WWI Digest 2869 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Shanghai Dragon Spad XIII by Todd Hayes 2) Re: do you still remember... by TomTheAeronut@aol.com 3) Re: Nie.28 by "David Calhoun" 4) Re: DH4 in balloon scale?? by "John & Allison Cyganowski" 5) Re: Jacobs -god of the North wind by "Steve Lawson" 6) Re: Glencoe N. 28 by Marc Flake 7) Re: Norwegian Taube photos by =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ro=A7bud?= 8) Re: Glencoe N. 28 by KarrArt@aol.com 9) DH4 in balloon scale by "Charlie and Linda Duckworth" 10) RE: Nie.28 by "Ray Boorman" 11) Re: Albatros Axle attachment ? by "Limon3" 12) Re: photographic musings by "Stefen Karver" 13) Norwegian Taube photos by knut.erik.hagen@eunet.no (Knut Erik Hagen) 14) RE: photographic musings by Shane Weier 15) Weathering leather by "Edward Swaim" 16) Blue Rider Decals by Todd Hayes 17) RE: photographic musings by Shane Weier 18) Re: Wish List by DavidL1217@aol.com 19) Re: photographic musings by "Stefen Karver" 20) RE: photographic musings by Shane Weier 21) Re: photographic musings by "Stefen Karver" 22) RE: photographic musings by Shane Weier ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 15:41:05 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Shanghai Dragon Spad XIII Message-ID: <20001204234105.88804.qmail@web9009.mail.yahoo.com> Did anyone notice the sale price for this kit in Squadron's latest flyer? $9.99. Great price! 9 of 10 for kit quality. 0 of 10 for box art. Reed Chambers attacking a German observation balloon in 1919?! TH __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 20:40:17 EST From: TomTheAeronut@aol.com To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: do you still remember... Message-ID: <55.e2cfa4e.275da181@aol.com> In a message dated 12/4/00 5:50:12 PM EST, tskio4@home.com writes: << Can't rember the N # later burned in a hangar fire 2.7 hours of dual befor soloing Tom S >> Now we have proof that Solinsky really is a bird-brain, since only a bird could do that! :-) TC ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 20:54:42 -0800 From: "David Calhoun" To: Subject: Re: Nie.28 Message-ID: <008a01c05e77$7c9c2160$10f13ccc@oemcomputer> Hi Dave, Rosemont makes a resin correction set for the Glencoe N.28, new cowl with cooling holes and vertical stabilizer. I built this kit ( the original K&B version) a few years ago. Could use a replacement engine & Vickers guns from Aeroclub. Not a bad kit, but I recently held the Blue Max fuselage half against the Glencoe half. The Glencoe is over 1/4" too long, maybe the original Aurora kit was larger than 1/48 scale. With a scratchbuilt interior it can look really sharp, but not as accurate in shape & scale as the Blue Max kit. But the Glencoe has great decals. (it's missing Rickenbackers white 12 though.) Dave Calhoun ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Acosta" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 2:44 PM Subject: Re: Nie.28 > Dave- > I picked up the Glencoe Ni.28 for about $7.50 just for the decals. I don't know about the kit itself, but I don't think you need to look much farther for good markings. > KA > > >>> dora9@sprynet.com 12/04/00 04:33PM >>> > Hey Guys, > > Just picked up two kits: the incredible Spit IX from ICM (hey, it's a > pretty airplane and one hell of a nice kit - where's my SPAD VII??!!) and > the Glencoe Nie.28. Any opinions on this kit? It looks like a competent > starting point, but what the hell do I know? Any good decal suggestions? > > Did Eduard ever do a Nie.25? > > > DB > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 20:48:40 -0500 From: "John & Allison Cyganowski" To: Subject: Re: DH4 in balloon scale?? Message-ID: <002f01c05e5d$7efa5b80$5638183f@cyrixp166> Glencoe is maybe holding the whip hand here. The little guys aren't going to do a vac or a resin subject if Glencoe will eat their lunch with an injection mold kit. Glencoe is not going to release theirs until they have some expectation of profitability. In the meantime we are out in the cold. Cyg. ----- Original Message ----- From: Todd Hayes To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 8:37 PM Subject: Re: DH4 in balloon scale?? > Maybe, now that the Albatros DH4 special is out, > someone will do an accurate 1:48 DH4. Aeroclub is > planning a DH9. > > TH > > --- "David C. Fletcher" wrote: > > Mark Vaughan-Jackson wrote: > > > > "1/48 scale DH4 by Glencoe. . . anyone know when > > this is to be > > released???" > > > > They've had the tooling for years - it's the old AMT > > kit. The release > > seems to be onagain/off again. The archives have > > more. You might be > > quicker finding the original issue! > > > > Dave Fletcher > > -- > > Visit us at our Home Page: > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. > http://shopping.yahoo.com/ > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 20:58:27 -0500 From: "Steve Lawson" To: Subject: Re: Jacobs -god of the North wind Message-ID: <00Dec4.210121est.119046@gatekeeper.bop.gov> >>> "Stefen Karver" 11/20/00 07:57AM >>> "Steve Lawson" Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2000 10:14 PM Lawson---"... It is enough for me as a historian first to accept Jacobs own description. The selected works of Mr. Neal O'Connor are of the most value in these areas..." Karver---Which is what precisely, and where if you please..." Lawson response. Aviation Awards of Imperial Germany in WW1 Vol. 1-6 Esp. Vol. 4. O'Connor Neal. Cross & Cockade Int. Vol. 25 Journals #2&3 Cross & Cockade USA Vol. 6 #4. Datfile "Special" on Fok.Dr.I types. Lawson---"... For modelers you can't go wrong with the DML interpretation in their decals for kit #5906 1/48 Fok. Dr.I..." Karver---Which is what exactly, since not all us poor modelers buy every kit to have their decals as scholarly reference material..." Lawson Response--- What, you cant spend 20.00 on a Shangai Dragon Kit? Gad, man your lazy. Do you have to be spoon fed too? Lawson---"...The Super Scale decals are more in a characture form ( like a comic strip or cartoon) and they (with willful ignorance) deviated from Dan Abbott's recommendations..." Karver---"...I believe Mr. Abbott rather prefers the honorific he was given: Dan-San. And his recommendations are what exactly and where can poor plastic maniacs find them published?..." Lawson response---Since Mr.Dan San Abbott is god-father to all 5 of my children, I believe that I can get away with calling him anything I choose. His recommendations could be gleaned by contacting him at the Aerodrome or are you too lazy for that too? Lawson---"... Americal /Gryphon 's Jacobs sheet is somewhat simplistic, but so was this particular marking in its original form..." Karver---" And there is the problem with decals. Which makes the A/G representation accurate...or what?..." Lawson response---The decals are silk screened which tends to leave a micro-jagged edge. They are fine for basic markings but the DML type will do better in IPMS competitions. Lawson---"... The balance of Greg Van Wyngarden's reply to Matt Bittner Nov.12, 2000 is right on..." Karver---"...Although I searched the List Archive I could not find GvW's reply..." Lawson response---Then you need to contact Mr. Bittner as he was the one Greg van Wyngarden (Not GvW as you put it) was writing to. Greg simply ask my response. Lawson---"... I would add that the "god of the North wind" is not satanic in origin..." Karver---"...as another contributor noted, Jacobs himself referred to his emblem as a devil's head (teufelkopf). So that's a problem..." Lawson response--- No its not a problem Jacobs referred to the emblem as the "god of the north wind", "a witch" and "a devil" at various times. Haven't you read anything but the modeler's page? Lawson---"... At best it is a copy of a turn of the century illustration probably found in a child's story book..." Karver---"...Cheap Internet speculation?..." Lawson response--- No the educated guess from the guy who has read ,translated,retranslated and published entirely Jacobs own diary, with the backing and editing of real fellow historians. Don't let the fact that I'm an honorary member of the Lafayette Flying Corps sway you. Lawson---"... It represents one of the four winds detailed in Norse mythology. The winds were allied to the Frost Giants..." Karver---"...If so then why is the chap a blowing hot flames out of his mouth?..." Lawson response--- The mechanic may not have had any blue to use. Jacobs may have felt that he literally was burning the enemy with the icy hot breath of the god of the north wind. Pick the story you feel good about but the truth is we dont know and Jacobs probably didn't care. He did the drawing for Neal O'Connor, we can live with that or speculate just don't call the speculation history Karver continues---"...in which case a study of emulsion sensitivity may be worth the fatigue it engenders." Lawson response--- Did it take you all this time to figure that out? ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// ////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 20:12:55 -0600 From: Marc Flake To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Glencoe N. 28 Message-ID: <3A2C4F27.6302@airmail.net> As I recall, there are too many fuselage stringers, the vertical tail is too big and the cowl is wrong. Rosemont sells a tail, cowl and wheels to correct those parts. Check the archives for suggestions on the fuselage stringers -- there's been some discussion of it earlier this year, I think. I built mine with the Rosemont correction set, added Aeroclub guns and engine and scratchbuilt the interior. But I didn't do diddly about the fuselage. It looks okay to me and I'm not going to let it out of the house. I used the little cairn terrier looking for rats decals. I had no trouble with the application. It's my only OT 1/48 so far. Marc ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 04 Dec 2000 20:13:24 -0600 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ro=A7bud?= To: Knut Erik Hagen Subject: Re: Norwegian Taube photos Message-ID: <3A2C4F44.EF82B67D@webster.sk.ca> Hello Knut, Thankyou for bringing this to my attention. These photos were contributed within the last month. As you might imagine, I receive many images from visitors to my page. The intention of this archive is to make images available to modellers and enthusiasts without infringment on others. The first words on my page state: This @rchive is intended to provide unique, unusual and hard-to-find images. I believe all images linked from this page are in the public domain (unless otherwise indicated ©) If you have copyrights to any image; please email me and I will promptly respond. (additionally, I have written) Feel free to email me if you have any corrections, suggestions or contributions. When images are contributed I take descriptions and/or captions at face value unless I can, through research or existing knowledge, expand or correct them. My apologies for any inconvenience this has caused. Furthermore if these images were not made available to the public I will remove them immeadiately. Otherwise, if you prefer, I can retain them with correct caption and credit given. VBR Rod Filan Ro§bud's WWI Aviation Image Archive http://www.geocities.com/aerodromeaces _________________________________________________________________________ When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, and there you will always long to return. - Leonardo da Vinci Knut Erik Hagen wrote: > Hei, > > Someone has copied the Taube pictures I made available for our lists > World War 1 Photos, possibly changed resolution and put them on > the page below with completely wrong captions. > Norwegian aircraft Start was never part of the Imperial Naval Air Service. > > I wanted the pictures to be available for modellers and enthusiasts, > did not want to see them uploaded with false captions on other pages. > > Always willing to share reference material, but I prefer that people > ask first and use it properly. > > Does someone on the list know the Email adress for the web-master > Rosebud? so I can contact him regarding this? > > Eders > Knut Erik > > >I just found this site. Its probably old news to some but I'm sure others > >might find it usefull. Especially if you are looking for pictures if F1's > > > >http://www.geocities.com/aw3aw3/archive.htm > >Ray > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 21:21:45 EST From: KarrArt@aol.com To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Glencoe N. 28 Message-ID: In a message dated 12/4/00 6:15:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, mflake@airmail.net writes: << As I recall, there are too many fuselage stringers, the vertical tail is too big and the cowl is wrong. >> That's the main thing- too many stringers, and the spaces between them are rather deep gullies. The Glencoe cowl is workable, and easy to correct (far easier than the heavy metal Blue Max). Also, most flying surfaces are a bit oversize, but it's also pretty easy to knock these down a little. RK ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 20:50:33 -0600 From: "Charlie and Linda Duckworth" To: "wwi-faq" Subject: DH4 in balloon scale Message-ID: <005701c05e66$351ad540$ce2c57d8@unionrai> >Maybe, now that the Albatros DH4 special is out, >someone will do an accurate 1:48 DH4. Aeroclub is >planning a DH9. Since the wings, tail, and back part of the fuselage are all off the D.H.4 I can't imagine Aeroclub not bring this model out after the D.H.9 (plus the paint schemes being more numerous). They could also model the three different fuselage configurations where the observer/gunner sat. After buying the Air-Britain DH4/DH9 File I'd like to see the D.H.9A done too. What a great looking aircraft it was - plus they've got an example to measure and photograph at Hendon. Charlie ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 18:45:10 -0800 From: "Ray Boorman" To: Subject: RE: Nie.28 Message-ID: The great thing about most of the Glencoe OT kits are the decals. IMHO usually you can pick up Glencoe models for a few dollars (10-12) and they are worth it for the decals alone. You can build the model as a have fun kit if you want... of course avoid the Albatros at all costs;) Ray -----Original Message----- From: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu [mailto:wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu]On Behalf Of David Calhoun Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 5:55 PM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Nie.28 Hi Dave, Rosemont makes a resin correction set for the Glencoe N.28, new cowl with cooling holes and vertical stabilizer. I built this kit ( the original K&B version) a few years ago. Could use a replacement engine & Vickers guns from Aeroclub. Not a bad kit, but I recently held the Blue Max fuselage half against the Glencoe half. The Glencoe is over 1/4" too long, maybe the original Aurora kit was larger than 1/48 scale. With a scratchbuilt interior it can look really sharp, but not as accurate in shape & scale as the Blue Max kit. But the Glencoe has great decals. (it's missing Rickenbackers white 12 though.) Dave Calhoun ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ken Acosta" To: "Multiple recipients of list" Sent: Monday, December 04, 2000 2:44 PM Subject: Re: Nie.28 > Dave- > I picked up the Glencoe Ni.28 for about $7.50 just for the decals. I don't know about the kit itself, but I don't think you need to look much farther for good markings. > KA > > >>> dora9@sprynet.com 12/04/00 04:33PM >>> > Hey Guys, > > Just picked up two kits: the incredible Spit IX from ICM (hey, it's a > pretty airplane and one hell of a nice kit - where's my SPAD VII??!!) and > the Glencoe Nie.28. Any opinions on this kit? It looks like a competent > starting point, but what the hell do I know? Any good decal suggestions? > > Did Eduard ever do a Nie.25? > > > DB > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 19:14:41 -0800 From: "Limon3" To: Subject: Re: Albatros Axle attachment ? Message-ID: <009501c05e69$831d81e0$51f7303f@f4w2s5> Hi Jon, I have a close up picture from the DF on the DV that shows how the bungee was attached to the strut. It seems that it was wrapped around a pair of pegs welded to the strut, one front, one back. If I can find my DF I'll be happy to scan the photo. I think the DIII was exactly the same. Gabe. -----Original Message----- From: JVT7532@aol.com To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Monday, December 04, 2000 11:50 AM Subject: Albatros Axle attachment ? >Afternoon to everyone, I have a question about the Albatros D.lll axle. Just >how is the axle held on to the Landing gear, are there guide blocks? I have >read somewhere that rubber bungees were used, were these just wrapped around >the axle and struts? I have checked my books and while one can see many >pictures of wheels on the outside, the area of attachment for the axle is >always in the shadows or is just to far away to see very well. Can anyone >tell or show me just how this attachment looks? After all the work I went >through to get these metal LG. struts on I would like the axle attachment to >look proper. Thanks a bunch, > > Best regards, > Jon >Jon V. Theisen >7532 Lawndale Ave. >Phila., PA 19111-2706 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 09:55:15 -0500 From: "Stefen Karver" To: Subject: Re: photographic musings Message-ID: <000101c05ecc$5e420c20$446dd6d8@stephen> "Shane Weier" wrote |*many* | photographers of that period still made and coated their own plates Assuming Shane means glass plates, most assuredly not, given the universal availability of the infinitely more user-friendly and dependable flexible-support films that were being manufactured at the time: roll, pack, and cut sheet. This is especially the case with respect to the amateur aviation photography that must constitute 90% or more of the surviving images of OT interest. Considering the field conditions under which the vast majority of these photos were taken, any photographer lugging around glass plates and risking the loss of his work because of breakage or darkroom mishaps must be considered seriously out of touch with reality. Given the population involved, if there were many such, we could legitimately expect to see not just a few examples of such flaws. The only ones I can think of are the Holtzem photos, and they are a perfect example of the reason for not using plates! If the American experience can be extrapolated to wartime Europe, the great majority of photographs were taken using amateur folding cameras whose closed size was barely larger than the average serious 35-mm SLR (Nikon, etc.), and some small enough to fit in one's pocket. These cameras took daylight-loading roll film, which was, as far as I can tell, universally orthochromatic. And as far as there being many differennt emulsions, given the (relatively) high-tech requirements of manufacturing consumer-targeted roll film, as well as the associated downstream marketing costs, there were, in fact, relatively few companies that had the skills, experience, and capitalization to produce them. In the US, Kodak, of course, was dominant; but they had a 'worldwide' presence, at least pre-war. In Germany, Agfa. One of the frustrating shortcomings of OT photo collections--aside from their relatively poos quality on the whole--is the neglect of such basic cataloging information as image size and, where known, "state" (i.e., original or copy print, contact print or enlargement), since such information could help identify the camera and emulsion type used in taking the photograph. VBR, Stef ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 04:17:51 +0100 (CET) From: knut.erik.hagen@eunet.no (Knut Erik Hagen) To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ro=A7bud?= Cc: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Norwegian Taube photos Message-ID: <200012050317.EAA73167@mail-relay.eunet.no> Rod, Please check http//pease1.sr.unh.edu/Photos/Various/Nor_Taube/index.html I expect you to remove the images with their false captions from your page ASAP, they should not be taken out of their context and be presented as Austrian or whatever country the Imperial Naval Air Service is supposed to represent. If you wants to have a link for Taube pictures pointing to the original page, thats fine with me - because the captions there are correct as far as I know. Rgds Knut Erik >Thankyou for bringing this to my attention. These photos were contributed >within the last month. As you might imagine, I receive many images from >visitors to my page. The intention of this archive is to make images available >to modellers and enthusiasts without infringment on others. The first words on >my page state: > >This @rchive is intended to provide unique, unusual and hard-to-find images. >I believe all images linked from this page are in the public domain (unless >otherwise indicated ©) >If you have copyrights to any image; please email me and I will promptly >respond. >(additionally, I have written) >Feel free to email me if you have any corrections, suggestions or >contributions. > >When images are contributed I take descriptions and/or captions at face value >unless I can, through research or existing knowledge, expand or correct them. > >My apologies for any inconvenience this has caused. Furthermore if these >images were not made available to the public I will remove them immeadiately. >Otherwise, if you prefer, I can retain them with correct caption and credit >given. > >VBR >Rod Filan > >Ro§bud's WWI Aviation Image Archive >http://www.geocities.com/aerodromeaces > >_________________________________________________________________________ >When once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your >eyes turned skyward, >for there you have been, and there you will always long to return. >- Leonardo da Vinci > >Knut Erik Hagen wrote: > >> Hei, >> >> Someone has copied the Taube pictures I made available for our lists >> World War 1 Photos, possibly changed resolution and put them on >> the page below with completely wrong captions. >> Norwegian aircraft Start was never part of the Imperial Naval Air Service. >> >> I wanted the pictures to be available for modellers and enthusiasts, >> did not want to see them uploaded with false captions on other pages. >> >> Always willing to share reference material, but I prefer that people >> ask first and use it properly. >> >> Does someone on the list know the Email adress for the web-master >> Rosebud? so I can contact him regarding this? >> >> Eders >> Knut Erik >> >> >I just found this site. Its probably old news to some but I'm sure others >> >might find it usefull. Especially if you are looking for pictures if F1's >> > >> >http://www.geocities.com/aw3aw3/archive.htm >> >Ray >> > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 13:23:48 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: photographic musings Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C71621D4C@mimhexch1.mim.com.au> Stef says: > > |*many* > | photographers of that period still made and coated their own plates > > Assuming Shane means glass plates, most assuredly not, given > the universal > availability of the infinitely more user-friendly and dependable > flexible-support films that were being manufactured at the > time: Mmmm. Allora (my home town) has a quite impressive small museum. Therein (and I catalogued them, so I know) they hold some 400+ glass photo plates taken during WW1 by surviving soldiers. All of them retain images which can be printed, though most suffer from spotting due to various moulds, and damage from finger prints, scratches, cracking etc. They also have about 20 frames from original WW1 film negatives. All are copies on to 4" x 5" Kodak sheet film, done by me in the early 1980's in an effort to save the then already almost lost images. > If the American experience can be extrapolated to wartime > Europe, the great > majority of photographs were taken using amateur folding cameras whose > closed size was barely larger than the average serious 35-mm > SLR Seems unlikely to me. The proportion of original glass plates to original film in the AWM collection certainly doesn't support it either IIRC. Of course, the record by US soldiers will vary from the record by Australian ones. For one thing, the Australians were there for years, not months and highly unlikely to own cameras unless they were "official" in some capacity. Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 21:16:40 -0600 From: "Edward Swaim" To: Subject: Weathering leather Message-ID: <000301c05e6d$d350ada0$541696cf@hppav> A technique I'm just learning on figures is underpainting by putting down a base coat of acrylic, laying down a wash of a darker color, drybrushing the highlights, then glazing with burn sienna. The oil provides rich color and depth, but you don't have to blend it. Edward & Anna Swaim 36 Rosemont Drive Little Rock, Arkansas 72204 501-661-9879 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 18:54:55 -0800 (PST) From: Todd Hayes To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Blue Rider Decals Message-ID: <20001205025455.7698.qmail@web9007.mail.yahoo.com> I'm interested in the 1:48 Italian Squadriligia and Imperial Russian sheets by Blue Rider. Does anyone on the list have these? Are they any good? TH __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products. http://shopping.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 13:59:36 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: photographic musings Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C71621D4D@mimhexch1.mim.com.au> Stef says: > And as far as there being many differennt emulsions, given > the (relatively) > high-tech requirements of manufacturing consumer-targeted > roll film, One more thing. You seem intent on extrapolating a comment re emulsions on plate to suggest that I'm claiming that there were a large variety of film emulsions. This is in fact, not so, and not what I said. One other minor point. My mother, a photographic and darkroom enthusiast since long before I was born still has magazines from the 1950's and 1960's with recipes for coating glass plates - and lengthy arguments regarding the advisability of adding or subtracting from this or that chemical component. A long time after the hey-day of the glass negative ! Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 4 Dec 2000 23:21:34 EST From: DavidL1217@aol.com To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Wish List Message-ID: <9.dd4725e.275dc74e@aol.com> Caudron G-VI (6) in 1/48. Maybe once I finish my correct 3-view drawing. The drawing in French Aircraft ... is so incorrect, I think it's the GV mislabeled. I have several photos from a friend, including WWI era photos along with a copy of the French wing cellual drawings. Hope to have it drawn up by month's end. The plane was extensively used during the middle of the war. Was a large plane for the early Caudron G4 style wing warping arrangement. It also had a removable fairing that went over and over-sized cockpit cut-out. Pilots head was in between the two props, a religious experience. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 11:35:02 -0500 From: "Stefen Karver" To: Subject: Re: photographic musings Message-ID: <003801c05ed9$537ba460$fd6dd6d8@stephen> "Shane Weier" caviled with an anecdote: | One other minor point. My mother, a photographic and darkroom enthusiast | since long before I was born still has magazines from the 1950's and 1960's | with recipes for coating glass plates - and lengthy arguments regarding the | advisability of adding or subtracting from this or that chemical component. | | A long time after the hey-day of the glass negative ! Would Shane suggest that *many* amateurs of those days of yore actually cooked up these arcane photographic soufflés? I knew some photographers of a hermetic tendency who made up their own platinum paper in the '70s, probably while chanting cabalistic mantras. No, let me make that one--or was it two?. Should I confess to using Printing Out Paper in a contact frame using sunlight? Oh, that wonderfully soft, long tonal scale. Don't get me started. I can't remember whether I yearned for Gaslight Paper, too. But I did mourn the extinction of Velour Black. I will be happy to go toe to toe with Shane in the Hypo Wars any time, anyplace. Stef ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 14:52:45 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: photographic musings Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C71621D52@mimhexch1.mim.com.au> Stef, > "Shane Weier" > caviled with an anecdote: Cavilled? My apology for introducing a fact instead of a long winded assertion. And I note that you ignored the other facts in favour of abuse. > I will be happy to go toe to toe with Shane in the Hypo Wars any time, > anyplace. Grow up. Every time someone fails to agree with a Karver dictum need not threaten your manhood. Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 12:04:39 -0500 From: "Stefen Karver" To: Subject: Re: photographic musings Message-ID: <005101c05edd$762b33a0$fd6dd6d8@stephen> "Shane Weier" sez | Seems unlikely to me. The proportion of original glass plates to original | film in the AWM collection certainly doesn't support it either IIRC. The relative proportions of surviving negative by support type circa 1980 does not necessarily, and indeed should hardly be expected to, accurately reflect the original period population. The one advantage of glass plates, assuming of course that they are, or can be, stored under anything approaching archival conditions, is their durability and dimensional stability. As he notes himself, the condition of the film negatives was poor. While the nitrate-based roll and sheet films had the short-term advantages I noted in my previous, they were, among other things, notoriously flammable, and, in fact, cinematic history is the poorer because of some truly catastrophic demonstrations of this property. So while there are thousands of paper prints made from flexible-support negatives--and perhaps thousands more copy prints made from them in turn--relatively fewer of these negatives have survived--or been considered worth inclusion in institutional collections. | Of course, the record by US soldiers will vary from the record by Australian | ones. For one thing, the Australians were there for years, not months and | highly unlikely to own cameras unless they were "official" in some capacity. Of course, of course. But 1. why wouldn't Australians own cameras, when, in Austria, for example, there was a model specifically aimed at the poor front-line footsoldier? And 2. if the AWM negative collection is dominated by the output of 'official' photography then that would skew the sample. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 5 Dec 2000 15:25:59 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: photographic musings Message-ID: <7186131CB805D411A60E0090272F7C71621D55@mimhexch1.mim.com.au> Stef, > But 1. why wouldn't Australians own cameras, when, in > Austria, for example, > there was a model specifically aimed at the poor front-line > footsoldier? Just like the British, personal photography was frowned upon. Care to guess why there are so few photos of British WW1 aircraft compared to German ones? Shane ********************************************************************** The information contained in this e-mail is confidential and is intended only for the use of the addressee(s). If you receive this e-mail in error, any use, distribution or copying of this e-mail is not permitted. You are requested to forward unwanted e-mail and address any problems to the MIM Holdings Limited Support Centre. e-mail: supportcentre@mim.com.au phone: Australia 1800500646 ********************************************************************** ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 2869 **********************