WWI Digest 2305 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: I hereby nominate for cannonization by Ernest Thomas 2) Re: I hereby nominate for cannonization by Ernest Thomas 3) Re: New chant, was, Re: Roland... by Albatrosdv@aol.com 4) Go here for Hiero Engine by skarver@banet.net 5) Re: Go here for Hiero Engine by "Ray Boorman" 6) RE: May's Internet Modeler by "dfernet0" 7) Re: Go here for Hiero Engine by skarver@banet.net 8) Re: OK, it's ot, but.... by Mark Vaughan-Jackson 9) Re: Your Grammarian-ship, was, Re: Roland CII by Mark Vaughan-Jackson 10) Modelkrak Russian WW1 armored cars by "Matt Bittner" 11) Re: Subscribed but no messages by Allan Wright 12) Re: Your Grammarian-ship, was, Re: Roland CII by Otisgood@aol.com 13) E.'s Bug by Brent_A_Theobald@notes.seagate.com 14) Re: E.'s Bug by Otisgood@aol.com 15) Re: Your Grammarian-ship, was, Re: Roland CII by Mark Vaughan-Jackson 16) Ilya search by Mark Vaughan-Jackson 17) Re: Ilya search by "Matt Bittner" 18) Re: OK, it's ot, but.... by "DAVID BURKE" 19) Re: Subs by "DAVID BURKE" 20) Re: Subs by "Paul Schwartzkopf" 21) Re: insanity IS the fun part wasRe: Roland Color Quandra by "DAVID BURKE" 22) Re: Dicta Ira..... was Roland Color Quandra by "DAVID BURKE" 23) Re: Subs by "DAVID BURKE" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 22:10:24 -0500 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: I hereby nominate for cannonization Message-ID: <390E471F.40420BAF@bellsouth.net> Brent_A_Theobald@notes.seagate.com wrote: > Is it covered with four or five color lozenge? Nope! Green and black/green splinter. Told ya I was a heretic. E. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 May 2000 22:22:58 -0500 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: I hereby nominate for cannonization Message-ID: <390E4A11.B0835EA0@bellsouth.net> John Glaser wrote: > No loz. but IIRC Ernie mounted twin Spandaus in the bonnet to clear a path > for himself on the West Bank Expressway. Of course I did. That's the way to Hobbies West E. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 23:48:14 EDT From: Albatrosdv@aol.com To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: New chant, was, Re: Roland... Message-ID: In a message dated 5/1/00 9:25:45 PM EST, sdw@qld.mim.com.au writes: << In either case it isn't and never was an instruction to have fun at the expense of accuracy JUST to have fun. Shane >> Thank you, sir. Tom Cleaver ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 01:13:26 -0400 From: skarver@banet.net To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Go here for Hiero Engine Message-ID: <390E63F6.4F2C020D@banet.net> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------CC342B10D527FC120CF2346D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Someone recently posted an ISO for the Hiero. The link on the WW1 Page appears not to be working, but the following does: http://www.museovirtuale.polito.it/english/memoria/4-02/4-201/float/ac010.htm In 1914 Otto Hieronimus manufactured the six cylinder Hiero E engine, which was directly derived from the 4 cylinder engines designed leaving from 1908, at Laurin & Clement and then at Werner Pfleider. The propulsor showed typical constructive features typical of vertical line six cylinder units: aluminium bed, cast iron cylinder, release by two valves per cylinder controlled by bars and rockers, with the cam-shaft in the bed, dual start by two Bosch magnets. The engine was assembled on the Albatros B 1 biplane and then on Löhner M and L seaplanes and on the Llpyd CII scout biplane --------------CC342B10D527FC120CF2346D Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1; name="ac010.htm" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ac010.htm" Content-Base: "http://www.museovirtuale.polito.it/eng lish/memoria/4-02/4-201/float/ac010 .htm" Content-Location: "http://www.museovirtuale.polito.it/eng lish/memoria/4-02/4-201/float/ac010 .htm" Hiero E
  Hiero E
Warschalowski, Eissler & Co. AG-Vienna, Austria 1914
  Hiero E


In 1914 Otto Hieronimus manufactured the six cylinder Hiero E engine, which was directly derived from the 4 cylinder engines designed leaving from 1908, at Laurin & Clement and then at Werner Pfleider.
The propulsor showed typical constructive features typical of vertical line six cylinder units: aluminium bed, cast iron cylinder, release by two valves per cylinder controlled by bars and rockers, with the cam-shaft in the bed, dual start by two Bosch magnets. The engine was assembled on the Albatros B 1 biplane and then on Löhner M and L seaplanes and on the Llpyd CII scout biplane

 
--------------CC342B10D527FC120CF2346D-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 May 2000 22:54:46 -0700 From: "Ray Boorman" To: Subject: Re: Go here for Hiero Engine Message-ID: <001f01bfb3fa$ec27f220$9b1335d1@bconnected.net> Wow, that's a great picture and even better site. I tried backing up a level or two and looking at other pictures. Most are ot but wow. All sorts of structural members for aircraft etc. Ray ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Multiple recipients of list Sent: Monday, May 01, 2000 10:20 PM Subject: Go here for Hiero Engine This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------CC342B10D527FC120CF2346D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Someone recently posted an ISO for the Hiero. The link on the WW1 Page appears not to be working, but the following does: http://www.museovirtuale.polito.it/english/memoria/4-02/4-201/float/ac010.ht m In 1914 Otto Hieronimus manufactured the six cylinder Hiero E engine, which was directly derived from the 4 cylinder engines designed leaving from 1908, at Laurin & Clement and then at Werner Pfleider. The propulsor showed typical constructive features typical of vertical line six cylinder units: aluminium bed, cast iron cylinder, release by two valves per cylinder controlled by bars and rockers, with the cam-shaft in the bed, dual start by two Bosch magnets. The engine was assembled on the Albatros B 1 biplane and then on Löhner M and L seaplanes and on the Llpyd CII scout biplane --------------CC342B10D527FC120CF2346D Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1; name="ac010.htm" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Disposition: inline; filename="ac010.htm" Content-Base: "http://www.museovirtuale.polito.it/eng lish/memoria/4-02/4-201/float/ac010 .htm" Content-Location: "http://www.museovirtuale.polito.it/eng lish/memoria/4-02/4-201/float/ac010 .htm" Hiero E
  Hiero E
Warschalowski, Eissler & Co. AG-Vienna, Austria 1914
  Hiero E


In 1914 Otto Hieronimus manufactured the six cylinder Hiero E engine, which was directly derived from the 4 cylinder engines designed leaving from 1908, at Laurin & Clement and then at Werner Pfleider.
The propulsor showed typical constructive features typical of vertical line six cylinder units: aluminium bed, cast iron cylinder, release by two valves per cylinder controlled by bars and rockers, with the cam-shaft in the bed, dual start by two Bosch magnets. The engine was assembled on the Albatros B 1 biplane and then on Löhner M and L seaplanes and on the Llpyd CII scout biplane

 
--------------CC342B10D527FC120CF2346D-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 08:02:24 -0300 From: "dfernet0" To: "WW1 modeling Mail List" Subject: RE: May's Internet Modeler Message-ID: <022001bfb425$e5d51580$4640a8c0@ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> A good one, undoubtedly. Incredible that a year has gone since the WW1 special! Time flies! (in a SS DIV) D. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 08:02:41 -0400 From: skarver@banet.net To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Go here for Hiero Engine Message-ID: <390EC3E1.AF4C6756@banet.net> Ray Boorman wrote: > Wow, that's a great picture and even better site. I tried backing up a level > or two and looking at other pictures. Most are ot but wow. All sorts of > structural members for aircraft etc. > > Ray- Yes, a lot of OT & ot reference candy. Could we prevail upon the Museo to post 4-views of the in-lines? -) --Stef ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 09:52:16 -0400 From: Mark Vaughan-Jackson To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: OK, it's ot, but.... Message-ID: >>Also picked up Tom Lehrer's 'That Was The Year That Was' (what a genius). Ahh Tom Lehrer. . .memories of school in England and choruses of Poisoning Pigeons in the Park, the Vaican Rag and Have Some Madeira M'dear. . .or was that Flanders and Swann?? Mark V-J (only 31 but with musical tastes of a centenarian ;-) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:01:06 -0400 From: Mark Vaughan-Jackson To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Your Grammarian-ship, was, Re: Roland CII Message-ID: Otis wrote: "I saw Page and Plant in concert here in Nashville last summer, and it was the most fun I've had at a concert, ever! All of us 40-somethings rockin' like we were 20 again." Well Otis us 30-somethings ares till trying to catch up. . .I missed most of this stuff due to either being a toddler or trapped in an all boys boarding school with strict anti radio and LP rules. I envy your nashville concert. I'd trade the underwear encounter for tickets to a Plant/Page gig anyday. Ah well, I will, however get a chance to see the reunion tour by the original four from The Guess Who. They kick off a Canadian concert from here in St. John's on May 31. In fact I just did a telephone interview with Randy Bachman and boy he sounds pumped. Hmm, the prospect of hearing Bachmann Cummings, Kale and Peterson pumping out American Woman and the other hits is definitely something to look forward to. Mark V-J ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 07:42:47 -0500 From: "Matt Bittner" To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Modelkrak Russian WW1 armored cars Message-ID: <200005021244.IAA21971@pease1.sr.unh.edu> I just received all three Modelkrak 1/72nd Russian WW1 armored cars in the mail yesterday, and wanted to comment. If you enjoy on topic armor, and would like to build these, then *RUN*, don't walk, to your nearest, favorite hobby shop (on-line or whatever) and buy these. These are excellent. Think of Hawkeye and Rosemont resin quality for armor - then make it about 10% better. :-) Seriously, these are excellent kits, and well worth the money (don't forget Mighty Military Miniatures is having a 25% off sale on Modelkrak). I haven't found *any* airholes yet, and all parts are superbly cast. Unlike the earlier Modelkrak models, all parts are in resin. Instructions are ok (probably the worst part of the kits) but the parts are complete. The most time spent on these will be sanding the parts - especially the one piece main body and chassis - from their pour blocks. If I didn't have so many aircraft models to build for review, I would be working on one of these now. There are three cars so far in the series: "GARFORD - PUTILOV", "AUSTIN - THE FIRST SERIES" and "RUSSIAN AUSTIN". The Garford-Putilov is a bigger "car" (more like a truck) that appears to mount a largish howitzer-type cannon, instead of the machine guns found on the other two. It's a very large model, with plenty of parts. Here's a link that you can see just what I'm talking about: http://www.jadar.com.pl/html/firmy/mkrak/cars72-a.htm In addition, don't forget about the book I mentioned in an earlier post. It will definitely help with the construction of these cars. The only disadvantage to all cars is that the "cabs" are molded "closed" - in other words, all armor protection is down, and there's no way to see into the interior. That's great if you want a quick build without worrying about an interior, but if you wanted to superdetail an interior, you would have to do some major parts surgery. Hmmm... :-) Matt Bittner http://www.geocities.com/ipmsfortcrook http://pease1.sr.unh.edu/misc/FrenchWW1 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Talk to your friends online with Yahoo! Messenger. http://im.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 09:28:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Allan Wright To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Subscribed but no messages Message-ID: <200005021328.JAA22300@pease1.sr.unh.edu> > I recall that you mentioned thios tpo me one day and it definitely > happened today. > > According to the review I was subscribed, but, I received no messages > for more than 7 hours. From Monday 01 May, 2000, 8:54 AM till 4:27 PM > your time. > > Unsubbed and re-subbed and had mesasges within 5 minutes so your servers > are still doing tricks that are not explainable. Lee M. Weird, you are the 2nd person who has reported this happing recently. I'll check the logs and see if I can see anything. Keep me posted when it happens! -Allan =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | "Without love, life's just a long fight" - SSJ University of New Hampshire+--------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://pease1.sr.unh.edu =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue May 02 10:07:14 2000 From: Otisgood@aol.com To: Subject: Re: Your Grammarian-ship, was, Re: Roland CII Message-ID: <200005021411.KAA22474@pease1.sr.unh.edu> In a message dated Tue, 2 May 2000 8:29:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Mark Vaughan-Jackson writes: << Otis wrote: "I saw Page and Plant in concert here in Nashville last summer, and it was the most fun I've had at a concert, ever! All of us 40-somethings rockin' like we were 20 again." Well Otis us 30-somethings ares till trying to catch up. . .I missed most of this stuff due to either being a toddler or trapped in an all boys boarding school with strict anti radio and LP rules. I envy your nashville concert. I'd trade the underwear encounter for tickets to a Plant/Page gig anyday. Ah well, I will, however get a chance to see the reunion tour by the original four from The Guess Who. They kick off a Canadian concert from here in St. John's on May 31. In fact I just did a telephone interview with Randy Bachman and boy he sounds pumped. Hmm, the prospect of hearing Bachmann Cummings, Kale and Peterson pumping out American Woman and the other hits is definitely something to look forward to. Mark V-J That'll beat the #$%&@* out of that sissified Lenny Kravitz version of A W!!! Otis >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 09:07:29 -0500 From: Brent_A_Theobald@notes.seagate.com To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: E.'s Bug Message-ID: I know I am taking this too far, but... >> Is it covered with four or five color lozenge? >Nope! Green and black/green splinter. >Told ya I was a heretic. Great! My confidence in you as a heretic has been restored. It's good to hear about the spandaus up front. I'd be interested in how you handled the parabellum (sp) installation in the back. Also of interest is the conversion to the rotary engine. What color is the interior? The reason I ask this is I have been considering building one of my own. Except I want to do the higher powered Oeffag version. Later! Brent ------------------------------ Date: Tue May 02 10:18:29 2000 From: Otisgood@aol.com To: Subject: Re: E.'s Bug Message-ID: <200005021422.KAA22556@pease1.sr.unh.edu> In a message dated Tue, 2 May 2000 10:12:37 AM Eastern Daylight Time, Brent_A_Theobald@notes.seagate.com writes: << I know I am taking this too far, but... >> Is it covered with four or five color lozenge? >Nope! Green and black/green splinter. >Told ya I was a heretic. Great! My confidence in you as a heretic has been restored. It's good to hear about the spandaus up front. I'd be interested in how you handled the parabellum (sp) installation in the back. Also of interest is the conversion to the rotary engine. What color is the interior? The reason I ask this is I have been considering building one of my own. Except I want to do the higher powered Oeffag version. Later! Brent What you guys are describing reminds me of the "wierd Ohs" series of models produced by Hawk(?) in the 60's. Anybody out there remember Leaky Boat Louie? Otis >> ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 12:01:18 -0400 From: Mark Vaughan-Jackson To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Your Grammarian-ship, was, Re: Roland CII Message-ID: Otis wrote: "That'll beat the #$%&@* out of that sissified Lenny Kravitz version of A W!!!" Amen to that Mark VJ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 12:08:54 -0400 From: Mark Vaughan-Jackson To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Ilya search Message-ID: After a morning gabbing about music, time for an OT post. After everyone talking on list about the Ilya Muromets, well I just had to have one. Should be arriving in a week or so. IIRC there was quite an extensive photo feature and story about the Ilya in one of the aero mags a while back. I used to have a copy somewhere but I guess it got lost in the move. Anyone out there recall when and where it might have been? Failing that any other Ilya resources floating around out there? TIA Mark V-J nb: 1:32 camel (Still), Smer Sopwih tripe vs Albatros. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 09:45:58 -0500 From: "Matt Bittner" To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Re: Ilya search Message-ID: <20000502144438.BTKR25972.mail.rdc2.pa.home.com@npng-mbittner> On Tue, 2 May 2000 10:39:16 -0400 (EDT), Mark Vaughan-Jackson wrote: > Failing that any other Ilya resources floating around out there? Armada has done a book on the type, which is quite decent. Plus, Albatros Pubs (the folks that bring you the Windsock mag and Datafiles) has produced Classics vol.3 specifically on the type. Between the two I would suspect you would have everything you would need. There was also some info in the FMP tome on the IRAS. Further references will have to wait until I get home and have access to my database. Matt Bittner http://www.geocities.com/ipmsfortcrook http://pease1.sr.unh.edu/misc/FrenchWW1 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 09:41:44 -0500 From: "DAVID BURKE" To: Subject: Re: OK, it's ot, but.... Message-ID: <002a01bfb445$881fed00$6f83aec7@dora9sprynet.com> -----Original Message----- From: Albatrosdv@aol.com To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 6:39 PM Subject: Re: OK, it's ot, but.... >In a message dated 5/1/00 3:44:07 PM EST, dora9@sprynet.com writes: > ><< > The Firesign Theatre have a NEW album out: 'Boom Dot Bust'. These guys > have been favorites of mine ever since I could say 'Rocky Roccocco' > > Also picked up Tom Lehrer's 'That Was The Year That Was' (what a genius). > > Bob Newhart: 'The Button-Down Mind Of'. > > And Brahams - Hungarian Dances. >> > >Amazing one so young could have such good taste! :-) > >Tom C Yeah, and it still hasn't won me any friends! DB ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 09:48:48 -0500 From: "DAVID BURKE" To: Subject: Re: Subs Message-ID: <002b01bfb445$89128a60$6f83aec7@dora9sprynet.com> Thanks for the info! However, IIRC, the other types of boats between the S and the Gato weren't built in any great number, but again, I could easily be wrong! Speaking of sub warfare, I like the tricky boats the Brits used to sink U-boats - I forget the class - K-boats or R-boats or something - the ones that looked like freighters and when the sub surfaced to shell the boat, the deckhouses would drop away and the sub was faced with 6 and 8 pound guns sticking in their face. What was these? DB Dive! Dive! -----Original Message----- From: cfrieden@calpoly.edu To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 6:57 PM Subject: Re: Subs >The history WWI of US sub operations does not seem to be very well known, even >among submarine enthusiasts. For the most part the submarines operated against >U-Boats, but there greatest threat was probably from the Allied convoys that >they were escorting! Several subs were damaged by friendly fire during the >war. American submarines were deployed to the Azores and Ireland, and the AL-2 >scored the first US submarine victory against an enemy submarine on July 10, >1918. AFAIK, the next victory did not come until WWII. > >Also, there were several classes of submarines between the S class and the Gato >class. These include the Barracuda, Argonaut, Narwhal, Dolphin, Cachalot, P, >Salmon, Sargo, and Tambor classes. > >Chris Friedenbach > >> The 'S' Class was a post WW-I development. They were some of the first subs >> to sortie out against the Japanese, and took losses. They would be >> followed by Gato-class fleet-subs. Personally, I didn't know that we even >> HAD a submarine navy in WWI. >> >> >> DB > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 10:04:18 -0500 From: "Paul Schwartzkopf" To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Subs Message-ID: I believe the term Q-boat comes to mind as the designation for these. Once the initial surprise wore off, they lost their edge on the u-boats. I thought I read somewhere that they actually contributed to the unrestricted sinking of ships by the Germans, in order to keep the u-boats from surfacing and coming under fire from one. Paul >>> "DAVID BURKE" 05/02/2000 10:01:17 AM >>> Thanks for the info! However, IIRC, the other types of boats between the S and the Gato weren't built in any great number, but again, I could easily be wrong! Speaking of sub warfare, I like the tricky boats the Brits used to sink U-boats - I forget the class - K-boats or R-boats or something - the ones that looked like freighters and when the sub surfaced to shell the boat, the deckhouses would drop away and the sub was faced with 6 and 8 pound guns sticking in their face. What was these? DB Dive! Dive! -----Original Message----- From: cfrieden@calpoly.edu To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 6:57 PM Subject: Re: Subs >The history WWI of US sub operations does not seem to be very well known, even >among submarine enthusiasts. For the most part the submarines operated against >U-Boats, but there greatest threat was probably from the Allied convoys that >they were escorting! Several subs were damaged by friendly fire during the >war. American submarines were deployed to the Azores and Ireland, and the AL-2 >scored the first US submarine victory against an enemy submarine on July 10, >1918. AFAIK, the next victory did not come until WWII. > >Also, there were several classes of submarines between the S class and the Gato >class. These include the Barracuda, Argonaut, Narwhal, Dolphin, Cachalot, P, >Salmon, Sargo, and Tambor classes. > >Chris Friedenbach > >> The 'S' Class was a post WW-I development. They were some of the first subs >> to sortie out against the Japanese, and took losses. They would be >> followed by Gato-class fleet-subs. Personally, I didn't know that we even >> HAD a submarine navy in WWI. >> >> >> DB > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:04:08 -0500 From: "DAVID BURKE" To: Subject: Re: insanity IS the fun part wasRe: Roland Color Quandra Message-ID: <00a901bfb448$8c0efa20$6f83aec7@dora9sprynet.com> > ><< > Look Guys, > > I respect the research of people like RK, Pearson, Ray Rimell, etc. But > when someone busts my chops as far as one of my pieces goes, my stock > reaction is: Were YOU there? > > Dicta Ira! > > > DB >> > > > >What'd I do? >Most of the time my research is nothing more than dogging through stacks of >old magazines and books. Real research is when you have to sneeze from the >moldy primary sources you've just disturbed. >It IS possible to see somthing in an old photo that others may have missed >(and this is especially true it seems with model companys), but even this is >a rare discovery. >This whole "have fun vs accuracy" thing boils down for me to there being no >difference. I try to get things as right as I can, but realizing that >perfection ain't gonna happen, I do try to draw the line at obsessing over >things which will most likely never be known for sure (or at least until I've >finished some fabulously detailed monstrosity and 400 here-to-fore unknown >pictures pop up in a barn, along with a 1000 pages of text explaining in >detail everything in the pictures). >If I manage to finish something without a major mental breakdown or crisis, I >feel cheated- for me the fun IS the intensity to get it RIGHT as I can. >RK Well, I reckon that I meant nothing as a slight - just that I like the research, but I hate some ham and egger sticking his finger in my model and saying 'that's wrong'. And for me, fun IS being accurate. I'm going back to sleep now... DB ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:07:32 -0500 From: "DAVID BURKE" To: Subject: Re: Dicta Ira..... was Roland Color Quandra Message-ID: <00aa01bfb448$8ce7a6e0$6f83aec7@dora9sprynet.com> -----Original Message----- From: Ray Boorman To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 9:23 PM Subject: Re: Dicta Ira..... was Roland Color Quandra >Not saying you can't build a pink Roland for example (now that would be a >sight), just don't say well there could have been one pink one! Instead just >admit you preferred it pink! > >Ray When I start seeing pink Rolands, I know it's time to get back on the wagon! DB ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 May 2000 10:12:33 -0500 From: "DAVID BURKE" To: Subject: Re: Subs Message-ID: <00af01bfb448$d8ba5b80$6f83aec7@dora9sprynet.com> Q-boats sound right. IIRC, they were used in WW2 as well, at the beginning. Clever trick! DB -----Original Message----- From: Paul Schwartzkopf To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Tuesday, May 02, 2000 10:08 AM Subject: Re: Subs >I believe the term Q-boat comes to mind as the designation for these. Once the initial surprise wore off, they lost their edge on the u-boats. I thought I read somewhere that they actually contributed to the unrestricted sinking of ships by the Germans, in order to keep the u-boats from surfacing and coming under fire from one. > >Paul > >>>> "DAVID BURKE" 05/02/2000 10:01:17 AM >>> >Thanks for the info! However, IIRC, the other types of boats between the S >and the Gato weren't built in any great number, but again, I could easily be >wrong! > >Speaking of sub warfare, I like the tricky boats the Brits used to sink >U-boats - I forget the class - K-boats or R-boats or something - the ones >that looked like freighters and when the sub surfaced to shell the boat, >the deckhouses would drop away and the sub was faced with 6 and 8 pound guns >sticking in their face. What was these? > > >DB > > >Dive! Dive! > > >-----Original Message----- >From: cfrieden@calpoly.edu >To: Multiple recipients of list >Date: Monday, May 01, 2000 6:57 PM >Subject: Re: Subs > > >>The history WWI of US sub operations does not seem to be very well known, >even >>among submarine enthusiasts. For the most part the submarines operated >against >>U-Boats, but there greatest threat was probably from the Allied convoys >that >>they were escorting! Several subs were damaged by friendly fire during the >>war. American submarines were deployed to the Azores and Ireland, and the >AL-2 >>scored the first US submarine victory against an enemy submarine on July >10, >>1918. AFAIK, the next victory did not come until WWII. >> >>Also, there were several classes of submarines between the S class and the >Gato >>class. These include the Barracuda, Argonaut, Narwhal, Dolphin, Cachalot, >P, >>Salmon, Sargo, and Tambor classes. >> >>Chris Friedenbach >> >>> The 'S' Class was a post WW-I development. They were some of the first >subs >>> to sortie out against the Japanese, and took losses. They would be >>> followed by Gato-class fleet-subs. Personally, I didn't know that we >even >>> HAD a submarine navy in WWI. >>> >>> >>> DB >> > > ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 2305 **********************