WWI Digest 854 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: 1998 WW1 Calendar by Joey Valenciano 2) Re: JvBertrab's purple Albatross by Joey Valenciano 3) Re: JvBertrab's purple Albatross by fedders 4) Re: JvBertrab's purple Albatross by "Sandy Adam" 5) Re: turned metal finishes, Ernest's Fokkers by Charles Hart 6) Re: FYI by Charles Hart 7) Toko kits #2 (SSW D.III/D.IV) by infosilver@czechia.com 8) Fokker E.III rudder by Geoff Smith 9) Re: Syndicate still wanted. by "Tom Werner Hansen" 10) Il'ya Muromets by mbittner@juno.com 11) Re: FYI by mbittner@juno.com 12) Re: Toko kits #2 (SSW D.III/D.IV) by mbittner@juno.com 13) Re: FYI by Charles Hart 14) Champlin-Tallman by KarrArt 15) Champlin Berg by TPT PUMPER 16) purple & other stuff by KarrArt 17) Printing onto plastic card by Geoff Smith 18) Lozenge colour shades by infosilver@czechia.com 19) Re: Champlin Berg by KarrArt 20) RE: Lozenge colour shades by "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" 21) Re: Il'ya Muromets by "Sandy Adam" 22) Re: Il'ya Muromets by KarrArt 23) Re: Printing onto plastic card by KarrArt 24) Re: Lozenge colour shades by KarrArt 25) Re: Il'ya Muromets by mbittner@juno.com 26) Re: Champlin Berg by mbittner@juno.com 27) Re: Ethnic Slurs by Mick Fauchon 28) Re: Ethnic Slurs by Mick Fauchon 29) Re: FYI by Riordan and Michelle Goodwin 30) Bergman MP 18/1 dimensions by Riordan and Michelle Goodwin 31) Re: FYI by mbittner@juno.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 22:56:37 +0800 From: Joey Valenciano To: wwi Subject: Re: 1998 WW1 Calendar Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980119225637.006ce95c@philonline.com.ph> >> I was surprised, honored, and amused > (At least it wasn't incensed, outraged and angry...) Surprised - I don't think much about my artistic acumen. Honored - that you considered using it. Amused - how far stuff could go once you shoot it out into (virtual) space. >> Graham, where'd you get the profile of the twin seater on the Nov-Dec .jpg? > >Alas, I do not keep details of exactly where I find jpgs/gifs on the >Net, although I do keep all interesting URL's in my bookmarks. However, >I'm fairly sure it was from what is now a back edition of Chandelle. I don't think so.... Most of Chandelle's images are original artwork, photos are rarely used, if ever. Of course we could ask Rob Johnson or Charles Hart to confirm..... ********************************************************************* Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician, joeyval@pusit.admu.edu.ph sitarist tel. (632) 921-26-75 Metro-Manila, Philippines "The more you know, the more you don't know." ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 23:00:31 +0800 From: Joey Valenciano To: wwi Subject: Re: JvBertrab's purple Albatross Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980119230031.006ce95c@philonline.com.ph> >Isn't it a shame that Hawker's pusher was so outclassed - if he could just >have had a Pup a few weeks later, he could have stopped the murdering >little Prussian in his tracks there and then. Just think - no Red Baron >crap to have to put up with ever after! >Wishfully >Sandy But then Lanoe could have then claimed the right to rouge his mount to show to all the superiority of his race over the Teutons. Nah, he's not the type. ********************************************************************* Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician, joeyval@pusit.admu.edu.ph sitarist tel. (632) 921-26-75 Metro-Manila, Philippines "The more you know, the more you don't know." ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 09:21:38 -0600 (CST) From: fedders To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: JvBertrab's purple Albatross Message-ID: On Sat, 17 Jan 1998, KarrArt wrote: > In a message dated 98-01-17 17:38:50 EST, you write: > > << I have found that getting "purple" as we may commonly know it (neither > blue-violet or red-violet) is virtually impossible to obtain from mixing > red & blue pigments together. At least not what most people would > commonly accept as purple. You get a maroon hue, >> > It is difficult.Most reds have a small amount of yellow in them and this kicks > any attempt at purple over into the slighty brownish range.The ONLY red I've > found that works is good ol' Polly S Fire Red. Almost any blue will work with > this (provided there's no yellow in it!) > Robert I think that Floquil makes a color called Napolean Violet - or something like that- that is a pretty true purple (not red or blue) pfed> ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 16:43:52 -0000 From: "Sandy Adam" To: Subject: Re: JvBertrab's purple Albatross Message-ID: <199801191547.PAA23405@beryl.sol.co.uk> > >Isn't it a shame that Hawker's pusher was so outclassed - if he could just > >have had a Pup a few weeks later, he could have stopped the murdering > >little Prussian in his tracks there and then. Just think - no Red Baron > >crap to have to put up with ever after! > >Wishfully > >Sandy > > But then Lanoe could have then claimed the right to rouge his mount to show > to all the superiority of his race over the Teutons. > Nah, he's not the type. > Joey Valenciano Well since we were originally talking about some goon in a purple Albabore, maybe we could consider that Hawker would have painted his planes purple thereafter - thus starting the legend of the Lavender Lanoe. Nah, on reflection, better to leave the unspeakable Manfred to the ridicule of future generations who think he was shot down by a dog flying a kennel. Sandy ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 09:45:30 -0700 From: Charles Hart To: wwi Subject: Re: turned metal finishes, Ernest's Fokkers Message-ID: >That would be great - and we could have a future OTF gathering in Seattle >:-) None of this spending all day flitting about North America for me - the >rest of you however . . . . . > >Regards, > Bob Pearson > >---------- >> From: "Chris Banyai-Riepl" > >> I just took a look at Ernest's web site, and I noticed that he's got >> pictures of the Champlin collection. I've heard a pretty solid rumor that >> the Boeing Museum up in Seattle has purchased the majority of the Champlin >> collection, including all of the WWI stuff, and will be bringing it North >> over the next two years. They also got most of the WWII stuff, with the >> exception of the P-51. So, if you're down in that area, you might want to >> take lots of pictures before they leave, and if you're in the Pacific >> Northwest, hang on for a couple of years.... >> >> This rumor was from one of the museum directors, so I think that it is >> pretty solid. >> >> Chris Banyai-Riepl I seem to remember a rumor that the airport that houses the Champlin collection was due to close due to encroaching development in the area. Some CAF a/c were being displaced as well. The gem of the Champlin collection is the original Aviatik Berg D-I in nice hand painted "summer leaf" colors. Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 09:54:08 -0700 From: Charles Hart To: wwi Subject: Re: FYI Message-ID: >On Sat, 17 Jan 1998 11:16:04 -0500 Carlos Valdes > writes: > >>Found this at a Polish on-line hobby shop (some snipping): >> >>TOKO has announced its releasing plans for 1998 - here they are: >> Sopwith 7F1 Snipe and Nieuport 11 Bebe (1/72, Feb.) >> Hansa Brandenburg W29, Aviatik Berg D I (Mar.) >> Hansa Brandenburg D I, Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter (Apr) >> >> The Pfalz D.XII and SSW D.III/IV are already >>out. > >Finally some dates! Looks like I'll be going broke in February (just how >many Nie.11's should I buy? :-)) and April. However, the Aviatik is new >to me. Too cool! > >Anybody have the Pfalz and SSW yet? > All of these Toko kits have had earlier guises as Czech resin kits, though I have never seen a resin example of the Hansa Brandenburg D-I Star--strutter. Anyone on this list have one ? Comments ? Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 98 17:51:01 -01 From: infosilver@czechia.com To: wwi Subject: Toko kits #2 (SSW D.III/D.IV) Message-ID: Siemens Schuckert D.III/D.IV kit comes in low-weight cardboard box containing two sprues molded in light grey styrene and holding 37 parts. All parts are well molded with little flash and similar combination of fine negative and positive engraving, as well as fabric weave as previously described Pfalz D.XII kit. Kit includes necessary parts to build both D.III and D.IV versions: two versions of upper and lower wings, interplane and cabane struts, rudders, tail skids and propeller spinners. Sh.III engine replica has correct number of 11 cylinders, but is quite schematic. Little decal sheet provides late German "Balkenkreuze" for different chord wings, registration number for D.IV version (Sim.Schuc. D.IV 3083/18), weight table, manufacturer's insignia for prop blades, struts orientation markings and white "LO!" insignia for Ernst Udet's D.III. Greater decal sheets provides identical (and incorrect) 4-colour lozenge for both sides of upper and lower wings, rudder, tail plane and interplane struts. Colour shades are the same as in Pfalz D.XII kit. Instruction sheet and colouring scheme on the box back suggest Oblt. E. Udet's red/lozenge D.III machine and Oblt. Alfred Lenz's green/lozenge SSW D.IV 3083/18. I still haven't tried to build it so I can say nothing to the fit of parts. Overall in-box rating: nice kit enabling to build one of two visually distinct versions. Left parts can be used for another scratch project.Lozenge version not recommended. Ivan Subrt "The air is our sea." Czech proverb ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 13:29:44 -0500 From: Geoff Smith To: WWI List Subject: Fokker E.III rudder Message-ID: <199801191330_MC2-2FE2-FC23@compuserve.com> Hi y'all, First off, many thanks for the Poll Triplane info. Can someone explain how the E.III rudder was pivoted? From the datafile i= t looks like the lower end pivoted at the junction of the tailskid struts b= ut how about the upper end? TIA Regards, Geoff ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 20:15:45 +0100 From: "Tom Werner Hansen" To: Subject: Re: Syndicate still wanted. Message-ID: <199801191904.UAA22465@d1o211.telia.com> Graham: I could go in for the Harleyford book, but I know nothing of the other one, advise me. Tom ---------- > From: Graham Nash > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Syndicate still wanted. > Date: 19. januar 1998 11:15 > > As an update, it looks like the seller will only sell them as a set, so > we're looking for likely purchasers for the Harleyford Fighters book and > the earlier 'Aircraft of the 1914-1918 War', at GBP22.50. > > Hopefully, ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 13:02:41 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Il'ya Muromets Message-ID: <19980119.130859.4070.1.mbittner@juno.com> YES!!! I scoff at all you people who have bought multiple Maquetes Il'ya's. ICM has announced an Il'ya in 1/72nd!!!! Word has it it's more accurate and better detailed than the Maquetes version. Good think I decided to hold off buying the Maquetes! I have seen other ICM kits, and they're not bad. Detail wise they're wonderful; fit wise, well, it fits, let's put it that way. However, for a more accurate Il'ya, I have no problem with fit(s). I throw them often! :-) Squadron (John): will you be bringing these out under the Encore banner like you have the other ICM 1/72nd kits? Please say yes. :-) Matt Bittner nb: it's been going five years, but I'm back at the Nie.11. Only for the Toko to come out... nl: Computer Fan, by Computers By Malone... ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 13:14:33 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: FYI Message-ID: <19980119.131439.4070.4.mbittner@juno.com> On Mon, 19 Jan 1998 11:55:02 -0500 Charles Hart writes: > All of these Toko kits have had earlier guises as Czech resin >kits, though I have never seen a resin example of the Hansa Brandenburg D-I >Star--strutter. Anyone on this list have one ? Comments ? You have seen the kits then? Why are you holding out. :-) Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 13:13:47 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Toko kits #2 (SSW D.III/D.IV) Message-ID: <19980119.131439.4070.3.mbittner@juno.com> On Mon, 19 Jan 1998 12:41:26 -0500 infosilver@czechia.com writes: > Kit includes necessary parts to build both D.III and D.IV > versions: two versions of upper and lower wings, interplane and > cabane struts, rudders, tail skids and propeller spinners. > Sh.III engine replica has correct number of 11 cylinders, but is > quite schematic. Super. I am so happy to hear this. If you have the Datafile, could you spec it out? I'm curious just how they stack up scale wise. I'm also happy to hear about the engine. Finally, something to do with all those Pegasus kits. :-) > I still haven't tried to build it so I can say nothing to the > fit of parts. Overall in-box rating: nice kit enabling to build > one of two visually distinct versions. Left parts can be used > for another scratch project.Lozenge version not recommended. So far one of the "other" Toko kits is working out nicely. I'll give a more detailed appraisal of how the kit goes together as I continue along the build process. I don't think Toko kits are going to be a bad build; however, stay tuned. Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 12:46:47 -0700 From: Charles Hart To: wwi Subject: Re: FYI Message-ID: >On Mon, 19 Jan 1998 11:55:02 -0500 Charles Hart >writes: > >> All of these Toko kits have had earlier guises as Czech resin >>kits, though I have never seen a resin example of the Hansa Brandenburg >D-I >>Star--strutter. Anyone on this list have one ? Comments ? > >You have seen the kits then? Why are you holding out. :-) > > >Matt Bittner I'll clarify my earlier statement. All of the subjects on the TOKO WW I list have been past subjects of Czech Resin kits. My first suspicion on seeing the Toki list was that these would be mastered from the Czech kits, a la Pegasus and Merlin and others. I along with everyone else on this list await the arrival of Toko kits in a local shop. Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 14:51:18 EST From: KarrArt To: wwi Subject: Champlin-Tallman Message-ID: <3326392b.34c3aeb9@aol.com> In a message dated 98-01-19 11:43:44 EST, you write: << The gem of the Champlin collection is the original Aviatik Berg D-I in nice hand painted "summer leaf" colors. Charles >> My heart belongs to the Pfalz D XII........sigh......chilhood memories of when it lived at Orange County Airport in the Tallman collection along with a SPAD VII, Camel, Farman Pusher, Fokker D VII, a couple of Nieuport 28s and an SE 5E.(the Fokker E III was a replica- repro- but it did have a real rotary). Robert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 14:55:31 EST From: TPT PUMPER To: wwi Subject: Champlin Berg Message-ID: <71069504.34c3afb6@aol.com> In a message dated 98-01-19 11:43:44 EST, you write: > The gem of the Champlin > collection is the original Aviatik Berg D-I in nice hand painted "summer > leaf" colors. Does anyone have decent color shots of this bird that they could scan and email me? The undercarriage is wrong, but other than that it is a pretty bird, one of only two surviving examples of my favorite WWI production aeroplane. I have seen it only in b/w and in color in bad light. Thanks! Have Fun!! IRA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 14:51:11 EST From: KarrArt To: wwi Subject: purple & other stuff Message-ID: <2d1d35ab.34c3aeb7@aol.com> In a message dated 98-01-19 10:22:04 EST, you write: << It is difficult.Most reds have a small amount of yellow in them and this kicks > any attempt at purple over into the slighty brownish range.The ONLY red I've > found that works is good ol' Polly S Fire Red. Almost any blue will work with > this (provided there's no yellow in it!) > Robert I think that Floquil makes a color called Napolean Violet - or something like that- that is a pretty true purple (not red or blue) pfed> >> Even with Fire Red there is the ocassional batch that's not as pure.Another thing about this color is that it doesn't seem to fade as badly as some other reds- a problem I've had with Humbrol reds.For oil colors I use the little glass bottle Testors- both the flat and gloss- very little fading. The old Testors in the little glass bottles also had (may still have!) a color called "purple" which was pretty close to being exactly that. Robert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 16:04:49 -0500 From: Geoff Smith To: WWI List Subject: Printing onto plastic card Message-ID: <199801191605_MC2-2FDF-B9E3@compuserve.com> Gentlemen, Being the one who passed on the information about the above, I thought I'= d better live dangerously ( literally, since it was a Christmas present fro= m the wife ). Accordingly, I did some tests with my three week old Epson 40= 0. I used plastic card from 5 thou to 20 thou with no printer problems. Bubbling of the ink occurred when printing large areas of colour onto shi= ny card but was almost non-existent if the card was rubbed with 1200 grade wet/dry paper. The quality of a very thin line was excellent on both shin= y and flatted card. However my recommendation is to use flatted card wiped with a damp cloth to remove residual dust. It would seem, so far, to be a= n excellent way to produce part shapes from scanned plans (if you trust the= ir accuracy) or your own drawings but there's just one thing................= =2E. It's been 45 minutes since the first test and IT'S NOT DRY YET. I'll get back to you when I find out how long. Regards, Geoff. (yet another who daren't tell his wife what he does when she goes out) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 98 21:51:58 -01 From: infosilver@czechia.com To: wwi Subject: Lozenge colour shades Message-ID: Hello everybody, I spent some time browsing through WWI mailing list archive and found there very interesting thread dealing with German lozenge colour shades. Using Methuen colour references from WWI web site I followed Mr. Pearson's conversion table to CMYK signal to obtain these shades in my Corel Draw soft, but I am not very happy with the results. Light colours seem too bright, even gaudy, darker ones, especially Deep Turquoise 24E7, are almost black. Am I supposed to do something more in order to get better results (e.g. supress the colour hue or lower contrast)? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 16:03:33 EST From: KarrArt To: wwi Subject: Re: Champlin Berg Message-ID: <58bab84f.34c3bfa9@aol.com> In a message dated 98-01-19 15:05:02 EST, you write: << > The gem of the Champlin > collection is the original Aviatik Berg D-I in nice hand painted "summer > leaf" colors. Does anyone have decent color shots of this bird that they could scan and email me? The undercarriage is wrong, but other than that it is a pretty bird, one of only two surviving examples of my favorite WWI production aeroplane. I have seen it only in b/w and in color in bad light. Thanks! Have Fun!! IRA >> I'll see what I've got.Maybe some crude"Snappy" video grabs in addition to photos.Champlin is a wierdly lit place.The Pfalz D XII on the site that has Ernest's work has pretty good color- I'm envious! Robert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 16:23:45 -0600 From: "Dr. Phillip Anz-Meador" To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: Lozenge colour shades Message-ID: <01BD24F6.9F7BFE20.panz-meador@vsti.com> i also use corel draw & photo-paint; i'd be happy to check this stuff out if you'll send the color coordinates/references. phillip -----Original Message----- From: infosilver@czechia.com [SMTP:infosilver@czechia.com] Sent: Monday, January 19, 1998 3:26 PM To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Lozenge colour shades Hello everybody, I spent some time browsing through WWI mailing list archive and found there very interesting thread dealing with German lozenge colour shades. Using Methuen colour references from WWI web site I followed Mr. Pearson's conversion table to CMYK signal to obtain these shades in my Corel Draw soft, but I am not very happy with the results. Light colours seem too bright, even gaudy, darker ones, especially Deep Turquoise 24E7, are almost black. Am I supposed to do something more in order to get better results (e.g. supress the colour hue or lower contrast)? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 23:18:09 -0000 From: "Sandy Adam" To: Subject: Re: Il'ya Muromets Message-ID: <199801192221.WAA04207@beryl.sol.co.uk> > YES!!! I scoff at all you people who have bought multiple Maquetes > Il'ya's. > ICM has announced an Il'ya in 1/72nd!!!! Word has it it's more accurate > and better detailed than the Maquetes version. I don't know which version of Word you have but my version of Word97 doesn't waste space on boring 1/72 models. PS SAMI implied last year that the ICM may be reissued Maquette (sic) kit. Oh how I hope so! > Good think I decided to hold off buying the Maquetes! Nah, you crapped it - Hannants were selling them off for 5GBP each - even I bought one for a laugh! Sandy (Is a Maquete not some sort of parrot? - akin to the Norwegian Blue probably) ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:34:10 EST From: KarrArt To: wwi Subject: Re: Il'ya Muromets Message-ID: <4d2b1422.34c3d4e6@aol.com> In a message dated 98-01-19 17:28:32 EST, you write: << Norwegian Blue probably) >> pining for the fjords?Just resting? Robert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:34:08 EST From: KarrArt To: wwi Subject: Re: Printing onto plastic card Message-ID: <41617cd4.34c3d4e2@aol.com> In a message dated 98-01-19 16:22:21 EST, you write: << It's been 45 minutes since the first test and IT'S NOT DRY YET. I'll get back to you when I find out how long. Regards, Geoff. (yet another who daren't tell his wife what he does when she goes out) >> I've got a cannon bubble jet and in the experiments I've performed with relatively slick surfaces (decal paper both glossy and matte) the ink NEVER dries.Literally after 3 months the ink was still sticky. Robert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:34:09 EST From: KarrArt To: wwi Subject: Re: Lozenge colour shades Message-ID: <52ae57d4.34c3d4e3@aol.com> In a message dated 98-01-19 16:23:45 EST, you write: << I spent some time browsing through WWI mailing list archive and found there very interesting thread dealing with German lozenge colour shades. Using Methuen colour references from WWI web site I followed Mr. Pearson's conversion table to CMYK signal to obtain these shades in my Corel Draw soft, but I am not very happy with the results. Light colours seem too bright, even gaudy, darker ones, especially Deep Turquoise 24E7, are almost black. Am I supposed to do something more in order to get better results (e.g. supress the colour hue or lower contrast)? >> The problem with a lot of lozenge decals is the density.The colors might match the original inks but after printing the light color of the fabric shows through to a certain degree and diffuses the intensity.Some how one needs to get the off white fabric color into the lozenge without actually mixing.For models I make a weak off white mixture of fabric color, cranked the airbrush pressure for max atomization and dust all over the lozenge. For computer stuff, try an equivalent! Robert ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 18:19:23 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Il'ya Muromets Message-ID: <19980119.183747.4222.0.mbittner@juno.com> On Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:53:25 -0500 KarrArt writes: ><< Norwegian Blue > probably) > >> >pining for the fjords?Just resting? ROTFL!!! Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 18:37:43 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Champlin Berg Message-ID: <19980119.183747.4222.2.mbittner@juno.com> On Mon, 19 Jan 1998 16:37:58 -0500 KarrArt writes: >I'll see what I've got.Maybe some crude"Snappy" video grabs in >addition to photos.Champlin is a wierdly lit place.The Pfalz D XII on the site >that has Ernest's work has pretty good color- I'm envious! The cover of Windsock Vol 4 No 2 has some really great color photo's of the Champlin D.I, including a close up of the nose. Matt Bittner ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 11:52:44 +1100 (EST) From: Mick Fauchon To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Ethnic Slurs Message-ID: Bill, > I believe it derives from the German word for "cabbage head" - 'fraid not. The previous derivation for the word "Kraut" was quite correct, though I'm not sure when it came into use; certainly not in the early part of the war. The only word I can think of with a German derivation in this regard is "Kohlkopf" or "Kohlkopp", which means "cabb- age-head', but not in French 80( I'm not sure of the derivation of "boche", but I know that early in the war the French called electric magnetos "Bosches", as they were manufactured by Robert Bosch AG. > perhaps Mick or one of the German speakers on the list can > elucidate further as the precise word escapes me at present. In connection with what Sandy said, it's interesting that one of the first terms used by the BEF for the Germans was "Alleymans".... obviously from the French "allemands".......which itsself has German derivation, a genereic term used for the south/middle-german tribes, "alle-manni", i.e. "all the people". Have I suitably confused the issue? 80) > The word referred either to the shape of the German helmets or > the supposed intellegence of the Germans, or both. I'm open to advice on that one . Cheers, Mick. -- -- Mick Fauchon | Internet: ulmjf@dewey.newcastle.edu.au Reference Section, Auchmuty Library | Ph (intl+61+49) 215861 University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA | Fax (intl+61+49) 215833 MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM M M M Tasmanian Devil: "#@%!&^*%%...!#@!&**%^@@#$#-+*+*&##@...!!" M M M M Yosemite Sam : "Cut out that Army talk!..Yer in the Navy now!" M M M MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Jan 1998 12:04:40 +1100 (EST) From: Mick Fauchon To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Ethnic Slurs Message-ID: Brian, > In WWI the allies called the Germans "Boche" and "Huns" (as far as I > know "Kraut" didn't come in until WWII), but what did the Germans call > the various Allied nationalities? For the English, "Tommies"or "Briten", for the French, "Franzen", or "Franz" in the singular [from "Franzosen"], or if you were from the north of Germany, and the term probably stems from the French invasion of the Napoleonic Wars, "Poggenfr"ater", "frog-eaters". I'm pretty sure that the term "Amis" was used for Americans at that time too. Russians were "Iwans" or "Wasjas". To the Bavarians of course, any other "German" from north of the "Wei3wurstequator" [an imaginary line e/w through Frankfurt [a. M.], was, and often still is, a "Sauprei3". That's all I can think of for the moment. Mick. -- -- Mick Fauchon | Internet: ulmjf@dewey.newcastle.edu.au Reference Section, Auchmuty Library | Ph (intl+61+49) 215861 University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA | Fax (intl+61+49) 215833 MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM M M M Tasmanian Devil: "#@%!&^*%%...!#@!&**%^@@#$#-+*+*&##@...!!" M M M M Yosemite Sam : "Cut out that Army talk!..Yer in the Navy now!" M M M MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:26:25 -0800 From: Riordan and Michelle Goodwin To: wwi Subject: Re: FYI Message-ID: <34C3FD41.5EC5@ricochet.net> Charles Hart wrote: > > I along with everyone else on this > list await the arrival of Toko kits in a local shop. Does that mean they'll be priced < $20 US? -- --------------------------------------- This e-mail has been brought to you by - Riordan and Michelle Goodwin - ***************************** Great Gift Ideas at Jewels of the Silk Road http://www.silkroadjewels.com ***************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 17:57:39 -0800 From: Riordan and Michelle Goodwin To: wwi Subject: Bergman MP 18/1 dimensions Message-ID: <34C40493.2889@ricochet.net> I'm tring to scale out a drawing to 1/6. Anyone have dimensions for the world's first (?) sub-machinegun? TIA -- --------------------------------------- This e-mail has been brought to you by - Riordan and Michelle Goodwin - ***************************** Great Gift Ideas at Jewels of the Silk Road http://www.silkroadjewels.com ***************************** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 19 Jan 1998 20:00:34 -0600 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: FYI Message-ID: <19980119.200035.6510.0.mbittner@juno.com> On Mon, 19 Jan 1998 20:33:49 -0500 Riordan and Michelle Goodwin writes: >Does that mean they'll be priced < $20 US? One place I seen I think is asking $10.90 for them. Matt Bittner ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 854 *********************