WWI Digest 1391 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Ebay by "Richard Caudron" 2) RE: Passing on an offer by "Richard Caudron" 3) RE: Felixstowe in restoration by Bob Pearson 4) RE: RE: Sopwith Triplanes by bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) 5) RE: The Skull Collection by Shane Weier 6) RE: Eduard Pfalz DIII by Rick Milas 7) PC12 & paint chips by "Sandy Adam" 8) RE: The Skull Collection by Eric Fisher 9) Re: List by mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) 10) Re: RE: Sopwith Triplanes by mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) 11) Re: The Skull Collection by mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) 12) Re: PC12 & paint chips by mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) 13) Re: The Skull Collection by Ernest Thomas 14) Re: Sopwith Triplanes by Ernest Thomas 15) Re: Sopwith Triplanes by "David Vosburgh" 16) Re: PC12 & paint chips by "Brad Gossen" 17) Re: Eduard Pfalz DIII by "David Vosburgh" 18) Pensacola Naval Air Museum by "John C Glaser" 19) Re: Pensacola Naval Air Museum by Ernest Thomas 20) Vacuform Collection by Yves Buffetaut 21) Re: Sopwith Triplanes by "Brad Gossen" 22) RE: Eduard Pfalz DIII by "D. Anderson" <2814823733@home.com> 23) Re: Sopwith Triplanes by "D. Anderson" <2814823733@home.com> 24) Completely off-topic but so funny ;-) by michel.lefort@ping.be (Michel LEFORT) 25) Re: Vacuform Collection by Dennis Ugulano 26) Re: PC12 & paint chips by mgoodwin@ricochet.net 27) Re: Vacuform Collection by Yves Buffetaut 28) Re: Vacuform Collection by "richard eaton" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:25:45 +0100 From: "Richard Caudron" To: Subject: RE: Ebay Message-ID: <000401be4121$6e58eb80$3d5f5c8b@PCCE.cim-hardi.be> Richard_Caudron@ibm.net > -----Original Message----- > From: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu [mailto:wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu]On Behalf Of > Dave Sterner > Sent: vrijdag 15 januari 1999 19:06 > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Re: Ebay > > > Me too....my ebay name is davekim. So far my on-topic purchases > include the > two National Air & Space museum prints of "U.10" and "Stroop" > with pieces of > original fabric attached and a Hasegawa Dr.I. It's a dangerous site, Kim > (the other half of my name) got a little tipsy on night and paid > $80.00 for > one of those Furby toys that now spends all of it's time asleep on a > shelf..... > Dave Sterner > > Dave Watts wrote: > > > Here's how I have it, (in alphabetical order), 27 so far, anyone else? > > > > aew = Allan Wright > > amadonRI = Gerry McOsker > > asilid = Eric Fisher > > Biggles = Brad Gossen > > braille_scale_modeler = Paul A. Schwartzkopf > > cam27 = Cameron Riley > > cduckworth = Charles Duckworth > > dicianna@dnc.net = Mike Dicianna > > eatons@onr.com = Richard Eaton > > fighter2 = Shane Weier > > fokker = David Watts > > furzball = David Laws > > graham3 = Graham Nash > > hagerupk = K. Hagerup > > JastaElf = Sharon Henderson > > jberlien = Jack Berlien > > lejeune = Fernando Lamas > > Lothar = John Glaser > > MACFARB = MacFarb > > Macsporran = Sandy Adam > > modelhound = Mike Franklin > > Moritz1 = David Layton > > Nieuport29 = Mike Fletcher > > phoward@abilene.com = P. Howard > > Viper32 = Rob Woodbury > > Vulture2 = Dave Zulis > > winks147 = Kevin Wenker > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:35:57 +0100 From: "Richard Caudron" To: Subject: RE: Passing on an offer Message-ID: <000601be4122$db60cbc0$3d5f5c8b@PCCE.cim-hardi.be> Please, do. > -----Original Message----- > From: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu [mailto:wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu]On Behalf Of > Mike Dicianna > Sent: zaterdag 16 januari 1999 1:40 > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Passing on an offer > > > I got another reponse to my plea for WWI stuff on Hobbyweb.com. > A guy sent > me an email and said he has a MPC Spad VII (1/72) available and also a > UPC Martin MB-2 Bomber kit. Both in good condition. He is > moving soon and > said they were "dead weight":} > > Give me a toot off list and I'll forward his email address if anyone is > interested. > Mikedc > "Der Rote Modellflugzeugbauer" > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 23:27:14 -0800 From: Bob Pearson To: WW1 Mailing list Subject: RE: Felixstowe in restoration Message-ID: <199901160727.XAA02638@spare.rapidnet.net> Richard, I already have Brad's F5L photos scanned. Anyone else wanting copies of these photos send me an email offlist and I will send them out. Bob ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 00:06:08 -0800 (PST) From: bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: RE: RE: Sopwith Triplanes Message-ID: <199901160806.AAA29865@compass.OregonVOS.net> Richard wrote: >Was the Fokker EIII a BI-plane ? No - of course not. But the official IPMS classification is something along the lines of "Biplanes and Pioneers (and other aircraft which are primarily fabric and rigging)" Thus, Morane Saulniers, Fokker E.IIIs (and IVs), Bristol M.1Cs and Taubes qualify for the catagory - despite having only a single wing. Numerous triplanes (and a few quadraplanes) would qualify for the "biplane" catagory as well - despite having an excess number of wings. Cheers and all, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org "Cave ab homine unius librum." ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 19:07:03 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: The Skull Collection Message-ID: Bob, > The D.I that Prinz something or other was killed in while > flying with Jasta Okay, I think I know the machine, but can't find the photo. Shane ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 03:20:21 -0600 (CST) From: Rick Milas To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: RE: Eduard Pfalz DIII Message-ID: Except for the rigging I finished my Pfalz DIII tonight. I'm pleased with the results. I want to thank everyone for the help they gave me over the past several months. Couldn't have done it without you! Now it's time to start the Eduard Albatros DIII I got for Christmas. Rick Milas ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:53:20 -0800 From: "Sandy Adam" To: Subject: PC12 & paint chips Message-ID: <199901161052.KAA13485@beryl.sol.co.uk> > least if Rimmell and Huntley know what they were talking about. I'd give the Windsock paint chips a cautious reception, in general, if I were you. While the idea is good, the results often don't look right to me. In one of the earliest issues RR admits that fresh evidence on a Pfalz throws confusion and revises the result. They usually appear very dark - to my eye at least - and this makes me question their stability. Once they have gone through a batch process and then been glued to a page and passed through binding machines, who knows what tonal changes may have occurred, (even if the original were accurate). By all means believe them if you wish, but don't treat them as the only truth. They are as good an estimate as any, but other thoughts are probably equally valid. FWIW and IMHO, the best evidence appears in numerous autobiography mentions where the author refers to brown or green aeroplanes. I believe (IMHO) PC12 was much more often used than we realise, and many of the "brown" aeroplanes might well be either PC10 or PC12. Never yet have I read a pilot write generically about red RFC aircraft. Sandy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 04:47:03 -0800 From: Eric Fisher To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: RE: The Skull Collection Message-ID: >Bob, > > >> The D.I that Prinz something or other was killed in while >> flying with Jasta > >Okay, I think I know the machine, but can't find the photo. > >Shane This is the a/c of Prince Friedrich Karl of Prussia. His D.I was shot down, behind British lines, in March 1917. The photo of his nearly - intact a/c (minus wings), occupied by Allied infantry personnel, has been widely published. (Also widely publicized probably: wonder if this particular photo was responsible for the popularity of the skull as a symbol in Hollywood -- for example as the unit insignia of 'von Ritter" and his flying circus in "Dawn Patrol"?) I can find the photo in "Over the Front" #3(4) and also "Albatros Fighters" datafile special, but I'm sure it appears in other pubs also. Eric ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 07:09:56 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: List Message-ID: <19990116.073526.-879477.0.mbittner@juno.com> On Sat, 16 Jan 1999 01:15:26 -0500 (EST) Mike Fletcher writes: >the list faq needs a small fix - there is an extra tag that >renders it almost unreadable. I guess I don't understand. I supply the FAQ as a text file. FWIW, I have been working on changes to the FAQ, and am almost done. Matt Bittner ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 07:11:42 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: RE: Sopwith Triplanes Message-ID: <19990116.073526.-879477.1.mbittner@juno.com> On Sat, 16 Jan 1999 03:06:41 -0500 (EST) bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) writes: >No - of course not. But the official IPMS classification is >something along the lines of "Biplanes and Pioneers (and other >aircraft which are primarily fabric and rigging)" I wish they would change its name. Plus, I wish they would split it at the national level, instead of opting to do it at contests. Columbus really ticked me off... Matt Bittner ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 07:16:28 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: The Skull Collection Message-ID: <19990116.073526.-879477.4.mbittner@juno.com> On Fri, 15 Jan 1999 18:11:13 -0500 (EST) "Steven M. Perry" writes: >Nobody is likely to complete the collection single handed, but as a >group...Who knows? > >Ok, who has any of these planes built? Kits/decal sheets? I have >Bromowski's (sp?). Can we put together the set? If so, maybe Allan >could >add photos to the web page under a special heading. Any interest in >such a >group project? That sounds like a great idea! I haven't seen anymore discussion about it though. Anybody else interested? Matt Bittner ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 07:14:26 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com (Matthew E Bittner) To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: PC12 & paint chips Message-ID: <19990116.073526.-879477.2.mbittner@juno.com> On Sat, 16 Jan 1999 05:52:07 -0500 (EST) "Sandy Adam" writes: >FWIW and IMHO, the best evidence appears in numerous autobiography >mentions >where the author refers to brown or green aeroplanes. >I believe (IMHO) PC12 was much more often used than we realise, and >many of >the "brown" aeroplanes might well be either PC10 or PC12. >Never yet have I read a pilot write generically about red RFC >aircraft. Did anybody buy the special "brand" of paint that was being offered through the pages of early Windsocks? The company came out with PC10, PC12 and CDL. Just wondering how those look. Anybody willing to make a general statement on PC12 and Polly Scale? Which color comes close, etc.? Any "close" FS match? Matt Bittner ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:13:17 -0600 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: The Skull Collection Message-ID: <36A09E7D.3CA9@bellsouth.net> Matthew E Bittner wrote: > That sounds like a great idea! I haven't seen anymore discussion about > it though. Anybody else interested? > Well.... while I have no immediate plans to start on it, my Eduard SSW will most likely be sporting the skull & x-bones decals supplied with the kit. And if I EVER finish it, or any other on-topic model, I will most certainly send pics to Fearless Leader(Allan) for inclusion in the gallery. Neat idea though, fwiw. E. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 08:14:56 -0600 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Sopwith Triplanes Message-ID: <36A09EE0.7224@bellsouth.net> Bill Shatzer wrote: > > Richard wrote: > > >Was the Fokker EIII a BI-plane ? > > No - of course not. But the official IPMS classification is > something along the lines of "Biplanes and Pioneers (and other > aircraft which are primarily fabric and rigging)" > I really hate this rule! E. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:15:43 -0500 From: "David Vosburgh" To: Subject: Re: Sopwith Triplanes Message-ID: <001601be4163$16d3ce60$1b7433cf@Pvosburg> This brings to mind a passage from Major V. Page's "Modern Aircraft" dealing with the R.A.E.'s experiments on preventing deterioration of fabric by the use of pigmented varnish. I always assumed that the P.C.10 (and -12, presumably) formula was developed primarily as camouflage... but according to this the khaki color was pretty much co-incidental, the iron oxides providing "a high extinction coefficient for actinic light", etc.. If anyone would like to read the original (about a page and a half), give me a shout off-list. Since the book was published in 1928 I don't think sharing scans will create a problem. DV -----Original Message----- From: Bill Shatzer To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 1:18 AM Subject: RE: Sopwith Triplanes > > > >Michael writes: > >> At the risk of starting another avalanche, what do you all think >>about that kit? I'd kind of like to try PC 12 on it but I don't know if I >>could stand to use Brick Red (as someone once suggested). That seems just a >>little too red for my taste on an RNAS machine. Anyone agree, or am I way >>out there? Thanks again, this is fun! > >Ray Rimmell gave us two paint chips in Windsock V.3, N.1 - one supposedly >matched to a "well worn and faded DH.9A based in India" while the >other is supposedly the "average hue for fresh PC12 dope". While the >"sample" is decidedly "brownish", the fresh sample is certainly what >I would call "brick red". I have a note in this issue, scribbled I >don't know how many years ago which I noted that Floquil Boxcar Red is >a close match to the "fresh sample" (Apparently, I never found or wasn't >interested in the "faded" color.) > >Rimmell indicates that these paint chips were matched to fabric samples >provided by Ian Huntley which is pretty supporting authority. And, >the formula for PC12 called for Red Iron Oxide with a little lampblack >added. Straight Red Iron Oxide was pretty red - the formula for >Ident.Red (Dull) which was used for the national insignia on night >bombers was merely straight Red Iron Oxide without the lampblack. > >The Methuen references Rimmell gives are 9E6 for the faded and 9E8 >for the fresh if that's any help. > >But, if you're doing a fresh color, brick red (or boxcar red) it is, >I'm afraid. Faded, the color becomes more brownish and less reddish - >least if Rimmell and Huntley know what they were talking about. > >Cheers and all, > > >-- > Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org > > "Cave ab homine unius librum." > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:14:54 -0500 From: "Brad Gossen" To: Subject: Re: PC12 & paint chips Message-ID: <199901161521.KAA28817@mail5.globalserve.net> Sandy wrote: "By all means believe them if you wish, but don't treat them as the only truth" and "Never yet have I read a pilot write generically about red RFC aircraft". This is exactly why I collect pilot autobiographies. Some of these gents were very descriptive. (No doubt due in part to Public Schools and Oxbridge). I have read at least three sources which describe PC12 as Ginger or Dark Ginger. This somehow satisfied my imagination. Unfortunately I have yet to read a satisfying description of the various shades of blue. Everyone's perception of these seems to have been different. Therefore when it comes to blue I tend to rely more heavily on chips and colour profiles. Red is fairly straight forward (unless you're discussing a certain Triplane)! PC10, despite all the recipes that have been published still doesn't look right to me until I've tinkered with it. Even when it looks right in the pot it can still fool you after it's been applied and dried. Then it'll look right on a Camel but somehow not quite right on an RE. I know this has been discussed before. How each batch was probably different when mixed in the field, etc... But I still feel there's a kind of sixth sense involved as well as some personal preference. Anybody up for an online seance? [anybody know how to spell seance?] Brad ---------- > From: Sandy Adam > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: PC12 & paint chips > Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 5:52 AM > > > least if Rimmell and Huntley know what they were talking about. > > I'd give the Windsock paint chips a cautious reception, in general, if I > were you. While the > idea is good, the results often don't look right to me. In one of the > earliest > issues RR admits that fresh evidence on a Pfalz throws confusion and > revises the result. > They usually appear very dark - to my eye at least - and this makes me > question their stability. Once they have gone through a batch process and > then been glued to a > page and passed through binding machines, who knows what tonal changes may > have occurred, (even if the original were accurate). > By all means believe them if you wish, but don't treat them as the only > truth. They > are as good an estimate as any, but other thoughts are probably equally > valid. > > FWIW and IMHO, the best evidence appears in numerous autobiography mentions > where the author refers to brown or green aeroplanes. > I believe (IMHO) PC12 was much more often used than we realise, and many of > the "brown" aeroplanes might well be either PC10 or PC12. > Never yet have I read a pilot write generically about red RFC aircraft. > Sandy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:32:23 -0500 From: "David Vosburgh" To: Subject: Re: Eduard Pfalz DIII Message-ID: <005401be4165$6acbdc40$1b7433cf@Pvosburg> Any chance of seeing some photos?? DV -----Original Message----- From: Rick Milas To: Multiple recipients of list Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 5:42 AM Subject: RE: Eduard Pfalz DIII >Except for the rigging I finished my Pfalz DIII tonight. I'm pleased with >the results. I want to thank everyone for the help they gave me over the >past several months. Couldn't have done it without you! Now it's time to >start the Eduard Albatros DIII I got for Christmas. >Rick Milas > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:40:16 -0600 From: "John C Glaser" To: "WW1 Mail List" Subject: Pensacola Naval Air Museum Message-ID: <000001be4166$83f25900$f011820a@johng-home> I'll have an open afternoon in my travel schedule on Monday and was planning to visit the Naval Air Museum in Pensacola. Naturally, first stop will be the on-topic exhibits. Any other suggestions on what to see & do? I've already visited their web page. - John ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:51:42 -0600 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Pensacola Naval Air Museum Message-ID: <36A0B58E.59E7@bellsouth.net> John C Glaser wrote: > > I'll have an open afternoon in my travel schedule on Monday and was planning > to visit the Naval Air Museum in Pensacola. Naturally, first stop will be > the on-topic exhibits. Any other suggestions on what to see & do? I've > already visited their web page. > Hey John, That's a first class museum. It's easy to spend an entire day there. Take a lot of pics. E. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:20:03 +0200 From: Yves Buffetaut To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Vacuform Collection Message-ID: <36A0AE05.5D8@club-internet.fr> Dear List, To read all your messages gave me today the wish to look at what was left in my shelves, as far as the WW1 kits were concerned. I didn’t remember I had so many models to build. I suppose you can help me, because I have mainly got vacuforms and they need all Aeroclubs parts, but I’ve lost the address and I don’t know what to order. Here is the list of my kits (all 1/72) : Vacuform Avro 504 K Expomodel (no engine) Nieuport Nighthawk Blue Rider (complete with white metal parts) Hansa Brandenburg D1 MHW Models (complete with no decals) Halberstadt CL II Formaplane (no engine, no decals, ugly wheels) AEG GIV (2 times) Classic Plane (no engine, no decals) Caudron G III Roseplane (no engine, good decals) Gotha GIV Rareplane (no engine, no decals) Pomilio PE Libramodels (complete with decals) Caudron G4 Formaplane (ugly kit with nothing) Blériot XI Formaplane (what a miss !) Blériot XI Skuld (with metal parts) Sopwith Classic Classic Plane (no engine, no decals) Nieuport 27 Skuld (no decals) Lloyd CII Joystick (complete with decals) Navy Jenny NAF (lovely kit) Mitsubishi IMFI-10 Phœnix (no engine, no decals) Nieuport XI Classic Plane (no engine, no decals) DH1 or 1a Phœnix (no engine, no decals) DH6 Phœnix (no engine, no decals) Thomas Morse Warbirds (no engine, no decals) Be2c Formaplane (no engine, no decals, but good kit) Dorand AR1A2 Joystick (with decals) FBA Lévêque Libramodels (white metal + decals) Eole (off-topic) Skud (with white metal parts) Otto Doppeldecker Phœnix (no engine, no decals) Sopwith Camel Blue Rider (conversion with photo-etched parts AD Sparrow scout Expomodel (no engine, no decals) Farman MF20 HF23 Skuld (with engine and wheels) Ansaldo Ballila A1 Joystick (with decals) Voisin LA III Classic Plane (with white metal, no decals) DFW CV Classic Plane (no engine, no decals) Sopwith Batboat Joystick Models (no decals) Halberstadt CL IV Joystick Models (no decalls) Nieuport Mono 1912 Scaleplanes (no engine, no decals) Be2a Phœnix (no engine, no decals) Martinsyde S1 Classic Plane (no engine, no decals) Short run Sopwith Dolphin Pegasus Resin Junkers J4 Eurokit (superb kit, no decals) Salmson 2A2 Replica (with decals) White metal Fokker DVIII ??? (no decals) “Normal” kits Sopwith Triplane Revell Fokker E III Revell SE 5a Esci RE8 (2 times) Airfix (vintage aircraft collection) Bristol F2b (2 times)Airfix (vintage aircraft collection) Airco DH4 (2 times) Airfix (vintage aircraft collection) Roland C II Airfix (vintage aircraft collection) Albatros DV Airfix (vintage aircraft collection) Spad VII Airfix As you see, it is very old stuff and I wonder if some of the makers are still on the market. I wonder what I had in mind to get 37 vacuforms ! If you’re interested in the kits I have twice, let me know off list. Have you ever made some of these kits ? And if so, which one seems to you the less distressful ? Thanks for your comments. Yves ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 11:34:42 -0500 From: "Brad Gossen" To: Subject: Re: Sopwith Triplanes Message-ID: <199901161641.LAA03162@mail5.globalserve.net> Hey Dave. What chapter and page? I have a copy but can't find this reference. Thanks Brad ---------- > From: David Vosburgh > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Re: Sopwith Triplanes > Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 10:15 AM > > This brings to mind a passage from Major V. Page's "Modern Aircraft" dealing > with the R.A.E.'s experiments on preventing deterioration of fabric by the > use of pigmented varnish. I always assumed that the P.C.10 (and -12, > presumably) formula was developed primarily as camouflage... but according > to this the khaki color was pretty much co-incidental, the iron oxides > providing "a high extinction coefficient for actinic light", etc.. > > If anyone would like to read the original (about a page and a half), give me > a shout off-list. Since the book was published in 1928 I don't think sharing > scans will create a problem. > > DV > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Shatzer > To: Multiple recipients of list > Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 1:18 AM > Subject: RE: Sopwith Triplanes > > > > > > > > > >Michael writes: > > > >> At the risk of starting another avalanche, what do you all think > >>about that kit? I'd kind of like to try PC 12 on it but I don't know if I > >>could stand to use Brick Red (as someone once suggested). That seems just > a > >>little too red for my taste on an RNAS machine. Anyone agree, or am I way > >>out there? Thanks again, this is fun! > > > >Ray Rimmell gave us two paint chips in Windsock V.3, N.1 - one supposedly > >matched to a "well worn and faded DH.9A based in India" while the > >other is supposedly the "average hue for fresh PC12 dope". While the > >"sample" is decidedly "brownish", the fresh sample is certainly what > >I would call "brick red". I have a note in this issue, scribbled I > >don't know how many years ago which I noted that Floquil Boxcar Red is > >a close match to the "fresh sample" (Apparently, I never found or wasn't > >interested in the "faded" color.) > > > >Rimmell indicates that these paint chips were matched to fabric samples > >provided by Ian Huntley which is pretty supporting authority. And, > >the formula for PC12 called for Red Iron Oxide with a little lampblack > >added. Straight Red Iron Oxide was pretty red - the formula for > >Ident.Red (Dull) which was used for the national insignia on night > >bombers was merely straight Red Iron Oxide without the lampblack. > > > >The Methuen references Rimmell gives are 9E6 for the faded and 9E8 > >for the fresh if that's any help. > > > >But, if you're doing a fresh color, brick red (or boxcar red) it is, > >I'm afraid. Faded, the color becomes more brownish and less reddish - > >least if Rimmell and Huntley know what they were talking about. > > > >Cheers and all, > > > > > >-- > > Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org > > > > "Cave ab homine unius librum." > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:10:09 -0700 From: "D. Anderson" <2814823733@home.com> To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: RE: Eduard Pfalz DIII Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990116101009.006f9cac@mail> At 04:19 AM 16/01/99 -0500, you wrote: >Except for the rigging I finished my Pfalz DIII tonight. I'm pleased with >the results. I want to thank everyone for the help they gave me over the >past several months. Couldn't have done it without you! Now it's time to >start the Eduard Albatros DIII I got for Christmas. >Rick Milas > > Yes, it's a great kit, no? Dane ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 10:13:34 -0700 From: "D. Anderson" <2814823733@home.com> To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Sopwith Triplanes Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990116101334.006fc978@mail> At 09:17 AM 16/01/99 -0500, you wrote: >Bill Shatzer wrote: >> >> Richard wrote: >> >> >Was the Fokker EIII a BI-plane ? >> >> No - of course not. But the official IPMS classification is >> something along the lines of "Biplanes and Pioneers (and other >> aircraft which are primarily fabric and rigging)" >> >I really hate this rule! >E. > Yes, it would make much more sense to have a chronological classification, like 1903-1918. This way, you could compete against a CR.42 or a Gladiator c. 1941. Not that you couldn't beat them, but it just seems to make sense to judge like with like. Dane ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 17:21:55 GMT From: michel.lefort@ping.be (Michel LEFORT) To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Completely off-topic but so funny ;-) Message-ID: <36a7c9cb.112114884@relay.ping.be> Here is an excerpt from Win Letter (http://winmag.com/elgan/winletter/): UNSUBSTANTIATED RUMOR The Chinese government has a novel solution for motivating the Chinese airline industry to prevent Y2K-related airplane accidents: They're ordering all Chinese airline executives to fly on January 1, 2000. Do we have to open our paint, cement, ... bottles on January 1, 2000 to check if they are Y2K compatible? ;-) Sorry, but I could not resist after reading the above text. Regards. -- Michel Lefort - Braine-l'Alleud, Belgium IPMS Belgium Treasurer & Foreign Liaison Officer (member F012) MAFVA member #6708 http://www.ping.be/ipms-belgium Plastic Modelling is holding History in your Hand ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 12:55:59 -0500 From: Dennis Ugulano To: "wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu" Subject: Re: Vacuform Collection Message-ID: <199901161256_MC2-66EB-F253@compuserve.com> Yves, >> I wonder what I had in mind to get 37 vacuforms ! << Probably the same thing I had in mind only I have probably 250-300 vacuforms. I have 84 completed kits and about 20 of them are vacs. Give me a few days and I will give you a quick run down of your vacs. On your list I have completed the following: Roseplane Caudron GIII Excellent kit Libramodels Pomilio PE Very good Phoenix Otto Doppledecker Under construction, good Pegasus Sopwith Dolphin Good kit Will get back to you in a couple of days. Dennis Ugulano email: Uggies@compuserve.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 22:25:41 -0800 From: mgoodwin@ricochet.net To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: PC12 & paint chips Message-ID: <36A18265.1CEF@ricochet.net> Matthew E Bittner wrote: > > Anybody willing to make a general statement on PC12 and Polly Scale? > Which color comes close, etc.? I recently discovered Floquil Caboose Red is a bit browner than it looks in the jar and may be a good starting point for PC12. I like Testors Rust for faded PC12. > Any "close" FS match? Match to what - the Windsock chips, Mk.I eyeball or ? FWIW, Riordan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 19:32:45 +0200 From: Yves Buffetaut To: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Subject: Re: Vacuform Collection Message-ID: <36A0CD18.7A35@club-internet.fr> Dear Dennis, Thanks for your answer. What is Aeroclub's address (if it still exists). Yves ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 12:35:03 -0600 From: "richard eaton" To: Subject: Re: Vacuform Collection Message-ID: <199901161835.MAA05611@sierra.onr.com> Yves, first of all welcome to the list from sunny central Texas. Always nice to have a scholar and writer join up. Especially from la belle France! Always scary to go through the closet. I recently did that and was assisted in clearing out extras by several of the learned members of the list. I have had experience with the following. > AEG GIV (2 times) Classic Plane (no engine, no decals) > Gotha GIV Rareplane (no engine, no decals) > DH1 or 1a Phœnix (no engine, no decals) > Ansaldo Ballila A1 Joystick (with decals) > Martinsyde S1 Classic Plane (no engine, no decals) Of those the Ansaldo Ballila A1 is the least stressful and builds up nicely. As a rule the Blue rider kits are some of the best (and costly) Vacs I have built. Of the "Normal" kits the Roland C II by Airfix is easy, fun, and nice. For aftermarket motors/guns etc. I can recommend Hannants on your side of the pond. Great service and web site. bon jour and regards, Richard ---------- > From: Yves Buffetaut > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Vacuform Collection > Date: Saturday, January 16, 1999 10:19 AM > > Dear List, > > As you see, it is very old stuff and I wonder if some of the makers are > still on the market. I wonder what I had in mind to get 37 vacuforms ! > If you’re interested in the kits I have twice, let me know off list. > Have you ever made some of these kits ? And if so, which one seems to > you the less distressful ? > Thanks for your comments. > Yves ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 1391 **********************