WWI Digest 2971 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Another Laskodi Gem at Modeling Madness by "DAVID BURKE" 2) Re: Lyon, David: The First Destroyers by "DAVID BURKE" 3) Re: Hi-Tech Roland D.II -first impressions and a cry for colour-info! by "Limon3" 4) Re: More Eduard by "Dale Sebring" 5) Re: Windsock-sopwith pup by "TOM PLESHA" 6) Ceramcoat Paints? by Scottfking@aol.com 7) Re: Another Laskodi Gem at Modeling Madness by Ernest Thomas 8) Purple SSW D.IV by "Steven M.Perry" 9) Re: Kits for kids, further thoughts... by "diaphus" 10) Re: Hi-Tech Roland D.II -first impressions and a cry for colour-info! by "Hans Trauner" 11) DrI cockpit instruments. by Ernest Thomas 12) Re: Purple SSW D.IV by "Bob Pearson" 13) Re: Purple SSW D.IV by "Steven M.Perry" 14) Re: Hi-Tech Roland D.II -first impressions and a cry for colour-info! by "Michael S. Alvarado" 15) RE: WW1 list OT Places of interest guide /Sweden by "Neil Crawford" 16) Re: New images - judging systems by "Neil Crawford" 17) Re: Russian Troops in France by Todd Hayes 18) Re: More Eduard by Todd Hayes 19) Re: More Eduard by "Matt Bittner" 20) Latest OtF by "Matt Bittner" 21) Re: New images - judging systems by "TOM PLESHA" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:36:17 -0600 From: "DAVID BURKE" To: Subject: Re: Another Laskodi Gem at Modeling Madness Message-ID: <003501c07d76$e018aba0$fde279a5@com> E laments : > No, not really. But my wife has actually met Kat, and for my birthday, I asked > if I could go see Kat perform(she's a stripper). But all I got was a stupid old > Hi-Tech Roland. :-( > Which makes this post OT. Ernie, you chump! First, having a lascivious goon like you ogling her as she performs her, er, umm, 'ballet', might freak her out to the point where she accidentally gets her pasties caught in a ceiling fan and ends up suffering an accident which leaves her looking like Shelley Duvall. Second, you fool, you damned fool, you could have leveraged that request into a hell of a lot MORE KITS than just one 'stupid old Hi-Tech Roland'!! Remind me never to give you money to invest!! DB ...Who just looked at the latest C&C and the nice pic of Goering's D.VII reminds me that I forgot to paint the lift points on the wings - AAAARRRGGGHH!! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:38:25 -0600 From: "DAVID BURKE" To: Subject: Re: Lyon, David: The First Destroyers Message-ID: <003601c07d76$e0e9b740$fde279a5@com> Friedrich wrote: > Oppossum, Ranger and Sunfish were British destroyers commissioned in 1896. Opossum? Is that an Irish 'Possum? DB ...Them's is good eatin' too! Mmmm Mmmm! Tasty! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 08:29:56 -0800 From: "Limon3" To: Subject: Re: Hi-Tech Roland D.II -first impressions and a cry for colour-info! Message-ID: <004101c07d7e$11c442c0$caf7303f@f4w2s5> Hi Hans, I just finished (except for the rigging) my DII. Some quick thoughts that may be of help to you. The parts do need a little work, when I was ready to zip it up, I used quite a bit of filler so that there would be no seam showing. The engine is o.k., but you might want to consider an aftermarket purchase. The p.e. parts are great, nice and thin, but they are tiny in some cases. Diego was kind enough to scan some pages of (b&w) schemes, I chose to do Feiseler's machine. He also sent a scan of a cutaway, which was quite nice for interior details. I went with the time honored green and mauve, I just like it better! It was actually quite fun to build, although there were some other *small* frustrations. Have fun with it though. Gabe -----Original Message----- From: Hans Trauner To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Friday, January 12, 2001 2:21 PM Subject: Hi-Tech Roland D.II -first impressions and a cry for colour-info! >Hi, model pilots! >I have just got a parcel from the UK ( anxious to say - from Hannant's) >containing Hi-Tech's 1/48 Roland DII. My first impression is quite good. My >primary source is the DF 47 and all my comments are coming from research >from this. Measurements are o.k and spot on compared with the DF's drawings. >As usual, the drawings are not true 1/48 scale as span and length are >approx. 1mm short, and so is the kit. Wings are relatively thin, but there >is no wash out at the wing tips - like any other WWI-kit. Rips are o.k., >flat wings, no 'bulimic syndrome'. Rip bands could be benefit from sanding >down, as usual, but it's easy work. The rudder seems to be too square, but a >piece if wet'n dry will do it.. The engine is a combination from resin and >white metal parts and they look very fuzzy, so some clean up will be >required. The prop. is from white metal and needs cleaning up, also. >Included is a pe fret with all the small parts for inside and outside, >including cooler and louvres and things like that. The fret is marked with >'eduard'. Decals consists of crosses, the smaller ones for fuselage and >rudder are out of register on my example. Personal markings consists of two >pairs of flying white goose, as depicted on back cover of the DF. And now my >problem: > >CAMOUFLAGE: >DF says red brown/ green, kit instructions say mauve/green. In the days of >three-coloured Albatroses and mocha-striped D VIII's I lost all my >confidence in my age-old 'knowledge' of german WWI-camouflage. So, come on, >and please tell me your opinions. Thanks > >Hals- und Beinbruch >Hans > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:25:54 -0700 From: "Dale Sebring" To: Subject: Re: More Eduard Message-ID: <001501c07d7d$8148f4c0$78b58dd0@main> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Witold Kozakiewicz" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 7:33 AM Subject: Re: More Eduard > Todd Hayes napisał(a): > > > > Graham, > > > > I'm hoping Eduard will do a Nieuport 16 too. > > Shouldn't be too hard to adapt the Nie.11 molds. > > They will. Just like Nie.23 with Nie.17 > -- > Witold KozakiewX-Mozilla-Status: 000913 15:28:56 2001 > X-Mozilla-Status: 0801 > X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 > FCC: /C|/Program Files/Netscape/Users/witk/mail/Wyslane > Message-ID: <3A606628.58EB661D@bg.am.lodz.pl> > Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:28:56 +0100 > From: Witold Kozakiewicz > X-Mozilla-Draft-Info: internal/draft; vcard=0; receipt=0; uuencode=0; > html=0; linewidth=0 > X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [pl] (Win98; I) > X-Accept-Language: pl > MIME-Version: 1.0 > To: Wiliam > CC: Tomasz Gronczewski > Subject: Re: Odp: Bedzie dostep > References: <3A5EE6EF.E2AA8CB@bg.am.lodz.pl> > <003d01c07d3d$23badde0$e504a0d4@prawy> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2 > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > > Wiliam napisał(a): > > > > > Wili - czy z tych moich fotek (P-47, Bristol M1C, Jak 1) będziesz > > > składał galerie. Jak nie to mogę je zrobić sam. > > > > Jak Ci sie chce to zrob. Na pewno lepiej wiesz co sie nadaje do galerii. > > Dobra, zmontuję. > > > > > > Druga sprawa - strona Skyraidera - Kto zrobi stronę pierwsz± o Tamiy? > > > > Ok. Moge zrobic.Co prawda nie mamy skanu ramki z uzbrojeniem z mojego > > zestawu i kalki z zestawu Tomka. > > ??? Powinno byc wszystko. Na jednym scanie s± wszystkie ramki z > uzbrojeniem, SprawdĽ - to ten największy. Chyba że o czym¶ zapomniałem - > jak tak do nic straconego wezme model jeszcze raz ze sklepu. Tomek - > zeskanuj swój decals i pode¶lij Wilemu > > > Opis roznic w wersjach i jakas historie samolotu powinien splodzic Mistrz > > Gronczewski. > > To juz jak ustalicie miedzy sob±, ale czy rys historyczny będę mógł > wykorzystac przy moim Hasegawy? > > > > Moge napisac recenzje z F-104. Co prawda nie mam skanow ramek ale wiem gdzie > > sa i mozna je zerznac. > > Chyba sie nikt nie przywali - ramki to ramki. Na calym swiecie sa takie > > same. I mam pare zdjec z budowy. > > Dawaj. Wtedy fotki z galeri da sę do recenzji. A warto bo wyszedł Ci > genialnie. > > > Po skonczeniu Srajrajdera biore sie za A-7 Corsair i na pewno nie zapomne > > zrobic skanow ramek. > > Ekstra. I o to chodzi. > > -- > Witold Kozakiewicz Yikes, Witold, please don't do this to me, I'm just an uneducated Idaho spud :-) Regards, Dale ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 11:40:42 -0500 From: "TOM PLESHA" To: Subject: Re: Windsock-sopwith pup Message-ID: <001b01c07d7f$92e6ed20$96404c0c@tom> Thanks Scott- I'm in the process of scraping out the interior of the Pup to scratchbuild the frame, etc., thus I need all the info I can obtain, that's not in the Windsock Data File and the other references I have. thanks again Tom Plesha 48081 Walden Macomb Twp., Mi. 48044 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 9:32 AM Subject: Re: Windsock-sopwith pup > In a message dated 1/12/01 9:00:43 PM EST, APPMAN@worldnet.att.net writes: > > << Anybody have and maybe willing to copy an article in windsock about the pup > air dam for me? >> > > Sure, let me have your snail mail address and and will send it out Monday. > > Skippy > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 11:56:29 EST From: Scottfking@aol.com To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Ceramcoat Paints? Message-ID: Hi all, A local store (Frank's, a garden and craft store) is closing. All items are discounted 40-70%, one of which is the line of Delta Ceramcoat Acrylic Paints. I seem to recall some discussion here about these paints, esp for use as a base for plywood finishes or for clear doped linen. Which colors were recommended, and what was the technique? I did purchase a bottle each of 02001 Antique White and 02036 Ivory. The 2 oz bottles are now $0.72 each and I would like to avail myself (and anyone else interested ) to this seemingly good bargain. I checked out the display and it seems like they have a full range of colors. Thanks in advance for any advice or guidance. Skippy (Scott) ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 11:19:56 -0600 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Another Laskodi Gem at Modeling Madness Message-ID: <3A608E3A.AFE3D980@bellsouth.net> DAVID BURKE wrote: > Ernie, you chump! > > First, having a lascivious goon like you ogling her I'm not a goon. > you could have leveraged that request into a hell of a lot MORE KITS > than just one 'stupid old Hi-Tech Roland'!! Well not a LOT more kits. And I did also get a Swordfish for Newtonmas. > Remind me never to give you > money to invest!! I promise, next time you try to give me money to invest, I'll remind you not to. > I forgot to paint the lift points on the wings - > AAAARRRGGGHH!! Get over it, crybaby. E. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:26:41 -0500 From: "Steven M.Perry" To: Subject: Purple SSW D.IV Message-ID: <009901c07d86$02d6dfe0$f4f0aec7@default> On the PropPlanes list someone posted a photo of a SSW D.IV (1:1 scale and almost surely a replica). The plane has an overall purple scheme including the wings with yellow fin & rudder, wing tips and wheel covers. It has a polished aluminum cowl. There is a yellow lion's head on the fuselage side. Anyone know if this is an accurate scheme or even loosely based on an actual scheme and if so, whose? LMK sp I can send the photo as an attachment off list id anyone wants to see it. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 11:43:45 -0500 From: "diaphus" To: Subject: Re: Kits for kids, further thoughts... Message-ID: <001401c07d7f$ff004420$68551a18@tampabay.rr.com> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven M.Perry" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2001 10:51 PM Subject: Re: Kits for kids, further thoughts... Steve, Count me in for whatever you need. Also, please give me your phone number again so I can call you about getting together on the Albatros gear. I just got a new computer and have not yet been able to transfer my old email addresses and messages over. Many thanks! Jack ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 19:05:55 +0100 From: "Hans Trauner" To: Subject: Re: Hi-Tech Roland D.II -first impressions and a cry for colour-info! Message-ID: <000801c07d8b$79dfa540$70a072d4@custom-pc> Diego was kind enough to scan some pages of (b&w) schemes, I >chose to do Feiseler's machine. He also sent a scan of a cutaway, which was >quite nice for interior details. > > Diego and Gabe, ahemmm.... may I ask to share the scans?? I would be interested in Fieseler's scheme, also. Thanks, thanks! Hans ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:17:04 -0600 From: Ernest Thomas To: The List Subject: DrI cockpit instruments. Message-ID: <3A609B9D.8488ED00@bellsouth.net> Howdy Listee's, I was contacted by a guy asking for info on the above subject. I told him about the mag compass on the floor, rev counter on the cross brace, fuel gauge up between the gun barrels, switch on the port side wall and throttle/mixture/whatever control lever on the port side, and the hand pump on the starboard side. Anything else I may have missed? Smaller, 2nd hand pump? Magneto? anything? And if so, what is is and where does it go? E. Oh yeah, I forgot the triggers. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:37:06 -0800 From: "Bob Pearson" To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Purple SSW D.IV Message-ID: <200101131952.LAA09563@mail.rapidnet.net> That's Frank Ryder's repro .. there was lots of comments at the time on its spurious scheme (as on all of his aircraft). Bob ---------- >From: "Steven M.Perry" >To: Multiple recipients of list >Subject: Purple SSW D.IV >Date: Sat, Jan 13, 2001, 9:29 am > > On the PropPlanes list someone posted a photo of a SSW D.IV (1:1 scale and > almost surely a replica). The plane has an overall purple scheme including > the wings with yellow fin & rudder, wing tips and wheel covers. It has a > polished aluminum cowl. There is a yellow lion's head on the fuselage side. > > Anyone know if this is an accurate scheme or even loosely based on an actual > scheme and if so, whose? LMK > sp > I can send the photo as an attachment off list id anyone wants to see it. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 13:53:51 -0500 From: "Steven M.Perry" To: Subject: Re: Purple SSW D.IV Message-ID: <000701c07d92$2d1f5820$57f0aec7@default> > That's Frank Ryder's repro .. there was lots of comments at the time on its > spurious scheme (as on all of his aircraft). Thanks Bob, I'll pass that along. Still a beautiful aircraft, but why go to all the trouble of a replica and then paint it like a pimpmobile. Oh well, I guess Dicta Ira applies to 1:1 as well. sp ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 14:38:06 -0500 From: "Michael S. Alvarado" To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Hi-Tech Roland D.II -first impressions and a cry for colour-info! Message-ID: <3A60AE9E.20BB660E@bellatlantic.net> Diego, Please pretty please could you include me on a scan of the Roland cutaway. Accurate cockpit information is all that is holding me up on starting my Hi-Tech Roland. Cockpit details are important for us blind balloon scalers. Alvie Hans Trauner wrote: > Diego was kind enough to scan some pages of (b&w) schemes, I > >chose to do Feiseler's machine. He also sent a scan of a cutaway, which > was > >quite nice for interior details. > > > > Diego and Gabe, > ahemmm.... may I ask to share the scans?? I would be interested in > Fieseler's scheme, also. > Thanks, thanks! > > Hans ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:48:32 +0100 From: "Neil Crawford" To: Subject: RE: WW1 list OT Places of interest guide /Sweden Message-ID: <000a01c07d99$cfea9720$ccb397d4@default> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C07DA2.30DDF380 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thank you Michael for the correction, of course it's a DIII , I was just careless, it said Ph=F6nix 122 in the (old) museum brochure and I guessed it was a DI without checking, sorry. It's very nice and tremendously rare in any case. /Neil Linkoping;Sweden - Swedish Air Force Museum - Nieuport IVG - Macchi M7 - SK1 Albatross 120hp (2-seat Albatross similar to = BII) - CFV =D61 Tummelisa (swedish trainer from 1919) - Ph=F6nix 122 (DIII) =20 and lots of interesting ot stuff, also some old = engines. Stockholm, Sweden - Technical museum =20 -Albatross BII -Junkers F13 ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C07DA2.30DDF380 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thank you Michael for the correction, = of course=20 it's a DIII , I was
just careless, it said Ph=F6nix 122 in = the (old)=20 museum brochure
and I guessed it was a DI without = checking, sorry.=20 It's very
nice and tremendously rare in any=20 case.
/Neil

Linkoping;Sweden   - = Swedish Air=20 Force Museum
 
          &nbs= p;        -=20 Nieuport=20 IVG
           =        =20 - Macchi=20 M7
           &= nbsp;      =20 - SK1 Albatross 120hp (2-seat Albatross similar to=20 BII)
           = ;       =20 - CFV =D61 Tummelisa  (swedish trainer from=20 1919)
          &nbs= p;       =20 - Ph=F6nix 122=20 (DIII)
          &nb= sp;           &nbs= p;            = ;   =20
           &nb= sp;      =20 and lots of interesting ot stuff, also some old engines.
 

Stockholm, Sweden  - Technical = museum
          &nb= sp;       =20
           &nb= sp;      =20 -Albatross=20 BII
           =        =20 -Junkers F13
------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C07DA2.30DDF380-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:04:11 +0100 From: "Neil Crawford" To: Subject: Re: New images - judging systems Message-ID: <001301c07d9b$ffb48f40$ccb397d4@default> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C07DA4.60D11E80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tom wrote: >have seen that also at another show where 80% of the awards went to=20 >sponsoring club members, including about 80% of those to the club=20 >president/chief judge. Another reason to pay no attention to contest=20 >judging.) I can't agree with you on this Tom, I don't think this is common at IPMS shows. I think the ambition is always the very best, it's just so darn = difficult doing judging that makes it all a little haphazard. But on the whole I = think=20 they do as good a job as is humanly possible, and the result is usually=20 fairly correct. =20 >I have to say that, having done judging, I am constantly amazed at > >great-looking models that do not stand up when you examine in detail = the=20 >question of alignment. That's an issue that still gets me to this day, = and I=20 >am sure does all of you, too. I well remember knocking a former Nats=20 >winner's ot Fw-Dora thingie out of competition by looking at it from = directly=20 >above and noticing that the left main gear was far enough forward of = the=20 >right gear that I could see the difference even without a straightedge. = =20 >Great paint scheme, lots of good work in the cockpit, perfect decal=20 >application - and that landing gear. OTOH I think too much emphasis is put on finding mistakes, you saw the mistakes on the Dora, but maybe missed them on the model you preferred. Everyone makes mistakes, a good model is still a good model despite = them. >What gets me is when some over-stylized "IPMS style" paint scheme that = no=20 >airplane that ever existed ever looked like or ever will look like, = beats a=20 >scheme where you know the modeler did some research because it looks = "real." Agree completely here, I call it "the verlinden look" we've discussed it = before. But it=20 fooled some of the judges at the UK nat's in '98. Thats really what I = meant when I said, that I thought the judging standards had declined.=20 /Neil ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C07DA4.60D11E80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
 
 
Tom wrote:
>have seen that also at another show = where 80%=20 of the awards went to
>sponsoring club members, including = about  80%=20 of those to the club
>president/chief judge.  Another reason = to pay=20 no attention to contest
>judging.)
 
I can't agree with you on this = Tom, I don't=20 think this is common at IPMS
shows. I think the ambition is always = the very=20 best, it's just so darn difficult
doing judging that makes it all a=20 little haphazard. But on the whole I think 
they do as good a job as is humanly = possible, and=20 the result is usually 
fairly correct.    =
 
 
>I have to say that, having done = judging, I am=20 constantly amazed at >
>great-looking models that do not stand = up when=20 you examine in detail the
>question of alignment.  That's an = issue=20 that still gets me to this day, and I
>am sure does all of you,=20 too.  I well remember knocking a former Nats
>winner's ot = Fw-Dora=20 thingie out of competition by looking at it from directly
>above = and=20 noticing that the left main gear was far enough forward of the =
>right=20 gear that I could see the difference even without a straightedge. =20
>Great paint scheme, lots of good work in the cockpit, perfect = decal=20
>application  - and that landing gear.
 
OTOH I think too much emphasis is put = on finding=20 mistakes, you saw the
mistakes on the Dora, but maybe missed = them on the=20 model you preferred.
Everyone makes mistakes, a good model = is still a=20 good model despite them.
 
 
>What gets me is when some = over-stylized "IPMS=20 style" paint scheme that no
>airplane that ever existed ever = looked like=20 or ever will look like, beats a
>scheme where you know the = modeler did=20 some research because it looks "real."
 
Agree completely here, I call it "the = verlinden=20 look" we've discussed it before. But it
fooled some of the judges at the UK = nat's in '98.=20 Thats really what I meant when I
said, that I thought the judging = standards had=20 declined.
/Neil
 
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C07DA4.60D11E80-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:13:55 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Russian Troops in France Message-ID: <20010113201355.89012.qmail@web9006.mail.yahoo.com> John, Seems that I read something about this a few months ago. Can't remember the source right off but I'll look into it. It was a book on the Russian war effort. Todd --- John & Allison Cyganowski wrote: > I read an obscure reference to a batallion of > Imperial Russian Troops that > served on the Western Front. Apparently they > mutinied (not unlike their > French brethern) after heavy losses & the Russian > Revolution, The French > were supposed to have suppressed this mutiny with > artillery fire??? ~400 > were killed? Anybody have more details? > > Regards, > John Cyg. > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 12:15:47 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: More Eduard Message-ID: <20010113201547.89177.qmail@web9006.mail.yahoo.com> Or the Nieuport 21 from the 11 molds. Todd --- Witold Kozakiewicz wrote: > Todd Hayes napisał(a): > > > > Graham, > > > > I'm hoping Eduard will do a Nieuport 16 too. > > Shouldn't be too hard to adapt the Nie.11 molds. > > They will. Just like Nie.23 with Nie.17 > -- > Witold Kozakiewicz > > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 14:22:12 -0600 From: "Matt Bittner" To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Re: More Eduard Message-ID: <200101132022.MAA23521@swan.prod.itd.earthlink.net> On Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:20:10 -0500 (EST), Todd Hayes wrote: > Or the Nieuport 21 from the 11 molds. Wrong!!! The Nie.21 was a Nie.17 with a Nie.11 engine and cowl. Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 14:25:02 -0600 From: "Matt Bittner" To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Latest OtF Message-ID: <200101132024.MAA01290@swan.prod.itd.earthlink.net> 15/3 of Over the Front showed up today. There's a lot to get through in this issue! Luckily only one article on a British subject. :-) Seriously though, it's one of the better issues. Plus Bob has an ad for his CD in there, and supplies the excellent (although printed very dark) color profile of SPAD 7 S.1777 on the back cover. One interesting observation I didn't know - there were a couple of SPAD 7's that took part of the fly-over in which the multi-colored SPAD 13's flew that a few listee's supplied to IM. Very interesting. You do learn something new every day. Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:40:44 -0500 From: "TOM PLESHA" To: Subject: Re: New images - judging systems Message-ID: <002201c07da1$1aa4f9c0$55464c0c@tom> Last year I entered my first and last model contest. The show was sponsoed by an IPSM club. I entered 2 aircraft. 1 was fairly well detailed: moved control surfaces, scratch built items: fully detailed cockpit, radiators, landing gear, etc. the 2cnd wasn't quite as detailed. An aquaintence hired a club member to build for him 5 models, all of which were entered. Needless to say they were the winners. My wife and I happened to observe the judging along with other non-club members. They only examined those 5 models. Enough said. Build for your enjoyment. Tom ---- Original Message ----- From: "Neil Crawford" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2001 3:09 PM Subject: Re: New images - judging systems > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > > ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C07DA4.60D11E80 > Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > > Tom wrote: > >have seen that also at another show where 80% of the awards went to=20 > >sponsoring club members, including about 80% of those to the club=20 > >president/chief judge. Another reason to pay no attention to contest=20 > >judging.) > > I can't agree with you on this Tom, I don't think this is common at IPMS > shows. I think the ambition is always the very best, it's just so darn = > difficult > doing judging that makes it all a little haphazard. But on the whole I = > think=20 > they do as good a job as is humanly possible, and the result is usually=20 > fairly correct. =20 > > > >I have to say that, having done judging, I am constantly amazed at > > >great-looking models that do not stand up when you examine in detail = > the=20 > >question of alignment. That's an issue that still gets me to this day, = > and I=20 > >am sure does all of you, too. I well remember knocking a former Nats=20 > >winner's ot Fw-Dora thingie out of competition by looking at it from = > directly=20 > >above and noticing that the left main gear was far enough forward of = > the=20 > >right gear that I could see the difference even without a straightedge. = > =20 > >Great paint scheme, lots of good work in the cockpit, perfect decal=20 > >application - and that landing gear. > > OTOH I think too much emphasis is put on finding mistakes, you saw the > mistakes on the Dora, but maybe missed them on the model you preferred. > Everyone makes mistakes, a good model is still a good model despite = > them. > > > >What gets me is when some over-stylized "IPMS style" paint scheme that = > no=20 > >airplane that ever existed ever looked like or ever will look like, = > beats a=20 > >scheme where you know the modeler did some research because it looks = > "real." > > Agree completely here, I call it "the verlinden look" we've discussed it = > before. But it=20 > fooled some of the judges at the UK nat's in '98. Thats really what I = > meant when I > said, that I thought the judging standards had declined.=20 > /Neil > > > > > ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C07DA4.60D11E80 > Content-Type: text/html; > charset="iso-8859-1" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > > > > http-equiv=3DContent-Type> > > > > >
 
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Tom wrote:
>
>have seen that also at another show = > where 80%=20 > of the awards went to
>sponsoring club members, including = > about  80%=20 > of those to the club
>president/chief judge.  Another reason = > to pay=20 > no attention to contest
>judging.)
>
 
>
I can't agree with you on this = > Tom, I don't=20 > think this is common at IPMS
>
shows. I think the ambition is always = > the very=20 > best, it's just so darn difficult
>
doing judging that makes it all a=20 > little haphazard. But on the whole I think 
>
they do as good a job as is humanly = > possible, and=20 > the result is usually 
>
fairly correct.    = >
>
 
>
 
>
>I have to say that, having done = > judging, I am=20 > constantly amazed at >
>great-looking models that do not stand = > up when=20 > you examine in detail the
>question of alignment.  That's an = > issue=20 > that still gets me to this day, and I
>am sure does all of you,=20 > too.  I well remember knocking a former Nats
>winner's ot = > Fw-Dora=20 > thingie out of competition by looking at it from directly
>above = > and=20 > noticing that the left main gear was far enough forward of the = >
>right=20 > gear that I could see the difference even without a straightedge. =20 >
>Great paint scheme, lots of good work in the cockpit, perfect = > decal=20 >
>application  - and that landing gear.
>
 
>
OTOH I think too much emphasis is put = > on finding=20 > mistakes, you saw the
>
mistakes on the Dora, but maybe missed = > them on the=20 > model you preferred.
>
Everyone makes mistakes, a good model = > is still a=20 > good model despite them.
>
 
>
 
>
>What gets me is when some = > over-stylized "IPMS=20 > style" paint scheme that no
>airplane that ever existed ever = > looked like=20 > or ever will look like, beats a
>scheme where you know the = > modeler did=20 > some research because it looks "real."
>
 
>
Agree completely here, I call it "the = > verlinden=20 > look" we've discussed it before. But it
>
fooled some of the judges at the UK = > nat's in '98.=20 > Thats really what I meant when I
>
said, that I thought the judging = > standards had=20 > declined.
>
/Neil
>
 
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> > ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C07DA4.60D11E80-- > > ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 2971 **********************