going to scratch interior, anyway. Be advised though, that moulding (ribs, steel structure showing thru fabric, etc.)is not as crisp as original Revell, or newer R/Germany. Bout the only advantage of HC is two late-style ailerons. R/G has molded Lowenhardt's A/C with early/port-late/starboard styles. Rob Owens _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 18:26:43 -0500 From: "snbpink" To: Subject: Re: Hobbycraft kits Message-ID: <00da01c1a52e$989a1d00$4164ea3f@computer> Yes Ken, There are ejectors marks and practically every piece in the kit. If it were not for all the marks I think this would be a nice kit to build. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "ZELNICK, KENNETH T" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 10:36 AM Subject: [WWI] Hobbycraft kits > Chris, > > I can't speak about either the DR1 or the Camel, but I'm working on a SPAD > XIII right now, and it doesn't have any of the circular marks to which you > refer. In my opinion, it is molded quite well. I have some scans of the > parts still on the sprue at home. If you like I can send them to you this > evening. > > Are you referring to ejector pin marks, or something else? > > Regards, > > Ken Zelnick > ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 4104 **********************