WWI Digest 3850 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: interior lozenge for D.VIII? by VMA324Vagabonds@aol.com 2) Re: Pegasus Poll by Shane Weier 3) Re: Part PE by Todd Hayes 4) Master CLub Wheels/Pt.2 by Todd Hayes 5) Re: Pegasus Poll by VMA324Vagabonds@aol.com 6) Re: Pegasus Poll by Rory Goodwin 7) Re: Pegasus Poll by Shane Weier 8) Re: Ehmar WWI Armor Kits by Shane & Lorna Jenkins 9) RE: Thinning Acrylics by "fraser" 10) Re: Pegasus Poll by "fraser" 11) ADV: How good are your IT skills? by Skillometer_beta@vsnl.net 12) Re: I'm back and still getting it wrong by Crawford Neil 13) RE: Thinning Acrylics by Nigel Cheffers-Heard 14) RE: Thinning Acrylics by Nigel Cheffers-Heard ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 23:48:42 EST From: VMA324Vagabonds@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: interior lozenge for D.VIII? Message-ID: --part1_c1.16171735.290f8b2a_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/29/2001 9:52:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, haeusler@tm.net.my writes: > I have done for a number of years interior lozenge *in paper form*. > > I scanned the lozenge I liked best (that was usually the Pegasus one, but I > recently also did my own 5 color version based on the Silberstreif colors), > then used a graphics program (originally the one coming with the scanner, > but more recently Photoshop) to mirror the image, adapted the colors (for > some faded look) and printed the resulting image with a standard inkjet or > laser printer Great Idea Volker, thanks for sharing this one with us, I'm going to try it out this weekend coming. Best regards, Jon --part1_c1.16171735.290f8b2a_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/29/2001 9:52:38 AM Eastern Standard Time, haeusler@tm.net.my writes:


I have done for a number of years interior lozenge *in paper form*.

I scanned the lozenge I liked best (that was usually the Pegasus one, but I
recently also did my own 5 color version based on the Silberstreif colors),
then used a graphics program (originally the one coming with the scanner,
but more recently Photoshop) to mirror the image, adapted the colors (for
some faded look) and printed the resulting image with a standard inkjet or
laser printer


Great Idea Volker, thanks for sharing this one with us, I'm going to try it out this weekend coming.
Best regards,
Jon
--part1_c1.16171735.290f8b2a_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 14:45:34 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Re: Pegasus Poll Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C7102BCD6C4@mimhexch1.mim.com.au> Hi Jon > In 1/72nd scale we need > > 1) De Bruyere C.1 > 2) SPAD VII > 3) 'Dorand' A.R.1 I'm curious to know whether you told Chris Gannon this, or just us? (Ditto the others who've posted wishes without saying specifically that "this was what I asked Pegasus/BM/SC for") Curious because I know how easy it is to fall into the back end of a thread and not realise that there was some other point to the thread which has been lost over several days! Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 International ++61 7 38338042 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 20:57:48 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Part PE Message-ID: <20011030045748.885.qmail@web11106.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Tom, Are the turnbuckles multipiece? And do you need the patience of Job to use them? Todd S.E. IA. --- Tom Plesha wrote: > Hi All- > FWIW > Finally got my Part PE control horns, turnbuckles, > etc. in 1/48. Look > pretty nice to me. > Later > Tom > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 21:22:03 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Master CLub Wheels/Pt.2 Message-ID: <20011030052203.78769.qmail@web11102.mail.yahoo.com> Hi All, I'm only doing one order for the Master Club wheels. If anyone wants in after I learn the price, no problem. For those who don't want to go through me, I'll supply an e-mail address on request and off-list. Todd __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 00:24:27 EST From: VMA324Vagabonds@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Pegasus Poll Message-ID: <73.15322339.290f938b@aol.com> --part1_73.15322339.290f938b_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/29/2001 11:53:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, sdw@qld.mim.com.au writes: > Hi Jon > > > In 1/72nd scale we need > > > > 1) De Bruyere C.1 > > 2) SPAD VII > > 3) 'Dorand' A.R.1 > > I'm curious to know whether you told Chris Gannon this, or just us? > > DUH!!! You got me Shane, I should have sent Chris a copy also. Must be all the neat books I got today, WS Gotha special, WS DH.2, WS BE2c and yes drum roll please....................................British Aeroplanes 1914-1918, by J.M. Bruce. What a nice book, now I can get to work on that DH.2 of mine. Best regards, Jon --part1_73.15322339.290f938b_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/29/2001 11:53:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, sdw@qld.mim.com.au writes:


Hi Jon

> In 1/72nd scale we need
>
> 1) De Bruyere C.1
> 2) SPAD VII
> 3) 'Dorand' A.R.1

I'm curious to know whether you told Chris Gannon this, or just us?

DUH!!! You got me Shane, I should have sent Chris a copy also. Must be all the neat books I got today, WS Gotha special, WS DH.2, WS BE2c and yes drum roll please....................................British Aeroplanes 1914-1918, by J.M. Bruce. What a nice book, now I can get to work on that DH.2 of mine.


Best regards,
Jon
--part1_73.15322339.290f938b_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Oct 2001 21:40:25 -0800 From: Rory Goodwin To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Pegasus Poll Message-ID: <3BDE3D49.59EB0214@earthlink.net> Alas, this is the seemingly eternal bane/Catch-22 of 1/48 WWI ac models. If a company risks producing an interesting, decent (injection-molded) non-fighter kit, it will almost certainly be in limited quantities and therefore priced beyond the reach of all but hardcore enthusiasts, ensuring that not many are sold, the price isn't likely to ever come down much and thus it won't become widely known or popular with the ot philistines (no matter how important the ac was), and so is even less likely to become a subject issued by mainstream comp[anies. My disproportionate dabbling in Bittner scale is due in large part to simple economics; by the time I've payed for the 'necessary' references I don't have 30-50 USD left over for a single-engine fighter kit. I would consider this price range steep in any case, which is rather frustrating as rigging in 1/72 is one of my least favorite modelling 'challenges', DURAS proving impractical in may cases. Kicking my soapbox into the gutter and ducking into a used book store... Todd Hayes wrote: > ... If some manufacturer does them in 1:48, > and providing you don't need to mortage your home to > pay for it, I think these a/c would sell fairly well... > > Todd > > --- David Layton wrote: > > I did suggest the 'Dorand' A.R.1 (Matt, note the ' ' > > around Dorand.) > > > > I think there is room for more Caudrons, Voisins and > > Farmans. Especially in > > 1/48. I would also think that a MF 11 bis with the > > clam shell front would > > be nice! > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: "Multiple recipients of list" > > > > Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2001 9:05 PM > > Subject: [WWI] Re: Pegasus Poll > > > > > > > > > > Hi All; > > > > > > My votes were for a Junkers CL-1 in Blue Max and > > for a DH-9 in Pegasus. > > For > > > Silver Cloud I asked for a (ot alert!) Hawker > > D___n. > > > > > > Popular manufacturers have certainly made more > > German over the years but > > > where does the demand come from? In relation to > > why German sells better > > > than Allied, I wonder if this ties in with the > > somewhat more sympathetic > > > and detailed press Jasta's have got over the years > > rather than Squadrons > > > and Spas. This is changing I believe with the > > Windsock 'Squadron' series > > > (lets hope they'll do the same thing for the > > Storks and other French > > units) > > > and the Grubb Street books in the specialist > > fields. The popular media has > > > tended to portray the RFC/RAF as heroic, hapless > > victims often, and Jasta > > > pilots as dashing, more skilled, more chivalrous > > in their brightly > > coloured > > > planes reminiscent of the knights of old. The > > French, apart from Guynemer, > > > Nungessor and the Lafayette (read US) get little > > mention in any capacity. > > > Russia, Austria-Hungary, and Italy (outside of > > their own countries) often > > > don't even rate a mention. Australian pilots known > > in their own country? > > > Many more know the Red Baron than Robert Little. > > > > > > Link this in with the colour argument and I > > believe you may be heading > > > towards an answer. > > > > > > All the Best > > > Neil E > > > > > > > > > But this is a prob with the model producers. > > German stuff sells well. Its > > > what they make their money on. Just look at the > > amount of WWII German > > > armour > > > and figure kits are out there. They have just as > > much colour as WWI German > > > planes do. And this sells. I too wish we had more > > WWI Allied aircraft. > > > > > > Ross > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ > > _____ > > > NOTICE: This communication is confidential. If you > > are not the intended > > recipient of this communication please delete and > > destroy all copies > > immediately. If you are the intended recipient of > > this communication, you > > should not copy, disclose or distribute this > > communication without the > > authority of the Department of Human Services. > > > > > > Any views expressed in this communication are > > those of the individual > > sender, except where the sender specifically states > > them to be the views of > > the Department. > > > > > > Except as required by law, the Department does not > > represent, warrant > > and/or guarantee that the integrity of this > > communication has been > > maintained nor that the communication is free of > > errors, virus, interception > > or interference. > > > > > > If you have received this email in error or have > > other concerns regarding > > this transmission, please contact the Department of > > Human Services System > > Administrator at Postmaster@dhs.vic.gov.au > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ > > _____ > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. > http://personals.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 15:48:50 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Re: Pegasus Poll Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C7102BCD6C5@mimhexch1.mim.com.au> Jon says: > DUH!!! You got me Shane, I should have sent Chris a copy > also. Must be all > the neat books I got today, WS Gotha special, WS DH.2, WS > BE2c and yes drum > roll please....................................British > Aeroplanes 1914-1918, > by J.M. Bruce. What a nice book, now I can get to work on > that DH.2 of mine. Enjoy your treasures. I have the others but the Bruce 14-18 volume would be nice to own Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 International ++61 7 38338042 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 17:15:06 +1100 From: Shane & Lorna Jenkins To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Ehmar WWI Armor Kits Message-ID: <3BDE456A.25B4C2CD@tac.com.au> "David R. Crowell" wrote: > > Started the Female once. It is OK, but not great in the detail department, > certainly nothing like the Tamia kits from "that other war". I found that > the kit went together fairly easily, and had decently clear instructions. I > don't know what level of accuracy you are looking for so I can't say if > you'll be dissapointed or not. The 1/72 versions look ok, with paint, > weathering and upgraded details. Over-all I would compare the Emhar kits to > Matchbox or Airfix. Not great, but you can tell what tehy are, and their not > to expensive either. > > YMMV, bear in mind I didn't finish the 1/35 yet. Upgraded guns are pretty > much a must though. Hi all, Hopefully starting in either the next APMA Magazine (Issue 4/01) or the first issue of 2002, will be a series on WW1 tanks/AFVs kicking off with the Mk.IV with photos from Bovington & modelling notes for the 1/76 (I picked up the Matador Models 1/76 mk.IV add-ons at Euromilitaire) & 1/35 versions. Regards, Shane (the Younger) APMA VP http://apma.org.au Having FUN making models Now PayPay enabled ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 07:49:57 +0100 From: "fraser" To: Subject: RE: Thinning Acrylics Message-ID: <015a01c16111$c5968980$31d57ac3@fraserinprague> Good Morning, I seem to remember from art school that over thinning acrylics with water can damage the ability of it to form its 'long chain molecules' weakening it's grip. I remember reading in a winsor Newton (I think) publication that water, preferably distilled, should be mixed 50-50 with medium. else yer painting could end up falling off the canvas... Something that a few famous sixties artists have certainly had probs with. I would imagine that Future/Kleer fulfills that function. If you want a clear overspray you could well try watercolour pigment diluted with Future. Avoid most of the student range of colours though as they tend to be less than lightfast. Regards Fraser ----- Original Message ----- From: Laskodi To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2001 1:51 AM Subject: [WWI] RE: Thinning Acrylics > << want > to use?>>> > Both work quite well. However, I have given up on these as thinning agents > for a simple reason; they dry too fast on the needle tip and require > frequent cleaning. Makes it difficult to airbrush very fine patterns when > you have to make the aperture very small. My current acrylic thinning > favorite is..................FUTURE!!!! I don't go more than 1:1 thinning > with Future, if I want it thinner after that (for very fine spraying) I add > a few drops of Polly Scale Airbrush Thinner. Future acts a bit like a > retarder, really improves the flow through the tip with far less clogging, > and gives you a velvet smooth surface that is very durable. Plus no gloss > coat required for you dinosaurs still using oil based washes! > HTH > -------Bob > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 07:36:42 +0100 From: "fraser" To: Subject: Re: Pegasus Poll Message-ID: <015901c16111$c45f4200$31d57ac3@fraserinprague> This is the well known 'Vicious Circle' and explains why thhings disappear from the shelves...like 5amp fuse wire onna roll...(in England). Perception of low demand (real or imagined) + lack of imagination = diminishing variety of products. Hence everyone of the big boys do a shed load of Spits and 109s and no Hansa Brandenburgs. So thank the gods for the likes of Mssrs. Eduard, Pegasus, CopperState etc. Who would have thought a Swordfish would have been a big enough seller to attract Tamiya? ----- Original Message ----- From: Rory Goodwin To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2001 6:41 AM Subject: [WWI] Re: Pegasus Poll > Alas, this is the seemingly eternal bane/Catch-22 of 1/48 WWI ac models. If a > company risks producing an interesting, decent (injection-molded) non-fighter > kit, it will almost certainly be in limited quantities and therefore priced > beyond the reach of all but hardcore enthusiasts, ensuring that not many are > sold, the price isn't likely to ever come down much and thus it won't become > widely known or popular with the ot philistines (no matter how important the ac > was), and so is even less likely to become a subject issued by mainstream > comp[anies. My disproportionate dabbling in Bittner scale is due in large part > to simple economics; by the time I've payed for the 'necessary' references I > don't have 30-50 USD left over for a single-engine fighter kit. I would > consider this price range steep in any case, which is rather frustrating as > rigging in 1/72 is one of my least favorite modelling 'challenges', DURAS > proving impractical in may cases. > > Kicking my soapbox into the gutter and ducking into a used book store... > > > > Todd Hayes wrote: > > > ... If some manufacturer does them in 1:48, > > and providing you don't need to mortage your home to > > pay for it, I think these a/c would sell fairly well... > > > > Todd > > > > --- David Layton wrote: > > > I did suggest the 'Dorand' A.R.1 (Matt, note the ' ' > > > around Dorand.) > > > > > > I think there is room for more Caudrons, Voisins and > > > Farmans. Especially in > > > 1/48. I would also think that a MF 11 bis with the > > > clam shell front would > > > be nice! > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: > > > To: "Multiple recipients of list" > > > > > > Sent: Sunday, October 28, 2001 9:05 PM > > > Subject: [WWI] Re: Pegasus Poll > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All; > > > > > > > > My votes were for a Junkers CL-1 in Blue Max and > > > for a DH-9 in Pegasus. > > > For > > > > Silver Cloud I asked for a (ot alert!) Hawker > > > D___n. > > > > > > > > Popular manufacturers have certainly made more > > > German over the years but > > > > where does the demand come from? In relation to > > > why German sells better > > > > than Allied, I wonder if this ties in with the > > > somewhat more sympathetic > > > > and detailed press Jasta's have got over the years > > > rather than Squadrons > > > > and Spas. This is changing I believe with the > > > Windsock 'Squadron' series > > > > (lets hope they'll do the same thing for the > > > Storks and other French > > > units) > > > > and the Grubb Street books in the specialist > > > fields. The popular media has > > > > tended to portray the RFC/RAF as heroic, hapless > > > victims often, and Jasta > > > > pilots as dashing, more skilled, more chivalrous > > > in their brightly > > > coloured > > > > planes reminiscent of the knights of old. The > > > French, apart from Guynemer, > > > > Nungessor and the Lafayette (read US) get little > > > mention in any capacity. > > > > Russia, Austria-Hungary, and Italy (outside of > > > their own countries) often > > > > don't even rate a mention. Australian pilots known > > > in their own country? > > > > Many more know the Red Baron than Robert Little. > > > > > > > > Link this in with the colour argument and I > > > believe you may be heading > > > > towards an answer. > > > > > > > > All the Best > > > > Neil E > > > > > > > > > > > > But this is a prob with the model producers. > > > German stuff sells well. Its > > > > what they make their money on. Just look at the > > > amount of WWII German > > > > armour > > > > and figure kits are out there. They have just as > > > much colour as WWI German > > > > planes do. And this sells. I too wish we had more > > > WWI Allied aircraft. > > > > > > > > Ross > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ > > > _____ > > > > NOTICE: This communication is confidential. If you > > > are not the intended > > > recipient of this communication please delete and > > > destroy all copies > > > immediately. If you are the intended recipient of > > > this communication, you > > > should not copy, disclose or distribute this > > > communication without the > > > authority of the Department of Human Services. > > > > > > > > Any views expressed in this communication are > > > those of the individual > > > sender, except where the sender specifically states > > > them to be the views of > > > the Department. > > > > > > > > Except as required by law, the Department does not > > > represent, warrant > > > and/or guarantee that the integrity of this > > > communication has been > > > maintained nor that the communication is free of > > > errors, virus, interception > > > or interference. > > > > > > > > If you have received this email in error or have > > > other concerns regarding > > > this transmission, please contact the Department of > > > Human Services System > > > Administrator at Postmaster@dhs.vic.gov.au > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________ > > > _____ > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do You Yahoo!? > > Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. > > http://personals.yahoo.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 14:05:25 +0530 (IST) From: Skillometer_beta@vsnl.net To: Skillometer_beta@giasmd01.vsnl.net.in Subject: ADV: How good are your IT skills? Message-ID: <20011030083525.81A75B1D9@giasmd01.vsnl.net.in> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C1573A.F722D7A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The Skillometer Skills Challenge: Take a Free IT Skills Test! Win $100! =20 Get the recognition you deserve. As an accomplished IT professional, we = invite you to take the Skillometer Skills Challenge. Skillometer = provides web-based skills testing for current and leading-edge = Information Technologies. Our tests measure the proficiency of the IT = professional in a respective technology. If you're good enough, we'll = feature you on our website. 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------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C1573A.F722D7A0-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 10:46:57 +0100 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Re: I'm back and still getting it wrong Message-ID: Well I got everything wrong yesterday, and I have absolutely nothing to blame. Welcome back Scho:-) /Neil C > -----Original Message----- > From: Steven Schofield [mailto:scho@ww1.org.uk] > Sent: den 30 oktober 2001 00:12 > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: [WWI] Re: I'm back and still getting it wrong > > > sorry - I meant John, not Todd. Blame the painkillers I'm on. > Scho > http://www.ww1.org.uk > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 09:34:37 +0000 From: Nigel Cheffers-Heard To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Thinning Acrylics Message-ID: Why, what do you use? N >and gives you a velvet smooth surface that is very durable. Plus no gloss >coat required for you dinosaurs still using oil based washes! -- Nigel Cheffers-Heard photography + design tel: +44 (0)1392 87 58 57 fax: +44 (0)1392 87 74 97 mobile: 0771 261 4514 nigelch@cheffers.co.uk www.cheffers.co.uk Laburnums, Bridge Hill Topsham, Exeter EX3 0QQ, UK ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2001 09:42:42 +0000 From: Nigel Cheffers-Heard To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Thinning Acrylics Message-ID: It is certainly true about the problems associated with over-thinning acrylics with water. Future ensures a good bond and a waterproof finish. I use Iso Propyl Alcohol (correctly called Propan-2-ol) and Distilled Water. I agree that if you use too much IPA (up to 70%) it CAN dry too fast in the airbrush, but if you keep the proportion around 50% you get a good compromise between drying speed and mobility through the nozzle. If you belong to a club, buy 5 litres of IPA, and then share it. The unit price is surprisingly low! Most acrylic paint manufacturers make both Retarder to slow drying, and Flow Improver to , well, improve flow... A VERY SMALL addition of both can help with airbrushing paints, particularly those really designed for brush painting. Future is a great medium/thinner. Works well, gives transparency, but I find it builds up in the nozzle and needs clearing with ammonia solution. Yuk! Although it behaves very much like an acrylic, I am told the Tamiya is actually latex based, and hence can behave differently to all other acrylics, although it thins well with IPA/water. <.... else yer painting could end up falling off the canvas... Something that a few famous sixties artists have certainly had probs with..... (Fraser) > You mean Jackson Pollock's paintings are actually improving with time? I have worked with a pretty famous artist who does BIG paintings in pastel colours. She uses Artist Quality acrylics for the colours, thinned with Homebase Economy White Emulsion..... caveat emptor! sorry to wander, but reasonably relevant... incidentally, household emulsions are fine for diorama bases with matt textures, but the pigment textures are too coarse for smooth surfaces as on model aircraft. Dulux testers are great value for this purpose. N -- Nigel Cheffers-Heard photography + design tel: +44 (0)1392 87 58 57 fax: +44 (0)1392 87 74 97 mobile: 0771 261 4514 nigelch@cheffers.co.uk www.cheffers.co.uk Laburnums, Bridge Hill Topsham, Exeter EX3 0QQ, UK ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 3850 **********************