WWI Digest 3958 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Cost of moulds and production by KnnthS@aol.com 2) RE: Cost of moulds and production by KnnthS@aol.com 3) 1/48 DH4/9 series by "Charlie and Linda Duckworth" 4) Re: Merlin by David Fleming 5) RE: Cost of moulds and production by David Fleming 6) RE: Cost of moulds and production by Shane Weier 7) RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series by Shane Weier 8) eBay alert by Charles Hart 9) quick ot question "golden age" by "Paul" 10) RE: Cost of moulds and production by "Matt Bittner" 11) RE: Cost of moulds and production by Shane Weier 12) PointCook Farma was [Re: Volkers Downunder Adventure] by "cameron rile" 13) RE: Cost of moulds and production by "cameron rile" 14) RE: Cost of moulds and production by Rory Goodwin 15) RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series by Todd Hayes 16) RE: Cost of moulds and production by "Ross Moorhouse" 17) RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series by Shane Weier 18) RE: Cost of moulds and production by Shane Weier 19) RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series by KnnthS@aol.com 20) ÁãÊÛµê×ÊÁÏ by 888@888.888 21) RE: Cost of moulds and production by "Grzegorz Mazurowski" 22) RE: Cost of moulds and production by "Lee M." ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 18:47:43 EST From: KnnthS@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <50.30cab77.2944009f@aol.com> In a message dated 8/12/01 3:22:48 pm, sdw@qld.mim.com.au writes: << I imagine that pattern making is done by independant people paid as contractors, not by an internal staff, since the scale of Eduard operations doesn't appear to me large enough to support a very large work force of the Tamiya / Hasegawa type. That means that to some extent, they can commission a particular subject, but only if someone out there is keen enough to make a pattern of that subject to their standards. >> OK: there's Part Deux... do you mind? what can you or the rest of the list school us on what goes into making said "keen enough"??? 'What Goes Into Making The Original From Which All Blessing Flow"? tia Ken ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 18:52:45 EST From: KnnthS@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: In a message dated 8/12/01 3:22:48 pm, sdw@qld.mim.com.au writes: << FWIW for all the badmouthing that Eduard gets for th equality of their earlier kits, >> Have learned to not mind cutting the FlashBack.....Have finished a number of the early kits to sit right next to my DML efforts....good knife, light, patience and a few beer breaks and it's carved out of the rock next to the Trilobytes.....in every Flashback kit there is a wonderful archeological dig waiting to see sunlight! = ) Ken ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 17:58:00 -0600 From: "Charlie and Linda Duckworth" To: "wwi-faq" Subject: 1/48 DH4/9 series Message-ID: <001301c18044$2d5d3860$3132b9cc@unionrai> (Me, I'm wondering where my fantasised Eduard DH-4/9a series got to....) Shane I thought I read a few months ago from Sandy that Aeroclub was going to at least do the DH4 and DH9 not sure the DH9a was on the list. Ever since buying John Acorn's 'Scratchbuilt' book this is another British 'must have' a/c. I'm into the last of the rigging on the Gavia Bristol Scout.........now I remember why I went strickly 1/48, so many wires and so little space to tie knots. Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 00:22:44 +0000 From: David Fleming To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Merlin Message-ID: <3C12AED4.6967E544@dial.pipex.com> Tony Mollica wrote: > I too have built a Merlin model. It was the Hawker Woodcock and it must have > been a decade ago. It scarred me for life, I haven't touched a 1/72 model > since. Actually one of Merlin's better kits. You should see the Swift !! DAF ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 00:28:00 +0000 From: David Fleming To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <3C12B010.CBFDF25B@dial.pipex.com> Shane Weier wrote: > Cam asks: > > > Out of interest, and since this list has > > industry movers and shakers as well, what is > > the general cost of moulds for an injection or > > resin model in 1:72 or 1:48? W > A mould for a traditional mainstream injection kits will cost anything from > $50k to $250k depending on the complexity, the type and where it's made. IIRC, the cost for something like an Airfix kit is in the order of £1000 per part on the final model. D ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 10:44:44 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C7102BCD8A3@MIMHEXCH1> Ken says: > .....in every Flashback kit there is a wonderful > archeological dig waiting to see sunlight! Yes, even the ones which aren't Eduard originals. The first Eduard I built was the DFW Floh. I had a ball. So long as you take a few extra minutes to clean up the not very extensive flash, and *don't* assume that the dimples marked for the wing attachments etc. are actually precisely located, there's an excellent model to be had Out of the Box. I think that the scariest thing about the early Eduard is the extensive brass, and as I prefer not to use most of it anyway - Evergreen strip, styrene sheet and brass rod was put on Earth for the express purpose of making WW1 aircraft innards - the bits you *do* use aren't too big a problem. Given the willingness to treat the models as starting points not shake'n'bakes there's a champion model in every box. (thinks expressly og Graham Steels nice Morane on the list server) Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 International ++61 7 38338042 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 10:48:20 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C7102BCD8A4@MIMHEXCH1> Charlie says: > >> (Me, I'm wondering where my fantasised Eduard DH-4/9a series got >> to....) > > I thought I read a few months ago from Sandy that Aeroclub > was going to at > least do the DH4 and DH9 not sure the DH9a was on the list. Correct, and I'll be buying one of each. One. They'll cost twice what Eduards would (in Australia anyway) but be damned nice as the Harry Tate, Fee and BE's prove. In this case I was just maundering a little about how unfair life is to we fans of the unsung two seater....from whatever country. Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 International ++61 7 38338042 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 18:16:20 -0700 From: Charles Hart To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: eBay alert Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20011208181620.00a0ba80@spot.colorado.edu> Greetings All, http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1674709753 I think this would be very popular among members of this list. Charles Hart ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 22:21:03 -0600 From: "Paul" To: "WW I Post" Subject: quick ot question "golden age" Message-ID: <000b01c18068$eb7ee2c0$149d8ece@computer> Does anyone know where I can locate detail photos of the Travel Air Mystery ship or other Thompson Trophy racers. I'm pretty new to working on that era, and only have one or two refs. Paul H OT blurb: Got one of the Hobbycraft SPAD 13s this week. Haven't had a chance to compare it to photos or drawings, but it is very nicely molded. Numerous delicate parts and trailing edges are really pretty good. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 22:19:50 -0800 From: "Matt Bittner" To: "wwi@wwi-models.org" Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: On Sat, 8 Dec 2001 19:46:09 -0500 (EST), Shane Weier wrote: > > .....in every Flashback kit there is a wonderful > > archeological dig waiting to see sunlight! > > Yes, even the ones which aren't Eduard originals. Not true! The True Scale 1 1/2 Strutter was a very nice kit to put together. Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 15:02:45 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C7102BCD8A9@MIMHEXCH1> Matt > > Yes, even the ones which aren't Eduard originals. > > Not true! The True Scale 1 1/2 Strutter was a very nice kit to put > together. Granted. I was actually intending to mean that the Flashback kits would all produce excellent results, including the Strutter and Aviatik, rather than accuse them of being flashridden. Clumsy wording. Shane > ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 International ++61 7 38338042 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 101 00:19:08 -0400 From: "cameron rile" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: PointCook Farma was [Re: Volkers Downunder Adventure] Message-ID: Volker, >I took the Farman at Point Cook for a real >one, not a replica from; http://www.australianflyingcorps.org/mkiii/afc_gallery_2001_raafmuseum_farman.htm "The RAAF Museum  at Point Cook, Victoria has on display one of the few remaining Australian Flying Corps aircraft. The Maurice Farman Shorthorn carried the serial, CFS 15 throughout it's career at Point Cook from 1916 to 1919. In 1919, Mr R.G. Carey of Port Melbourne purchased CFS-15 for use in advertising, joyflights and barnstorming, now registered as G-AUBC. Carey flew the aircraft until the 1930's, after which it was stored. By the 1980's, the aircraft had virtually disappeared, and in 1981, Carey's daughter donated the remaining components to the RAAF Museum. After the completion of the Demon project in 1986, the Museum began the restoration of CFS-15 for display. Containing approximately 30% original parts, and fitted with a 75hp Wolseley-Renault engine, CFS-15 was put on display in 1997." One of the other Point Cook Farmans from the AFC is in the Ottawa Air Museum. The Hawker Demon on display at the Point Cook Museum is stunning too, surprisingly bigger than I thought, but what a beautiful aircraft.............. cam www.australianflyingcorps.org ______________________________________________________________ Get Your Free E-mail at http://www.prontomail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 101 00:29:12 -0400 From: "cameron rile" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: Thanks for the detailed reply Shane. >A mould for a traditional mainstream injection >kits will cost anything from $50k to $250k >depending on the complexity, the type and >where it's made. AUD or USD? What is the master mould material, and how are moulds made from it for the injection moulding process? Are the resin and vacuform master moulds made out of differant material to the injection master mould? >A *lot* of the "where it's made" factor >has been removed these days How are the masters shaped? How do they make them? Sorry for allthe questions, but it is like a city kid discovering milk comes from cows on farms. cam www.australianflyingcorps.org ______________________________________________________________ Get Your Free E-mail at http://www.prontomail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 08 Dec 2001 21:41:33 -0800 From: Rory Goodwin To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <3C12F98C.A8FE4269@earthlink.net> That's reassuring. I plan to someday build that Hannover, and Eduard really tried hard to make up for lack of small injected parts with too many brass components which would be glaringly conspicuous without their scale thickness (such as the intake manifold). Shane Weier wrote: > > I think that the scariest thing about the early Eduard is the extensive > brass, and as I prefer not to use most of it anyway - Evergreen strip, > styrene sheet and brass rod was put on Earth for the express purpose of > making WW1 aircraft innards - the bits you *do* use aren't too big a > problem. Given the willingness to treat the models as starting points not > shake'n'bakes there's a champion model in every box. > > (thinks expressly og Graham Steels nice Morane on the list server) > > Shane > > ********************************************************************** > The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is > intended only for the use of the addressee(s). > If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or > copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to > forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the > MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. > > e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au > phone: Australia 1800500646 > International ++61 7 38338042 > ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 8 Dec 2001 21:39:11 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series Message-ID: <20011209053911.62121.qmail@web11101.mail.yahoo.com> Charlie and Shane, I think it's a DH5 instead of a DH4. Todd --- Shane Weier wrote: > Charlie says: > > > > > >> (Me, I'm wondering where my fantasised Eduard > DH-4/9a series got > >> to....) > > > > > I thought I read a few months ago from Sandy that > Aeroclub > > was going to at > > least do the DH4 and DH9 not sure the DH9a was on > the list. > > Correct, and I'll be buying one of each. One. > They'll cost twice what > Eduards would (in Australia anyway) but be damned > nice as the Harry Tate, > Fee and BE's prove. > > In this case I was just maundering a little about > how unfair life is to we > fans of the unsung two seater....from whatever > country. > > Shane > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ********************************************************************** > The information contained in this e-mail is > confidential and is > intended only for the use of the addressee(s). > If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, > distribution or > copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are > requested to > forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to > the > MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. > > e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au > phone: Australia 1800500646 > International ++61 7 38338042 > ********************************************************************** > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Send your FREE holiday greetings online! http://greetings.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 16:39:57 +1100 From: "Ross Moorhouse" To: Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <004501c18073$f144d920$f90ececb@umber> Corgi are making diecast aircraft. According to the article on this in "Aeroplane, August 2001" issue, it costs them 30,000 to 35,000 pounds for the tooling of each aircraft they do. Cheers Ross ----- Original Message ----- From: "cameron rile" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Sunday, December 09, 2001 4:34 PM Subject: [WWI] RE: Cost of moulds and production | Thanks for the detailed reply Shane. | | >A mould for a traditional mainstream injection | >kits will cost anything from $50k to $250k | >depending on the complexity, the type and | >where it's made. | | AUD or USD? What is the master mould material, | and how are moulds made from it for the | injection moulding process? | | Are the resin and vacuform master moulds made | out of differant material to the injection | master mould? | | >A *lot* of the "where it's made" factor | >has been removed these days | | How are the masters shaped? How do they make | them? | | Sorry for allthe questions, but it is like a | city kid discovering milk comes from cows on | farms. | | | cam | www.australianflyingcorps.org | | | | | | ______________________________________________________________ | Get Your Free E-mail at http://www.prontomail.com | ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 16:36:08 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C7102BCD8AA@MIMHEXCH1> Todd suggests: > > I think it's a DH5 instead of a DH4. > Close. I think it's intended to be both, though I don't recall which order. Shane (I'll have a DH-5 for 2AFC too) > ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 International ++61 7 38338042 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 16:48:04 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C7102BCD8AB@MIMHEXCH1> Cam asks: > >A mould for a traditional mainstream injection > >kits will cost anything from $50k to $250k > >depending on the complexity, the type and > >where it's made. > > AUD or USD? What is the master mould material, > and how are moulds made from it for the > injection moulding process? I was thinking US$ > Are the resin and vacuform master moulds made > out of differant material to the injection > master mould? The *moulds* for resin and vacforms are usually made of RTV (room temperature vulcanising) hard synthetic rubber. Injection moulds are made of anything from stainless steel to copper - varying hardnesses and grades designed for different purposes and with different lifetime before wear is too bad. Of course, harder materials last longer, generally allow sharper and finer detail *but* because they're so hard cost more to cut. > > >A *lot* of the "where it's made" factor > >has been removed these days > > How are the masters shaped? How do they make > them? Buggered if I know. Traditionally a master craftsman pattern make set to with a block of wood and whittled. To some degree that still happens, except wood has been replaced by grain free synthetic material designed for the purpose. Masters are usually made to 2x or larger and pantographed down by toolmakers who produce and polish the mould and *then* add fine detail to the cavity. Numerical operated machines (computer driven metal cutting tools) are becoming more prevalent, but AFAIK they're still too expensive and limited for our purposes - for one thing, they're really meant to reproduce an item many times after a machinist programs them once, and programming them just once to cut a complex model shape isn't cheap. The moulds are cut by all manner of techniques - milling, spark erosion, blasting, you name it. > Sorry for allthe questions, but it is like a > city kid discovering milk comes from cows on > farms. I'm an electrical engineer, not really too knowledgeable about this in detail - just what I know from visiting colleagues from my Uni days. I fear that there may be stuff I'm leaving out, but sure that others will take it up Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 International ++61 7 38338042 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 01:52:19 EST From: KnnthS@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: 1/48 DH4/9 series Message-ID: <4c.311087b.29446423@aol.com> In a message dated 8/12/01 4:50:54 pm, sdw@qld.mim.com.au writes: << t be damned nice as the Harry Tate, Fee and BE's prove. >> my sentiments on all, eggzactly! ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 14:44:03 From: 888@888.888 To: wwi@mustang.sr.unh.edu Subject: ÁãÊÛµê×ÊÁÏ Message-ID: <200112090658.BAA74474@mustang.sr.unh.edu> ÄúºÃ£¡ ÏÖÓµÓб±¾©¡¢Ìì½ò¡¢ÉϺ£¡¢ÄϾ©¡¢ÎÞÎý¡¢¼ÃÄÏ¡¢Ê¯¼Òׯ¡¢Î人µÈһЩֱϽÊС¢Ê¡»á¼¶³ÇÊм°Ò»Ð© ¶þ¼¶³ÇÊеÄʳÔÓµê×ÊÁÏ¡£ÕâЩ×ÊÁÏÊÇ2001ÄêµÄ×ÊÁÏ¡£¿ÉÒÔÏëÏó£¬Èç¹ûÒ»¸öÆóÒµÏëÊÕ¼¯ÕâЩ×ÊÁÏ£¬³É±¾ ¾ø¶Ô²»ÊÇÒ»¸öСÊýÄ¿¡£ ÎÒÌṩµÄ×ÊÁÏÊÇÓг¥Ìṩ£¬Ã¿Ò»Ìõ¼´Ã¿Ò»¸öʳÔÓµêµÄ×ÊÁϼ۸ñÔ¼ÔÚ0.6Ôª¡£ÒÔÏÂΪÑù±¾¸ñʽ£º ³ÇÊÐ Çø µêÃû µêÖ÷ÐÕÃû ÓÊͨµØÖ· ÓÊ±à µç»° ÉϺ£ ¾²°²Çø á¯á¯ÔÓ»õµê ·ë½ð¿µ ɽº£¹Ø·305ºÅ 200040 62153352 ÉϺ£ ¾²°²Çø ÐË°²ÔÓµê ¸ð »ÆÚéÄÏ·284ºÅ 200040 63732502 ÉϺ£ Õ¢±±Çø ±ãÃñÔÓ»õµê Áõ ÅíÆÖдåÈýȪ·946 200072 56435817 ÉϺ£ ºç¿ÚÇø Íò¼ÒÀûСÉÌµê ¹ÜÕÑ·ï Á¹³Ç·585Ū29ºÅ 200434 65267489 ÉϺ£ ºç¿ÚÇø ΰΰÔÓ»õµê Íõºìæ· ¹ãÔÁ·577ºÅ/1ºÅ 200434 65280526 ÉϺ£ ºç¿ÚÇø пµÔÓ»õµê ÀîÊõΰ ¹ãÔÁ·575ºÅ£¨¼×£© 200434 65282555 ÉϺ£ ºç¿ÚÇø ÓÀÐËÑÌÔÓµê ¶­º£ÔÆ ¿üɽ·790Ū6ºÅ 200434 65291257 ÉϺ£ ºç¿ÚÇø ÎÞÃûÔÓ»õµê ÌƹðÉú Á¹³Ç·847ŪÒÒ 200434 65291551 ¶àÂòÓÐÓŻݡ£ ÈçÓÐÒ⹺Âò£¬Çë»ØµØÖ·£ºmtrl@163.net ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2001 10:17:04 +0100 From: "Grzegorz Mazurowski" To: Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <005101c18092$47e2a1e0$0200a8c0@x.pl> Hi! In addition to what Shane wrote, I can add following: > Are the resin and vacuform master moulds made > out of differant material to the injection > master mould? In Poland moulds for vacuforms are made in resin, simply masters are glued to flat sheet of Polystyrene or metal, and sunk in resin. It creates 'female' mould, in which are drilled many holes in order to remove air in process of vacuforming. Forms for resins are made in silicone resins. And, surprisingly or not, good resins are vacuformed too! That means that air from the mould is removed before resin is put into it, in order to keep air bubbles out and secure good flow of resin into smallest details. > How are the masters shaped? How do they make > them? Masters for resins are made very simple: scratch - scratch - scratch in Polystyrene. I have seen making of the master for one Japanese ot plane, which was later reviewed in IM. > Sorry for all the questions That statements always makes ma angry! Man - thanks to your questions our list is alive and interesting, unlike many other lists, where there are 3 or 4 posts weekly!!! Warmest greetings! Grzegorz -- Tego nie znajdziesz w zadnym sklepie! [ http://oferty.onet.pl ] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Dec 2001 07:15:41 -0600 From: "Lee M." To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Cost of moulds and production Message-ID: <3C1363FD.50F8FDDC@x25.net> Shane and Cameron et al. The costs are more than $100,000 in the U.S.and in U.S. Dollars. Originally the master was made of wood like Mahagany and Oak, carved and finished oversize like two or three X. A very large pantograph was connect to trace over the large steel block with tools installed to grind away the surplus metal. As I recall the virtually "dug" out a rough shape with heavy duty cutters taking care to not make the steel mould get heated to much. Then they went to the down sizing Pantograph with single cutters installed and started doing the more precise cutting as it followed the surface of the master. Now much of the work can be done by computer driven tools with a number of cutters that can be selected to do certain or specific jobs. Final work is still, as far as I know, hand work done by well paid machinists.. By hand work, I mean, the Machinist sets the tool to what it is expected to do and he/she monitors the action very closely. Final polishing is done by hand and they shine almost like a mirror. The nice engraved details on the surface of the model must be a raised line on the mould. I have no idea about how that is accomplished. It may be carved "proud" in there or perhaps a thin grove is made in the mold and a proper width of metal is inserted into the fine slot. If the mould is heated and the thin metal is taken to a large minus (-) temperature condition it can be placed into the mould. When the mould cools down it will be "virtually" a part of the original metal. In use the mould is called a DIE and it is heated a little bit. Then cooled slightly after the very hot plastic is injected. The ejectors, those little round monsters, pop-up, as the mould separates from the injection position downward or upward. ( I can not remember which goes to the top and which goes to the bottom.. There are two moulds, mated, one has the exterior detail and the other the interior. I seem to remember the interior was the bottom die.) it goes in the upper or lower position The plastic flips free of the mould, because the ends of the ejectors stick out of the bottom of the die. Something, I do forget, moves the plastic sprue over to the side onto a moving belt and away it goes to packaging. Forgive me for a certain memory lapse. The last time I was in the AMT plant at Mount Clemens, Michigan was in the mid 1950s. This model car company also made the tail-light lenses for the 1956 Ford. They did other full size car products as well. I took my 5 year old, (Then. 50 now.), son to see how they made the car models and they were doing both the day we visited. I am certain a lot of improvements have been made and certain moulds can have removable parts so it is possible to make variations of the same basic product. But this is the way things were 45 years ago. Lee M. Shane Weier wrote: > Cam asks about moulds and cost. > How are the masters shaped? How do they make > them? Buggered if I know. Traditionally a master craftsman pattern make set to with a block of wood and whittled. To some degree that still happens, except wood has been replaced by grain free synthetic material designed for the purpose. Masters are usually made to 2x or larger and pantographed down by toolmakers who produce and polish the mould and *then* add fine detail to the cavity. Numerical operated machines (computer driven metal cutting tools) are becoming more prevalent, but AFAIK they're still too expensive and limited for our purposes - for one thing, they're really meant to reproduce an item many times after a machinist programs them once, and programming them just once to cut a complex model shape isn't cheap. The moulds are cut by all manner of techniques - milling, spark erosion, blasting, you name it. ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 3958 **********************