WWI Digest 1527 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Pictures of WWI prototypes available by "Richard Caudron" 2) RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation by "Diego Fernetti" 3) Model Pics by Chris Cato 4) 46 Sqd. Pups by "David Vosburgh" 5) Re: Model Pics by Allan Wright 6) Chris's Page by Allan Wright 7) Re: Model Pics by Chris Cato 8) Re: Model Pics by Allan Wright 9) Re: Model Pics by "D. Anderson" <2814823733@home.com> 10) Re: Model Pics by peter crow 11) RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation by "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" 12) Bertrab [sic] D.III page, trolling by "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" 13) RE: Model Pics by "Diego Fernetti" 14) The Spider Web-T.D.Hallam by graham.nash@citicorp.com 15) RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation by Shane Weier 16) RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation by "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" 17) Re: Model Pics by Bill Bacon 18) Belated Welcomes by Bill Bacon 19) RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation by "Diego Fernetti" 20) Belated praise on models by Bill Bacon 21) Re: Model Pics by "richard eaton" 22) Re: Model Pics by "Mark L. Shannon" 23) Re: Model Pics by David_Zulis@wsib.on.ca 24) Re: The Spider Web-T.D.Hallam by "Sandy Adam" 25) Avro 504K at Camp Borden by "Brad Gossen" 26) Re: 46 Sqd. Pups by "Brad Gossen" 27) Fw: 46 Sqd. Pups by "Brad Gossen" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 08:32:56 +0200 From: "Richard Caudron" To: Subject: Pictures of WWI prototypes available Message-ID: <000201be7ff7$4ed9d160$f25f5c8b@PCCE.cim-hardi.be> Hi Guys, Based on your tips, I did bought a digital JVC camera to fix milion of pixels from my favorites build models, and to add to yours through the net and the list. So, I did start with a few of my WWI airplanes : The Prototypes (All 1/72). Anyone who is interested in one of the following models can contact me off-list, and I will send to him back the selected(s) pictures. The airplanes : * DFW 28 Floh, Classic Planes, Vaccu * Duffaux Fighter, ????, Vaccu * Caproni Pensuti Tri, Rosemont, Resin Regards, Richard Caudron ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 07:02:46 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation Message-ID: <001901be8014$9fdcc6e0$4640a8c0@prens-001.ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Hi Shane: I remember that I saw a diagram of the top wing with the lozenge fabric bolt applied spanwise over the surface, with another bolt sewed in equal manner until it reached the trailing edge. I can't say if I saw this diagram in Windsock Albatros Fighters Special, th Mikesh NASM book or in Storia de l'Aviazione, from Apostolo & Begnozzi (no, the freak that won the Oscar was Begnini). I wish I had the books here to confirm if this was a presumption of the author or a factory trademark for a batch of planes. But I have more questions: The Albatri had four or five color lozenge fabric? There was some difference on this for DIII or DV? D. -----Mensaje original----- De: Shane Weier Para: Multiple recipients of list Fecha: Lunes 5 de Abril de 1999 9:23 PM Asunto: Albatros D.V fabric orientation >Hi all, > >I've been trawling through a bunch of photos trying to determine if there's >an obvious pattern (by manufacturer, by serial, by random selection >according to the number of bottles of schnapps) to the way that the loz >fabric is attached to Albatros D.V (and D.Va) machines. > >For example, "Stropp" at NASM has fabric chordwise on both upper and lower >wings, while the machine at AWM has fabric spanwise on both. Squinting >blearilly at every photo I have which shows enough patter to determine the >orientation shows *both* appearing with chordwise more common AFAICS (can >see) > >But.....I can't figure out whether there's some overall pattern for this. I >have read articles in WW1 Aero in which Dan-San Abbot discussed the >orientation of fabric on Fokker D-VII, but have no recollection of any >similar work on Albatrii. Has anyone seen anything in this line? Or have a >theory, well reasoned or otherwise? > >Shane >(No problem with Mai's machine - photo shows clear chordwise orientation, >I'm just curious for the future) > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 09:30:26 -0400 From: Chris Cato To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Model Pics Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19990406093026.00967020@mail.connix.com> Although I post rarely (if ever!) to this list I thought folks might be interested in what I've worked on over the last year or so that I've been a member. All inspiration I owe to those here who have been generous with their pictures, information, tips, resources, etc. Pics of and Eduard Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith tripe, SSW D.III, and Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. Enjoy! Chris Cato tcato@connix.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 09:31:55 -0400 From: "David Vosburgh" To: "WWI Mailing List" Subject: 46 Sqd. Pups Message-ID: <000501be8032$04d5e780$16d690d0@Pvosburg> After finishing 'No Parachutes' for the third time, I've decided to do my Pup as B1727, as flown by Lee's friend 2 Lt. Norman Dimmock. I have one picture of it, in Bruce's 'Sopwith Fighters', but was wondering if anyone with access to alternate sources could tell me: A.) what the color was on the half & half wheel covers --- ND was mentioned as being in "B" Flight, and Lee makes an indirect allusion which leads me to believe that their flight color was blue. B.) what color the "B1727" was on the vertical stabilizer... it's a dark color outlined with white (red would be neat), and C.) whether the metal areas were painted grey or simply dull engine-turned aluminum. Looks rather like they're painted to me. Any & all input greatly appreciated, as always. DV ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 09:37:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Allan Wright To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <199904061337.JAA06363@pease1.sr.unh.edu> Chris, There seems to be a problem with the page - all I get is a yellow background.... -Al > > Although I post rarely (if ever!) to this list I thought folks might be > interested in what I've worked on over the last year or so that I've been a > member. All inspiration I owe to those here who have been generous with > their pictures, information, tips, resources, etc. Pics of and Eduard > Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: > > http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > > Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith tripe, SSW D.III, and > Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. Enjoy! > > Chris Cato > tcato@connix.com > =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | You fell victim to one of the 'classic' blunders! University of New Hampshire+--------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://pease1.sr.unh.edu =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 09:38:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Allan Wright To: wwi Subject: Chris's Page Message-ID: <199904061338.JAA06410@pease1.sr.unh.edu> Chris, I checked your HTML code. Change the end of your file from: to:
-Allan =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | You fell victim to one of the 'classic' blunders! University of New Hampshire+--------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://pease1.sr.unh.edu =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 09:51:57 -0400 From: Chris Cato To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19990406095157.009a3090@mail.connix.com> At 09:37 AM 4/6/99 -0400, you wrote: >Chris, > > There seems to be a problem with the page - all I get is a yellow >background.... > >-Al > Got it Al!. My apologies folks - thats what I get for writing HTML in a hurry... One more try: http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ Chris Cato tcato@connix.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:02:14 -0400 (EDT) From: Allan Wright To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <199904061402.KAA06621@pease1.sr.unh.edu> > Got it Al!. My apologies folks - thats what I get for writing HTML in a > hurry... > > One more try: > http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > > Chris Cato > tcato@connix.com Beautiful work Chris. I've linked to your page on my links page. Thanks, Allan =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | You fell victim to one of the 'classic' blunders! University of New Hampshire+--------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://pease1.sr.unh.edu =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 08:07:56 -0600 From: "D. Anderson" <2814823733@home.com> To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990406080756.007b8970@mail> At 09:30 AM 06/04/99 -0400, you wrote: >Although I post rarely (if ever!) to this list I thought folks might be >interested in what I've worked on over the last year or so that I've been a >member. All inspiration I owe to those here who have been generous with >their pictures, information, tips, resources, etc. Pics of and Eduard >Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: Nice models Chris. Great to see the Eduard Pfalz. This is probably my favourite W.W. I model of all time, yet it's apparently a rare one (judging by it's non-appearance on Allan's and other's Web sites). I've got one that's been waiting to be finished for several months. Maybe this is the encouragement I need to finish it. Dane >http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > >Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith tripe, SSW D.III, and >Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. Enjoy! > >Chris Cato >tcato@connix.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 08:21:26 -0700 (PDT) From: peter crow To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <19990406152126.11444.rocketmail@web705.mail.yahoo.com> Chris... Excellent job on all of these... thanks for putting them up for us to see... P. Crow > Pics of and Eduard > Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: > > http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > > Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith > tripe, SSW D.III, and > Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. > Enjoy! > > Chris Cato > tcato@connix.com > > _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:26:24 -0500 From: "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation Message-ID: <01BE8017.ECD46C20.panz-meador@vsti.com> shane: "albatros fighters" sez (p. 50): "Either pattern [4 or 5 color loz.] could be applied to D.III/D.V/D.Va machines and there appears to have been several variations in the covering of flying surfaces. Both spanwise and chordwise applications have been noted." a diagram on p. 51 depicts a spanwise covering on waldhausen's D.2284, with the seam very far back on the wing, in fact aft of the wing/aileron longitudinal joint. phillip -----Original Message----- From: Shane Weier [SMTP:sdw@qld.mim.com.au] Sent: Monday, April 05, 1999 7:13 PM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Albatros D.V fabric orientation Hi all, I've been trawling through a bunch of photos trying to determine if there's an obvious pattern (by manufacturer, by serial, by random selection according to the number of bottles of schnapps) to the way that the loz fabric is attached to Albatros D.V (and D.Va) machines. For example, "Stropp" at NASM has fabric chordwise on both upper and lower wings, while the machine at AWM has fabric spanwise on both. Squinting blearilly at every photo I have which shows enough patter to determine the orientation shows *both* appearing with chordwise more common AFAICS (can see) But.....I can't figure out whether there's some overall pattern for this. I have read articles in WW1 Aero in which Dan-San Abbot discussed the orientation of fabric on Fokker D-VII, but have no recollection of any similar work on Albatrii. Has anyone seen anything in this line? Or have a theory, well reasoned or otherwise? Shane (No problem with Mai's machine - photo shows clear chordwise orientation, I'm just curious for the future) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 10:35:07 -0500 From: "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: Bertrab [sic] D.III page, trolling Message-ID: <01BE8019.24345620.panz-meador@vsti.com> trolling, as in fishing for comments, not living under a bridge. common', surely somebody has an opinion on this! bob? also, i believe the name is bertrasz, where the german character that resembles the greek "beta" is the "ess-zed" (pronounced "ess-zet"). as per nowarra, who depicted a black fuesalage in "eisernes kreuz etc." phillip -----Original Message----- From: panz-meador Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 12:05 PM To: 'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu' Subject: RE: Bertrab D.III page [panz-meador] bob (and interested others): OK, looking at the picture again i concur that a panel line exists there. however, with closer study, and comparing the photograph on p. 22 of "albatros fighters" with the ian stair plans on the facing page, i note that there is another panel line on the turtle deck forward of the fuesalage cross. close study of the picture reveals this panel line above bertrasz's left shoulder and comet outline (the shoulder on the right as you're looking at him). there is no contrast between these panels. there IS, however, between the panels immediately before the tail and the tail group. therefore, i would suggest that there is at least a reasonable possibility that bertrasz's albatros had a fuesalage and tail of different colors. by all means i would suggest that others examine the book to see if they come to the same conclusion. phillip ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:06:06 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: RE: Model Pics Message-ID: <000e01be8047$649b8660$4640a8c0@prens-001.ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> Good work, Chris! I'm looking forward to see that Alb DVa. D. -----Mensaje original----- De: Chris Cato Para: Multiple recipients of list Fecha: Martes 6 de Abril de 1999 12:37 PM Asunto: Model Pics >Although I post rarely (if ever!) to this list I thought folks might be >interested in what I've worked on over the last year or so that I've been a >member. All inspiration I owe to those here who have been generous with >their pictures, information, tips, resources, etc. Pics of and Eduard >Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: > >http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > >Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith tripe, SSW D.III, and >Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. Enjoy! > >Chris Cato >tcato@connix.com > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:58:49 +0100 From: graham.nash@citicorp.com To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: The Spider Web-T.D.Hallam Message-ID: <199904061612.MAA29707@egate2.citicorp.com> I have an ex-library copy of the captioned book available for the princely sum of US$1 including overseas p&p. Library markings are limited to a couple in the 'published by' area of the book, plus one in the margin of page 39. Let me know off-list if you would like it. Uncle Sniffy ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 02:16:48 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation Message-ID: Phillip, > shane: > > "albatros fighters" sez (p. 50): > > "Either pattern [4 or 5 color loz.] could be applied to > D.III/D.V/D.Va machines > and there appears to have been several > variations in the covering > of flying surfaces. Both spanwise and > chordwise applications > have been noted." > > a diagram on p. 51 depicts a spanwise covering on > waldhausen's D.2284, with the > seam very far back on the wing, in fact aft of the > wing/aileron longitudinal joint. Thanks, but yes, I knew that. Either is correct, what I'm interested in is whether there is any known pattern of useage. The seam on the spanwise covering is far back because the fabric is joined at the leading edge and the width is about 30cm too narrow to cover the upper wing, so a narrow strip completes the envelope. This is obvious on the AWM machine where a full bolt width pattern is used - plus a bit. And Diego asks: >But I have more questions: The Albatri had >four or five color lozenge fabric? There >was some difference on this for DIII or DV? Either 4 or 5 colour was used, and AFAIK there's no well known pattern of useage there either. As far as D.III's, all I can say that loz on a D.III is pretty rare. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 11:44:26 -0500 From: "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation Message-ID: <01BE8022.D3D2BF00.panz-meador@vsti.com> yes, i knew you knew that, but if you needed a citation that was it. there you go... -----Original Message----- From: Shane Weier [SMTP:sdw@qld.mim.com.au] Sent: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 11:15 AM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation Thanks, but yes, I knew that. Either is correct, what I'm interested in is whether there is any known pattern of useage. The seam on the spanwise covering is far back because the fabric is joined at the leading edge and the width is about 30cm too narrow to cover the upper wing, so a narrow strip completes the envelope. This is obvious on the AWM machine where a full bolt width pattern is used - plus a bit. And Diego asks: >But I have more questions: The Albatri had >four or five color lozenge fabric? There >was some difference on this for DIII or DV? Either 4 or 5 colour was used, and AFAIK there's no well known pattern of useage there either. As far as D.III's, all I can say that loz on a D.III is pretty rare. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 11:42:43 -0500 From: Bill Bacon To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <370A3983.CBEA6060@Netjava.net> Chris, Great work can't wait to see the rest. Cheers, Bill B. Chris Cato wrote: > Although I post rarely (if ever!) to this list I thought folks might be > interested in what I've worked on over the last year or so that I've been a > member. All inspiration I owe to those here who have been generous with > their pictures, information, tips, resources, etc. Pics of and Eduard > Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: > > http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > > Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith tripe, SSW D.III, and > Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. Enjoy! > > Chris Cato > tcato@connix.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 11:47:52 -0500 From: Bill Bacon To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Belated Welcomes Message-ID: <370A3AB8.982FC08@Netjava.net> To our new members, A much delayed welcome from the Texas Panhandle. We are a jolly group as you have no doubt found out. This is the finest list on the net bar none. Cheers, Bill B. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 13:48:32 -0300 From: "Diego Fernetti" To: Subject: RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation Message-ID: <000c01be804d$4f0ad660$4640a8c0@prens-001.ssp.salud.rosario.gov.ar> -----Mensaje original----- De: Shane Weier Asunto: RE: Albatros D.V fabric orientation >And Diego asks: >>But I have more questions: The Albatri had >>four or five color lozenge fabric? There >>was some difference on this for DIII or DV? >Either 4 or 5 colour was used, and AFAIK there's no well known pattern of >useage there either. As far as D.III's, all I can say that loz on a D.III is >pretty rare. > I saw a profile by there (man, how I HATE being so far from my books!) that shows a DIII with lozenged wings. Remember that DIII production didn't stop even after the introduction of the Alb DV, so, it's possible although I concede that improbable that an Alb DIII fresh from the factory had Lozenge fabric covering on its wings. Another possibility is to have a new fabric covering of the wings on the field. I guess that ground crew members were happier with the pre-painted fabric than painting the two or three colour camouflage on the linen from the start. D. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 11:51:11 -0500 From: Bill Bacon To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Belated praise on models Message-ID: <370A3B7F.B525CDAA@Netjava.net> To all who have posted pics of their work, My belated praise to one and all. Fine work and great pics. Keep them coming. Cheers, Bill B. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 12:12:05 -0500 From: "richard eaton" To: Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <199904061711.MAA07656@sierra.onr.com> Great start on the page Chris. The S.XVI was one of my favorites last year. Keep up the good work! Regards, Richard ---------- > From: Chris Cato > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Model Pics > Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 8:30 AM > > Although I post rarely (if ever!) to this list I thought folks might be > interested in what I've worked on over the last year or so that I've been a > member. All inspiration I owe to those here who have been generous with > their pictures, information, tips, resources, etc. Pics of and Eduard > Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: > > http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > > Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith tripe, SSW D.III, and > Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. Enjoy! > > Chris Cato > tcato@connix.com > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 12:39:40 -0500 From: "Mark L. Shannon" To: Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <199904061740.MAA05778@dfw-ix14.ix.netcom.com> Quite nice! ;{) I think you did a good job in doing the laminated prop on the Pfalz and the rigging looks right on the Snipe, with good finishes. Ain't it disgusting when you find out after you do the model: 1. The places where the instructions or kit are totally out. 2. The best way to do a particular part. I don't know how many times I've struggled with some bit like the rigging, get it right after a lot of fuss, then on the last portions or such, get the trick down to really make the job easier. And I won't tell you about my Olive streaked blue Dr.I's with the olive green interiors. -- oops. Mark ---------- > From: Chris Cato > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Model Pics > Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 8:30 AM > > Although I post rarely (if ever!) to this list I thought folks might be > interested in what I've worked on over the last year or so that I've been a > member. All inspiration I owe to those here who have been generous with > their pictures, information, tips, resources, etc. Pics of and Eduard > Pfalz, Dako S.XVI, and Toko Snipe are up at: > > http://www.connix.com/~tcato/ > > Soon I hope to have some shots of the Eduard Sopwith tripe, SSW D.III, and > Albatros D.Va I've been working on up on the site. Enjoy! > > Chris Cato > tcato@connix.com > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 14:19:44 -0400 From: David_Zulis@wsib.on.ca To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Model Pics Message-ID: <8525674B.00648EEA.00@Notes.Server5.wcb.on.ca> Mark writes: < Ain't it disgusting when you find out after you do the model: 1. The places where the instructions or kit are totally out. 2. The best way to do a particular part. I don't know how many times I've struggled with some bit like the rigging, get it right after a lot of fuss, then on the last portions or such, get the trick down to really make the job easier. And I won't tell you about my Olive streaked blue Dr.I's with the olive green interiors. -- oops. > I dont make / complete many models. Drives me nuts that the most attractive model I have is of a blue and white Dr.I with little black ravens on the fuselage.... Dave Z ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 19:44:45 +0100 From: "Sandy Adam" To: Subject: Re: The Spider Web-T.D.Hallam Message-ID: <199904061843.TAA15652@beryl.sol.co.uk> I'm probably too late - but if not - I'd like the book at whatever price you think is fair. Sandy PS - good to hear from you - I wondered where you had gone! ---------- > From: graham.nash@citicorp.com > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: The Spider Web-T.D.Hallam > Date: 06 April 1999 17:11 > > I have an ex-library copy of the captioned book available for the princely sum > of US$1 including overseas p&p. > > Library markings are limited to a couple in the 'published by' area of the > book, plus one in the margin of page 39. > > Let me know off-list if you would like it. > > Uncle Sniffy ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 15:46:46 -0400 From: "Brad Gossen" To: Subject: Avro 504K at Camp Borden Message-ID: <199904061948.PAA11999@mail5.globalserve.net> For those of you living within driving distance of the Toronto area, I have been informed that there is to be an RCAF anniversary ceremony/ airshow at CFB Borden this Saturday 10th of April. The star of the show is an Avro 504K on loan from Ottawa (I believe they have at least two). My source was unclear as to whether it will fly or not. I will be attending with my trusty Minolta and might even get some video if it does decide to fly. I'll check my Datafile before I go and will attempt to get some detail shots which are not covered in the 'file with an eye to future posting. Does anyone have anything in particular they'd like a close-up of on this type? If it does not fly I will still be looking forward to some photos of a 504 standing in front of, or in, the hangars which were originally designed to house this very type (along with the JN4 of course)! Borden's hangars are the oldest surviving military hangars in Canada having been erected in 1916-17. They remain essentially unchanged particularly their interiors. Of the original 17, many of them are, I believe, due for demolition so I intend to burn several rolls of film on hangar detail as well. I will of course be sporting my list button courtesy of Mr. Huggins. Brad BigglesRFC@globalserve.net PS This would also be a good opportunity to check out the Camp Borden Armour Museum which contains among other things, an on-topic Whippet, several period support vehicles and an off-topic collection of Allied and Axis heavy armour including some recent Soviet examples. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:14:29 -0400 From: "Brad Gossen" To: Subject: Re: 46 Sqd. Pups Message-ID: <199904062013.QAA11527@smtp2.globalserve.net> Dave The Datafile Special on the Pup shows a colour profile of a 46 Sqdrn. machine on page 28. The caption is as follows: "Sopwith Pup B1719, Lt.R.L.M. Ferrie, No. 46 Squadron RFC, Le Hameau, 1917. This Standard-built Pup bore PC10 khaki dope on upper and side surfaces with natural metal panels and cowling. Ply area around cockpit was clear-varnished with all under surfaces clear-doped and V114 varnished. Wheel covers typically halved in vermilion/white for 46 Squadron Pups with individual number repeated on port and starboard wing upper surfaces in white, and often on the lower surfaces of the wings in black." The profile shows a large, white number '4' immediately aft of the fuselage roundel and a white serial with no borders on the vertical stabilizer in this fashion: B 1719 I hope this helps some. Oh how I wish I had a scanner! Hopefully soon! Brad BigglesRFC@globalserve.net ---------- > From: David Vosburgh > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: 46 Sqd. Pups > Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 9:32 AM > > After finishing 'No Parachutes' for the third time, I've decided to do my > Pup as B1727, as flown by Lee's friend 2 Lt. Norman Dimmock. I have one > picture of it, in Bruce's 'Sopwith Fighters', but was wondering if anyone > with access to alternate sources could tell me: > A.) what the color was on the half & half wheel covers --- ND was mentioned > as being in "B" Flight, and Lee makes an indirect allusion which leads me to > believe that their flight color was blue. > B.) what color the "B1727" was on the vertical stabilizer... it's a dark > color outlined with white (red would be neat), and > C.) whether the metal areas were painted grey or simply dull engine-turned > aluminum. Looks rather like they're painted to me. > > Any & all input greatly appreciated, as always. > > DV > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1999 16:19:55 -0400 From: "Brad Gossen" To: Subject: Fw: 46 Sqd. Pups Message-ID: <199904062018.QAA11743@smtp2.globalserve.net> My apologies! My machine screwed up the serial near the bottom of the last post. The 'B' should be centered above the second '1' in '1719' (stupid technology)! ; ) Brad ---------- > From: Brad Gossen > To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu > Subject: Re: 46 Sqd. Pups > Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 4:14 PM > > Dave > The Datafile Special on the Pup shows a colour profile of a 46 Sqdrn. > machine on page 28. The caption is as follows: > > "Sopwith Pup B1719, Lt.R.L.M. Ferrie, No. 46 Squadron RFC, Le Hameau, > 1917. > This Standard-built Pup bore PC10 khaki dope on upper and side > surfaces with natural metal panels and cowling. Ply area around cockpit was > clear-varnished with all under surfaces clear-doped and V114 varnished. > Wheel covers typically halved in vermilion/white for 46 Squadron Pups with > individual number repeated on port and starboard wing upper surfaces in > white, and often on the lower surfaces of the wings in black." > > The profile shows a large, white number '4' immediately aft of the > fuselage roundel and a white serial with no borders on the vertical > stabilizer in this fashion: B > 1719 > > I hope this helps some. Oh how I wish I had a scanner! Hopefully soon! > > Brad > BigglesRFC@globalserve.net > ---------- > > From: David Vosburgh > > To: Multiple recipients of list > > Subject: 46 Sqd. Pups > > Date: Tuesday, April 06, 1999 9:32 AM > > > > After finishing 'No Parachutes' for the third time, I've decided to do my > > Pup as B1727, as flown by Lee's friend 2 Lt. Norman Dimmock. I have one > > picture of it, in Bruce's 'Sopwith Fighters', but was wondering if anyone > > with access to alternate sources could tell me: > > A.) what the color was on the half & half wheel covers --- ND was > mentioned > > as being in "B" Flight, and Lee makes an indirect allusion which leads me > to > > believe that their flight color was blue. > > B.) what color the "B1727" was on the vertical stabilizer... it's a dark > > color outlined with white (red would be neat), and > > C.) whether the metal areas were painted grey or simply dull > engine-turned > > aluminum. Looks rather like they're painted to me. > > > > Any & all input greatly appreciated, as always. > > > > DV > > ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 1527 **********************