WWI Digest 3812 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: speaking of cookups by "Diego Fernetti" 2) Odp: Re: collection planning by "Grzegorz Mazurowski" 3) Re: The Future is Clear, or Kleer by "Lee M." 4) Today in History by "Mark Shannon" 5) Re: speaking of cookups by Crawford Neil 6) re: Today in history - The Italian front by "Grzegorz Mazurowski" 7) Caporetto /was: Today in History by "Michael Kendix" 8) Re: speaking of cookups by "Diego Fernetti" 9) Attaching rigging was: Somewhat Urgent Help Needed by "Steven Perry" 10) re: Today in history - The Italian front by "Marcio Antonio Campos" 11) RE: Final Ni.17 Question by "Graham Hunter" 12) Re: Hello by Allan Wright 13) vac Avro 504N RE: University of London Squadron by Crawford Neil 14) RE: Caporetto /was: Today in History by "Diego Fernetti" 15) Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups by Mark Miller 16) Re: Caporetto / was: Today in history by "a.casirati@cornali-trasporti.it" 17) RE: Caporetto /was: Today in History by "Michael Kendix" 18) Re: You Never Forget Your First by Scottfking@aol.com 19) by "a.casirati@cornali-trasporti.it" 20) RE: Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups by Crawford Neil 21) Re: Guitar string for rigging; was Re: Somewhat Urgent Help Needed by KarrArt@aol.com 22) Web Update by Allan Wright 23) Two in one day by Allan Wright 24) RE: Guitar string for rigging; was Re: Somewhat Urgent Help Needed by "Graham Hunter" 25) RE: speaking of cookups by Crawford Neil 26) italian front by "Diego Fernetti" 27) RE: Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups by Mark Miller 28) RE: Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups by "Diego Fernetti" 29) Re: italian front by "Michael Kendix" 30) RE: Two in one day by "Diego Fernetti" 31) RE: speaking of cookups by Tim Linnell ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 10:31:55 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: Re: speaking of cookups Message-ID: <032401c157d9$412d6ba0$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Mark! > What did the French and Germans use for trainers? > did they have AC specificaly designed for the task AFAIK they used dated designs as trainers D. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 15:33:15 +0200 From: "Grzegorz Mazurowski" To: Subject: Odp: Re: collection planning Message-ID: <00c501c157d9$71f843e0$0200a8c0@x.pl> Michael! Are you Dilbert's author? Your'e at least as good as him! G. > Grzegorz: > Excellent question there! Possibly, almost as much fun can be had in > planning as in the building. My planning has been enhanced > significantly by > the use of software such as "Microsoft Project" (...) _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 08:42:11 -0500 From: "Lee M." To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: The Future is Clear, or Kleer Message-ID: <3BCEDC32.1AA92605@x25.net> Fraser, I do not know any Czech wordsto be able to twell you to much but it is an Acrylic Floor Coating. I am rather certain that they have the material, but, it may have a different name then Future or Kleer. Maybe the name is Czech for Clear. Ask around at the stores and it should be in there somewhere. It is really sold all over as far as I know.. It is sold in Thailand, Indonesia and Japan that I know of for certain. To keep this OT. It was not sold during WW I... Lee M. New Braunfels, TX fraser wrote: > Maybe a dumb question, but is Kleer, or Clear(?) the British version of > Future? I can't find either in my local Supermarket here in Prague and have > no idea what name it might be sold under here...if I did I probably wouldn't > be able to pronounce it. > Went out to the Aerospace museum yesterdayand the WW1 gallery was > shut...There were a few WW1 props hanging on the wall of another gallery. > One of them looked like black metal??! Either a superb bit of wood finishing > , or what? > Regards > Fraseer ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 08:37:05 -0500 From: "Mark Shannon" To: Subject: Today in History Message-ID: Alberto Wrote: >18th October 1915: the third Isonzo battle begins. >Alberto Casirati Heck, Alberto, it might be more mind boggling to post on days that one of the Isonzo battles DIDN'T begin or end! ;{) I guess that is what comes from having essentially one pass through the mountains between the two countries. .Mark. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 15:37:17 +0200 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: Re: speaking of cookups Message-ID: You mean like Nieuports? /Neil C. > -----Original Message----- > From: Diego Fernetti [mailto:dfernet0@rosario.gov.ar] > Sent: den 18 oktober 2001 15:30 > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: [WWI] Re: speaking of cookups > > > Mark! > > What did the French and Germans use for trainers? > > did they have AC specificaly designed for the task > > AFAIK they used dated designs as trainers > D. > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 15:42:27 +0200 From: "Grzegorz Mazurowski" To: Subject: re: Today in history - The Italian front Message-ID: <00d501c157da$bafcc7e0$0200a8c0@x.pl> Alberto! > 18th October 1915: the third Isonzo battle begins. Serious question: What Isonzo region looked like after all that battles? I think that intensity of fights and number of heavy artillery shells shot was not as big as on Western Front, but...? Grzegorz _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 13:44:12 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Caporetto /was: Today in History Message-ID: Alberto: This is slightly off-topic, though not too much. I have read Cyril Falls' book on the "The Battle of Caporetto" and wondered if you had an opinion of it? Personally, I found it a little dry and hard to follow what was going on. On the whole, not too bad though. Michael _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 10:54:56 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: Re: speaking of cookups Message-ID: <039301c157dc$781d6ae0$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Also like Spads VIIs, two seaters and Bleriots! And when it came to fly the HD3, I'm sure that the pilots tested their skills on Spad XIIIs too ;-) D. ----- Original Message ----- From: Crawford Neil To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 10:41 AM Subject: [WWI] Re: speaking of cookups > You mean like Nieuports? > /Neil C. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Diego Fernetti [mailto:dfernet0@rosario.gov.ar] > > Sent: den 18 oktober 2001 15:30 > > To: Multiple recipients of list > > Subject: [WWI] Re: speaking of cookups > > > > > > Mark! > > > What did the French and Germans use for trainers? > > > did they have AC specificaly designed for the task > > > > AFAIK they used dated designs as trainers > > D. > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 09:54:50 -0400 From: "Steven Perry" To: Subject: Attaching rigging was: Somewhat Urgent Help Needed Message-ID: <003101c157dc$75504120$61e82341@tampabay.rr.com> I've never used guitar strings before - > generally white glue is used for attachment isn't it?. I took a model to work intending to rig it during a 12 hour weekend night shift. I forgot my CA which is my preferred adhesive. Not to be deterred, I tried an experiment which worked well. I mixed Future with acrylic gel medium. Took a bit of stirring, but it produced a glue that turned out to be usable. It resisted forming a "skin" like white glue, but dried reasonably quickly. It was sticky enough when applied to hold the pieces of rigging in place and when dry it was clear and held the HSP firmly enough to allow it to be tightened with a hot pin. Mix was about 3 parts Future to 7 parts gel. It can be applied with a small brush, but I found it was better to use a glue needle, (fine music wire stuck in a bamboo stick). I don't see why it wouldnt work on wire rigging material, though I don't think it would work too well on monofiliment. FWIW sp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 12:00:30 -0300 From: "Marcio Antonio Campos" To: Subject: re: Today in history - The Italian front Message-ID: <002b01c157e5$a1d03a30$5d1ba8c0@officesp.starmedia> Talking about Isonzo battles, one of the best museums I've ever visited in the world is in the Slovenian city of Kobarid (Italian "Caporetto"). Go there if you can. It's completely OT, except for a room dedicated to WWII. Slovenians call Isonzo River "Soca", and my Slovene friend said it's one of the cleanest rivers in Europe. A ride through Vrsic Pass, near there, is wonderful for both nature and history lovers! All the best from Brazil Marcio Antonio Campos Redator do GuiaSP StarMedia do Brasil +55 11 30436421 marcio.campos@starmedia.net http://www.guiasp.com.br http://www.guiarj.com.br http://www.nacidade.com.br ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 08:57:22 -0500 From: "Graham Hunter" To: Subject: RE: Final Ni.17 Question Message-ID: <000501c157dc$d012d000$fa0101c0@grahamh> Ken, This are the intakes for the carberator. Rotary engines take the fuel and air intake from the crankcase to the cylinder head via the pipes that on the Le Rhone start at the crankcase and end at a valve assembly on the cyclinder head. If you are using brass tubing you might want to thin the walls of the tube by drilling them out with an appropriate sized bit for scale effect. The actual tubes are quite thin. HTH, Graham ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 09:58:52 -0400 (EDT) From: Allan Wright To: tjohnson@ci.west-valley.ut.us (Troy Johnson) Cc: wwi Subject: Re: Hello Message-ID: <200110181358.JAA16616@mustang.sr.unh.edu> Troy, I do not build in 1:48 scale, but many people on the WWI modeling mailing list do. I'll forward your request to them. Allan (List - make sure to mail Troy direct - he's not on the list) > From: tjohnson@ci.west-valley.ut.us > Hi- > > Like you all I love to built wwI aircraft. I am looking for the 1/48 knights of the sky series....dml kit 5908. Do you know anyone wanting to maybe part with this kit?? > > Troy > > =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | Without love life's just a long fight - Southside University of New Hampshire +-------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@wwi-models.org Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://www.wwi-models.org =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 16:09:34 +0200 From: Crawford Neil To: "'timli@controls.eurotherm.co.uk'" , Subject: vac Avro 504N RE: University of London Squadron Message-ID: Hi Tim and list, That model wasn't as lovely as I thought, the fuselage looks good, but the wings have hazy rib-detail. I'm not sure if it is possible to substitute Airfix wings. There are very nice decals, P/E parts, strut material and white-metal bits, so a very complete kit, and on the whole very good, but not perfect. It is called Expomodels no.3 by the Association of London modellers. Avro 504N with decals for 601sqn and a Danish machine. As you said they produced 750 for the southern model expo. The following people were involved Joe Chubbock - Pheonix Richard Humberstome - Blue Rider Gordon Sutcliffe - Contrail John Hilbert - Graingate ltd. James Kightly - Penguin art Bruce Dennis - Akita I listed them just in case anyone was interested. I've met James Kightly he's a member of the racer-SIG, a nice guy. References listed in the kit (and some from my list): Aeroplane Monthly 4-78, 7-78, 5-82, 5-91, 11-97, 4-98 Harleyford Camouflage&Markings Aviation News vol13-4 Scale Models 5-75 SAM 7-1 RAF between wars Ray Rimell Munson I'm sending this to the list too, because I think many there are interested, and it's only a little bit ot. /Best regards Neil ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 11:28:21 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: RE: Caporetto /was: Today in History Message-ID: <006001c157e1$238d3780$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Michael! AFAIK that's an OT battle. Wasn't this a defeat for the italian forces in 1917 or 18? IIRC a young Erwin Romell participated in it as a Mountain Stormtrupp officer. D. ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Kendix To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 10:48 AM Subject: [WWI] Caporetto /was: Today in History > Alberto: > > This is slightly off-topic, though not too much. I have read Cyril Falls' > book on the "The Battle of Caporetto" and wondered if you had an opinion of > it? Personally, I found it a little dry and hard to follow what was going > on. On the whole, not too bad though. > > Michael > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > ------------------------------ Date: 18 Oct 2001 07:28:07 -0700 From: Mark Miller To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups Message-ID: <20011018142807.15450.cpmta@c012.sfo.cp.net> On Thu, 18 October 2001, "Diego Fernetti" wrote: > > Also like Spads VIIs, two seaters and Bleriots! > And when it came to fly the HD3, I'm sure that the pilots tested their > skills on Spad XIIIs too ;-) > D. Ok - so they didn't have a specific design. what about interesting/gaudy trainer color schemes? Any particular design last into the post war period a la the jenny/avro ? I'm assuming the Germans did not experience this because i believe they were forced to trash all their AC after the war. Did other parts of the world have "barnstormers" as in America, or something similar? call it north american centricity if you want. But I must confess that I do not have very much info on trainers or post war aviation in other parts of the world. And was the SPAD that much easier to fly than the HD3? Bleriots?? sounds like an awfully dangerous way to train pilots Mark Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 16:20:34 +0200 From: "a.casirati@cornali-trasporti.it" To: "Wwi Modeling List (Posta elettronica)" Subject: Re: Caporetto / was: Today in history Message-ID: <43EB244779F3D411966E0060082C59E906F1F1@SERVER1> Michael: unfortunately, I have not read that book, yet. I am not able to be of help, here, sorry ! Alberto ----- Original Message ----- From: Michael Kendix To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 10:48 AM Subject: [WWI] Caporetto /was: Today in History > Alberto: > > This is slightly off-topic, though not too much. I have read Cyril Falls' > book on the "The Battle of Caporetto" and wondered if you had an opinion of > it? Personally, I found it a little dry and hard to follow what was going > on. On the whole, not too bad though. > > Michael ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 14:30:10 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Caporetto /was: Today in History Message-ID: Diego: When I said "Slightly off topic", I meant with respect to modelling, although I'm certain there was significant air activity. What sort of aircraft would have featured I wonder, from the A-H, German and Italian forces? Yes, Rommel features prominently. As for this being a defeat of the Italians, I suppose so but the Axis side were unable to exploit their victory - so strategically it was a failure for them. Michael >From: "Diego Fernetti" >Reply-To: wwi@wwi-models.org >To: Multiple recipients of list >Subject: [WWI] RE: Caporetto /was: Today in History >Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 10:25:36 -0400 (EDT) > >Michael! >AFAIK that's an OT battle. Wasn't this a defeat for the italian forces in >1917 or 18? IIRC a young Erwin Romell participated in it as a Mountain >Stormtrupp officer. >D. > >----- Original Message ----- >From: Michael Kendix >To: Multiple recipients of list >Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 10:48 AM >Subject: [WWI] Caporetto /was: Today in History > > > > Alberto: > > > > This is slightly off-topic, though not too much. I have read Cyril >Falls' > > book on the "The Battle of Caporetto" and wondered if you had an opinion >of > > it? Personally, I found it a little dry and hard to follow what was >going > > on. On the whole, not too bad though. > > > > Michael > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at >http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > > _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 10:36:10 EDT From: Scottfking@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: You Never Forget Your First Message-ID: <85.11990b74.290042da@aol.com> Hi Ken, Looks like a few of us will be heading your way from Louisville for the contest. Hope to run into you and Eli Geher there. I think we will hit the contest and vendors then head to the Space Museum the back to contest/vendors. Scott (Skippy) King ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 16:33:28 +0200 From: "a.casirati@cornali-trasporti.it" To: "Wwi Modeling List (Posta elettronica)" Message-ID: <43EB244779F3D411966E0060082C59E906F1F2@SERVER1> Grzegorz, I am not really an expert of WW1 battles on the ground, so it is difficult for me to make comparisons between the Italian and the western fronts in this respect. What I can say is that since the Italian front is not as wellknown as the western front, one is usually brought to think that the war was less heavy and intense on the Italian front, but this is not true. The war in Italy was very different in some repsects, mainly because of the terrain over which it was fought, but this also meant a harder war for many, with the need to face extremely low temperatures (about - 30 degrees) in addition to the usual pains of the war in the trenches.... Moreover, Italian had usually to face an enemy firing from better and higher positions, behind well prepared defensive systems. Such a disadvantage was unknown to the combatants of the western front. Artillery fire of course increased during the war and I believe that it was nothing short of the one on the western front, especially on open areas. Just think that in 1916 the Italian artillery was able to dismantle most of the A-H defensive barrages before an attack.....this means heavy artillery shells, but also a very accurate aiming, as the front territory was not as flat as that of the western front. Sorry for the somewhat random thoughts, but I am in the office now and cannot have a look at my references. Hope this helps a little. All the very best, Alberto ----- Original Message ----- From: Grzegorz Mazurowski To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2001 10:44 AM Subject: [WWI] re: Today in history - The Italian front > Alberto! > > 18th October 1915: the third Isonzo battle begins. > Serious question: What Isonzo region looked like after all that > battles? > I think that intensity of fights and number of heavy artillery shells > shot was not as big as on Western Front, but...? > Grzegorz ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 16:49:28 +0200 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups Message-ID: > > Ok - so they didn't have a specific design. > what about interesting/gaudy trainer color schemes? They had a very lovely fish-scale painted Nieuport at Issoudan, can't remember the details, but difficult to find anything gaudier. > Any particular design last into the post war period > a la the jenny/avro ? Perhaps the Caudron G3 ? > I'm assuming the Germans did not experience this because i > believe they were forced to trash all their AC after the war. > > Did other parts of the world have "barnstormers" as in > America, or something similar? I think so, but I wish I knew more, certainly Britain, but France I don't know. > > call it north american centricity if you want. > But I must confess that I do not have very much info on > trainers or post war aviation in other parts of the world. > > And was the SPAD that much easier to fly than the HD3? No it was probably more difficult, thin wings and tricky stall characteristics. It was the performance comparison that the Spad lost (also!). I am forced to tell the truth:-( > Bleriots?? sounds like an awfully dangerous way to train pilots Flying was dangerous, they learnt on Maurice Farmans in Britain, those who survived. /Neil C. > > Mark > > > Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! > http://www.shopping.altavista.com > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 10:50:36 EDT From: KarrArt@aol.com To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: Guitar string for rigging; was Re: Somewhat Urgent Help Needed Message-ID: In a message dated 10/18/01 2:27:14 AM Pacific Daylight Time, fahey.j.l@clear.net.nz writes: << I like the idea of wire which is reasonably rigid and won't get a bend in it if someone pokes it with their finger (fusewire?). Maybe my guitar string was just a cheap one - has anyone else noticed rust? Cheers James >> I know that guitar strings will turn off-color- they'll corrode just sitting around on a guitar. (my ancient seldom played acoustic provides proof!) I don't rig with them, but I use 'em for detail bits- and I always put paint or some coating over them. RK ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 10:57:28 -0400 (EDT) From: Allan Wright To: wwi Subject: Web Update Message-ID: <200110181457.KAA17425@mustang.sr.unh.edu> I just added 4 new images to Bob Laskodi's Nieuport Models page of a Eduard Nieuport 11 - very nice. Al =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | Without love life's just a long fight - Southside University of New Hampshire +-------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@wwi-models.org Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://www.wwi-models.org =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 11:07:45 -0400 (EDT) From: Allan Wright To: wwi Subject: Two in one day Message-ID: <200110181507.LAA17784@mustang.sr.unh.edu> I just added 5 images to Charlie Duckworth's Central Powers page. It's Voss's plane, you just can't look at the Cowl though! Nice model Charlie! Al =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | Without love life's just a long fight - Southside University of New Hampshire +-------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@wwi-models.org Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://www.wwi-models.org =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 10:17:53 -0500 From: "Graham Hunter" To: Subject: RE: Guitar string for rigging; was Re: Somewhat Urgent Help Needed Message-ID: <000b01c157e8$0f75eba0$fa0101c0@grahamh> I have to say that I am a convert to Wonder Wire. You get it from Precision Enterprises (ph. 802 885 3094). This stuff is great for 1/48 scale rigging. It is ceramic and has a dark grey sheen. No need to paint, no worry of rust and it is close in scale for most rigging (0.06 inch). It is alittle heavy for 1/72nd but for 48 and bigger it is IMO the cats meow. Inexpensive too... $6.95 for a 10 foot roll. Regards, Graham ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 17:16:58 +0200 From: Crawford Neil To: "'wwi@wwi-models.org'" Subject: RE: speaking of cookups Message-ID: Certainly these would be exciting to read about, but they are a little dull to look at. OTOH the post-war 504's are nicer looking but dull to read about! /Neil C. > -----Original Message----- > From: Rory Goodwin [mailto:rorygood@earthlink.net] > Sent: den 18 oktober 2001 07:03 > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: [WWI] RE: speaking of cookups > > > What about the RNAS flight that bombed the Zeppelin sheds at > Friedrichshafen in Nov. 1914 or the three (?) that were used in N. > Russia to bomb & strafe the Bolshies in 1919? > I might be willing to engage in single combat with a Smer kit... > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 12:27:44 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: italian front Message-ID: <002701c157e9$6fc40b80$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Alberto wrote: > Artillery fire of course increased during the war and I believe that it was > nothing short of the one on the western front, especially on open areas. > Just think that in 1916 the Italian artillery was able to dismantle most of > the A-H defensive barrages before an attack.....this means heavy artillery > shells, but also a very accurate aiming, as the front territory was not as > flat as that of the western front. This made me remember to the movie "A farewell to Arms" starring Rock Hudson that has scenes of a mountain side bombardment. My dad was an artillery NCO in his twenties and told me that the scene was quite realistic on the effect of heavy mortar fire. D. Now, that guy Hudson... ;-) ------------------------------ Date: 18 Oct 2001 08:22:00 -0700 From: Mark Miller To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: RE: Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups Message-ID: <20011018152200.13968.cpmta@c012.sfo.cp.net> On Thu, 18 October 2001, Crawford Neil wrote: > They had a very lovely fish-scale painted Nieuport at Issoudan, can't remember the details, but difficult to find anything gaudier.> Do you know what model it was? or where I could see it sounds like a good candidate for my virtual N17 I seem to remember a french(?) training AC which had stub wings designed so that the student pilots would not be able to take off - just taxi up and down the field I can't remember what it was called > Flying was dangerous, they learnt on Maurice Farmans in Britain, those who survived.> Dangerous indeed!! The pilots at Rhinebeck only "hop" the Bleriot. They think it's too dangerous to actualy fly it. And these guys have a LOT of experience. Mark Find the best deals on the web at AltaVista Shopping! http://www.shopping.altavista.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 12:32:26 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: RE: Trainers was Re: speaking of cookups Message-ID: <004301c157ea$177398a0$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Mark! > Do you know what model it was? or where I could see it > sounds like a good candidate for my virtual N17 It's a 27, but it may be an easy "virtual" conversion from the 17 > I seem to remember a french(?) training AC which had stub wings designed so that the student pilots would not be able to take off - just taxi up and down the field > I can't remember what it was called Pengüins. IIRC there were Nieuport 11 or morane saulniers surplus or tired airframes. D. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 15:27:58 From: "Michael Kendix" To: wwi@wwi-models.org Subject: Re: italian front Message-ID: >From: "Diego Fernetti" > >This made me remember to the movie "A farewell to Arms" starring Rock > >Hudson that has scenes of a mountain side bombardment. My dad was an > >artillery NCO in his twenties and told me that the scene was quite > >realistic on the effect of heavy mortar fire. >D. >Now, that guy Hudson... ;-) Diego: A re-make of the original movie that was released in 1932 featuring Helen Hayes and Gary Cooper. I would recommend that though I've not seen the latter version. Michael _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 12:39:41 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: RE: Two in one day Message-ID: <005001c157eb$1ab3b300$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Well done Charlie and Bob! I love the nieuport, Bob, Armand de Turenne's Bebé is my favourite scheme. Would you allow me a little constructive criticism, tough... I guess that the Lewis ammo drums are dark steel coloured. D. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2001 16:33:46 +0100 From: Tim Linnell To: Subject: RE: speaking of cookups Message-ID: <010EF7D56E81D311AF850090273C43FE033E72F0@eden.recorders.eurotherm.co.uk> Not so dull in fact. My favourite story is a legendary short landing competition (I think at the Central Flying School at Upavon). The idea was that the participant pilots were to cut their engines and attempt to land as close as possible to a particular mark. The result was absolute chaos. 504Ks were strewn all over the landing field, embedded in buildings, and (if I recall correctly) in one case skimming a roof and destroying someone's highly prized motor car. Meanwhile the station commanders, in an advanced and increasing state of hilarity, scoured the base for as many serviceable aircraft as they could find so that the fun could continue, which it did until there were no remaining flyable aircraft. Apparently the 504K had a tendancy to crumple on impact, so pilots were cushioned, and could walk away from quite serious crashes. There are some magnificent 'jazz' 504K aircraft in the Windsock datafile, and others with spoof smokestacks and other extraneous items (including a fake undercarriage on the upper wing) - very off-topic, but could be a fun and rather relaxing project with a Smer kit, very redolent of the carefree inter-war period. Cheers Tim > Certainly these would be exciting to read about, but they are > a little dull to look at. OTOH the post-war 504's are nicer > looking but dull to read about! > /Neil C. > ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 3812 **********************