WWI Digest 1182 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Load of old Tosh - was: Billy Bishop web page by bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) 2) Re: Load of old Tosh by Don RInker 3) by fedders 4) by fedders 5) by fedders 6) Pfalz D.III radiator colour by "Tom Werner Hansen" 7) Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits by Patrick Wilson 8) Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits by Suvoroff@aol.com 9) Re: Victory claims - was Load of old Tosh by JimMaas@aol.com 10) Re: Off-topic humour by mbittner@juno.com 11) Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits by mbittner@juno.com 12) Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits by mbittner@juno.com 13) Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits by Jeff Wilson 14) RE: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits by Shane Weier 15) Re: Nieuport 28 by Kenneth Hagerup 16) Italian Nieuport 11 by Kenneth Hagerup 17) Re: Italian Nieuport 11 by Mike Fletcher 18) A small mystery. by Zulis@aol.com 19) Re: Pfalz D.III radiator colour by Mick Fauchon 20) Re: A small mystery. by MACFARB@aol.com 21) Re: Victory claims - was Load of old Tosh by bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) 22) Re: SPAD THINGIES by "David R.L. Laws" 23) RE: SPAD THINGIES by Shane Weier 24) eBay item by Dave Watts 25) eBay by Dave Watts 26) eBay by Dave Watts 27) Flashback W.29 final report... by Jeff Wilson 28) Re: SPAD THINGIES by "David R.L. Laws" 29) Re: Pfalz D.III radiator colour by TPTPUMPER@aol.com 30) Re: Victory claims - was Load of old Tosh by "Sandy Adam" 31) Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits by mbittner@juno.com 32) Re: Italian Nieuport 11 by mbittner@juno.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 10:45:53 -0700 (PDT) From: bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: Load of old Tosh - was: Billy Bishop web page Message-ID: <199808271745.KAA18654@ednet1.orednet.org> Sandy wrote: >> >> It is, indeed, not only a lot of "tosh" (a down-underism which I assume >> translates to the equivalent of "horse puckey"), but it is a great big >> manure wagon of "tosh"! >As is this whole pointless circular argument about who shot down more than >who else. There is no point in applying revisionism to the victory tallies >generally accepted as you can prove almost anything you want. Sigh! Every time Sandy warms to his favorite peeve, I swear I'll refrain from comment and then, against my better judgment, jump in anyway. The point is not to engage in futile comparisons about who shot down more than who or attempt to establish who was the better (more talented? more noble? more ruthless?) fighter pilot but rather to attempt to examine the historical record and attempt to keep it more or less straight - rather than accepting myth as history. If I might be excused for engaging in a uniquely American metaphor, no one, I think, claims that Roger Maris was a "better" baseball player than was Babe Ruth despite the fact that Maris holds the single season home run record with 61 and poor Ruth hit "only" 60. Still, those numbers are historical facts and myth and conjecture should not be substituted. And, if some one comes forward and claims that Jimmy Foxx _really_ hit four additional home runs in 1932 which were somehow overlooked in compiling the "official" statistics so that Foxx _really_ hit 62 home runs that year and should be thus anointed the official record holder - well that claim should at least receive a degree of critical scrutiny. And if the claim does not hold up to critical scrutiny, it should be rejected as myth and not accepted as fact. And that is about I all I was claiming with my "horse puckey" reference. Asserting a total of 98 "victories" to Mannock has about as much historical basis as ascribing 62 home runs to Foxx in 1932. It -might- have happened but in light of the available evidence, it seems -most- unlikely and more myth than fact. Which does not demean Mannock as either a pilot or a person in the slightest, any more than rejecting the claims of 62 home runs for Foxx means his bust should be removed from the Hall of Fame at Cooperstown. -general silliness snipped- >You don't. You can't. You accept that certain fairly arbitrary score tables >have been made up which will be of little use - and probably highly >misleading - in comparing the actual achievements of the individuals >concerned. Within that you can then discover all sorts of errors and >inconsistencies and regard them as interesting. >I've never heard of "horse puckey", but it sounds as if it approximates to >Old Tosh in the great scheme of things - and that describes this whole >business of which Ace had the biggest willy, exactly. No one, I think, advocates using "victory" totals to ascertain who had the biggest willy or as for any other comparative purposes between pilots as to who was the "greatest fighter pilot" or the "most wonderful individual" - which would be stupid comparisons in any case. However, when some one claims 98 victories for Mannock with little or no historical justification, it is, I think, important to question that assertion before the myth becomes accepted as the reality. I would be equally skeptical of a claim that MvR "really" had 120 "victories". "This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend." We all, hopefully, wish to avoid the legend becoming fact. Cheers and all, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org "Everything would have been calm in Franche Comte if ten lawyers had been hanged." ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 13:51:52 -0400 From: Don RInker To: wwi Subject: Re: Load of old Tosh Message-ID: <35E59CB8.2FA7@fast.net> Sandy Adam wrote: > > The Germans were lovely people who were forced into invading Belgium and > France to pre-empt somebody else doing it to them. In this view the > Lufstreitkraefte was manned by incredibly handsome and courageous men who > fought tenaciously against overwhelming Allied numbers and whose every move > was the stuff of heroism. Makes sense to me..... ;-) > Manfred von Richthofen was a saint and Billy Bishop, Rene > Fonck and Mick Mannock were egotistical tally counters who either bumped up > their claims themselves or had them bumped up by their friends. You're finally beginning to see the light. Now paste this on your mirror and read it every day for a month........... You forgot that BB, RF , and MM were pathetic wretches also.... ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 12:55:03 -0500 (CDT) From: fedders To: models Message-ID: If you add up all the British claims of kills, it is three time the number of German losses. Presumably the French, Americans, Russians, Italians, etc shot down a few planes so the Brits overcounted by about a factor of six. German and French claims are roughly in line with enemy losses. It isn't that the Brits were bigger liars than the Germans or French (although reading Sandy may give you that impression). The Germans and French required an independent verification for a kill and all that the Brits required was the word of the pilot. Believing a bunch of kids in their 20's about air kills or sexual conquests is not reasonable. You can't sneack out of this with OOC (out of control) claims as these made up less that 1/2 of all Brit victory claims. paf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 13:07:00 -0500 (CDT) From: fedders To: models Message-ID: I left this out of my last message. It is dificult to assess the amount of American claims but it was probably considerably more than the factor of 6 for the Brits. The Americans (who were led by British clones at that time) not only had the same moronic counting system as the Brits but they came in late and were afraid of not being in on the killing long enough. paf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 13:25:01 -0500 (CDT) From: fedders To: models Message-ID: The ridiculous Brit claims again surfaced in the battle of Britain. For a good account of this see "Piece of Cake" by Derek Robinson - who is a true blue Brit as Sandy is - but maybe a bit more interested in the truth. Apparenly even Churchill couldn't swallow the explanation that almost all German planes fell "into the sea" when most air fights were over land. Try reading it. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 22:25:51 +0200 From: "Tom Werner Hansen" To: Subject: Pfalz D.III radiator colour Message-ID: <199808272021.WAA04300@d1o211.telia.com> Greetings I may be a bit blind (that's why I'm doing 1/48 at the moment) but I can't figure out the colour of the upper wing radiator of the Pfalz D.III. In the colour plate that's included in the kit it looks a pale pink/beige, pretty much the colour of the rubber of the tyres. What colour was this fitting actually? Did it have the same colour on the underside of the wing? The sliding regulator is supposed to be "aluminium". Grateful for help on this one. Tom ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 16:41:28 -0400 From: Patrick Wilson To: wwi Subject: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits Message-ID: <35E5C477.2FB53B63@comversens.com> --------------DB783DAF7EE098FE78B3C259 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi folks. Just subscribed to this list today. I am primarily interested in 1/72nd scale kits. Specific aircraft that I am looking for include the BE2c, FE2b, Albatros DII, Pfalz DIII, Halberstadt DII, Sopwith Dolphin, and other unusual types. I am also looking to replace some of my old Revel kits such as the Sopwith Triplane, Fokker DVII, Morane Saulnier, etc. (I have gotten better in the last year and would like to replace some of my previous attempts). Any information regarding WWI kits (manufacturers, price, where available, etc.) would be very much appreciated. Thanks all. -- Patrick Wilson Andover Highlands x3008 --------------DB783DAF7EE098FE78B3C259 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi folks.

Just subscribed to this list today.  I am primarily interested in 1/72nd scale kits.
Specific aircraft that I am looking for include the BE2c, FE2b, Albatros DII,
Pfalz DIII, Halberstadt DII, Sopwith Dolphin, and other unusual types.  I am also
looking to replace some of my old Revel kits such as the Sopwith Triplane,
Fokker DVII, Morane Saulnier, etc. (I have gotten better in the last year and would
like to replace some of my previous attempts).

Any information regarding WWI kits (manufacturers, price, where available, etc.)
would be very much appreciated.

Thanks all.

-- 
                                        Patrick Wilson
                                        Andover Highlands
                                        x3008
  --------------DB783DAF7EE098FE78B3C259-- ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 17:32:20 EDT From: Suvoroff@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits Message-ID: <938da1bc.35e5d064@aol.com>> Welcome! Some of the aircraft you want to model are available, for example the Albatros D.II is out from Pegasus. Unfortunately, many of the Revell kits are out of production and have been so for some time, so they might be hard to get, like the Sopwith Triplane. And as for Nieuport 17's, don't even hope, Matt Bittner owns all the remaining unbuilt kits. Yours, James D. Gray ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 18:28:14 EDT From: JimMaas@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Victory claims - was Load of old Tosh Message-ID: <4ff808bd.35e5dd7e@aol.com>> At one point, when I obviously had too little to do with my time, I sat down with the various Over/Above/ the Front/Trench/Line aces books and counted up the number of Allied (and just of aces, remember) claims of Fokker Dr.I's. I picked the Dr.I for two reasons - it is relatively easy to pick out in the text listings, and it was the only significant German triplane so there shouldn't have been too many cases of pilot mis-identification. According to the claims, almost every Dr.I ever produced was shot down. Either (a) there was significant overclaiming, or (b) we now have an explanation why there aren't any surviving examples (I lean toward (a) myself...) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 18:11:12 -0500 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Off-topic humour Message-ID: <19980827.181141.-202187.3.mbittner@juno.com> On Thu, 27 Aug 1998 07:18:14 -0400 "Sandy Adam" writes: >I'd heard this before but just saw it in print in George Murdoch's >latest >Armchair Auctions catalogue (- WW1 reason for including it here!). I'm >sure >the Canadian members of the list at least will enjoy it if they >haven't >seen it before. ROTFL!!!! Matt Bittner _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 18:05:45 -0500 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits Message-ID: <19980827.181141.-202187.0.mbittner@juno.com> On Thu, 27 Aug 1998 17:41:35 -0400 Suvoroff@aol.com writes: >Some of the aircraft you want to model are available, for example the >Albatros >D.II is out from Pegasus. Unfortunately, many of the Revell kits are >out of >production and have been so for some time, so they might be hard to >get, like >the Sopwith Triplane. And as for Nieuport 17's, don't even hope, Matt >Bittner >owns all the remaining unbuilt kits. ROTFL!!! Actually, I think Riordan and others have a couple. So...anybody willing to trade? ;-) Matt Bittner _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 18:10:46 -0500 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits Message-ID: <19980827.181141.-202187.1.mbittner@juno.com> Let's see... BE2c - vac? Meikraft? FE2b - vac? Merlin? Albatros D.II - Classic Plane vac; Pegasus Halberstadt D.II - vac? outrageously (sp?) priced Skybirds 86? Sopwith Dolphin - Pegasus? announced Toko Revell's: Nieuport 17 - bwahahahahahaha Albatros D.III - buy the Pegasus or Xtravac Sopwith Triplane - good luck Fokker D.VII - still easily found Fokker Dr.I - buy the Hawkeye resin Morane Saulnier Type N - buy the readily available Temeks Type I kit and convert SPAD 13 - if you must, or try to find the Meikraft kit DeHavilland DH.2 - good luck Matt Bittner _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 09:22:53 +1100 From: Jeff Wilson To: wwi Subject: Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits Message-ID: >Sopwith Dolphin - Pegasus? announced Toko Matt, are you sure? I know Toko have the Salamander coming, first I've heard of the Dolphin... Jeff Jeffrey Spencer Wilson Photography Unit RSBS Australian National University Acton Canberra ACT 0200 Australia Phone (02) 6249 3635 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 10:49:10 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: wwi Subject: RE: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits Message-ID: <199808280106.LAA23861@mimmon.mim.com.au> Matt, ever the optomist, >Actually, I think Riordan and others have a couple. So...anybody willing >to trade? ;-) What, you want *more* ? Let the poor guy have at least *one*. > > >Revell's: >Sopwith Triplane - good luck I must have cornered the market in these things. I have at least three (and I want two of them) so if Patrick cares to contact me off list we may be able to arrange something Shane ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 20:01:58 -0500 From: Kenneth Hagerup To: wwi Subject: Re: Nieuport 28 Message-ID: <35E60186.385@prodigy.net> Charles Duckworth wrote: > > Ken got your check today, have the N.28 in a box and will mail out tomorrow > at noon - Charlie Charlie, Got the Nie.28 today--thanks! Ken ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 20:01:09 -0500 From: Kenneth Hagerup To: wwi Subject: Italian Nieuport 11 Message-ID: <35E60155.744E@prodigy.net> The first Toko Nie.11 I'd like to build is the dark green with lightning bolt, No. Ni 1630, Sezione da Difesa, Stazione Dirigiblili di Grottaglie, covered on the Blue Rider sheet. A couple of questions: Did this aircraft have the light-outlined control surfaces? Any guesses for match for the dark green? It appears to be a different color than the national insignia green. Any photos known to exist? Thanks, Ken ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 18:44:05 -0700 From: Mike Fletcher To: wwi Subject: Re: Italian Nieuport 11 Message-ID: <35E60B65.3657DBB9@mars.ark.com> If anyone knows of any I'd love to see a copy Mike Fletcher (who grabbed a few Revell N.17s and more than a few Esci N.17s) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 21:45:08 EDT From: Zulis@aol.com To: wwi Subject: A small mystery. Message-ID: <8dd1e745.35e60ba4@aol.com>> Greetings! I came across this curious auction on ebay today: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=27485639 It is a very ordinary-looking head and shoulders shot of an American flier. The seller says he has no idea of the subject's identity... but the bidding shot to $27 instantly. I am not a collector of photos, but I thought this mystery might appeal to some of the list members. There has to be something special about this pic or guy. Any ideas? Very curious, Dave Zulis ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 12:16:35 +1000 (EST) From: Mick Fauchon To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Pfalz D.III radiator colour Message-ID: Tom, > I may be a bit blind (that's why I'm doing 1/48 at the moment) That's not a good reason! 80) but I can't > figure out the colour of the upper wing radiator of the Pfalz D.III. In the > colour plate that's included in the kit it looks a pale pink/beige, pretty > much the colour of the rubber of the tyres. What colour was this fitting > actually? Pink/beige seems a pretty bizarre colour to pick. Which kit is it? I'd definitely go for the same colour as the underside of the radiator, i.e. aluminium, especially for a/c painted in that colour. There is also a possibility that on the few camouflaged examples, the radiator [topside] may have been overpainted in the appropriate camo colour. Did it have the same colour on the underside of the wing? The > sliding regulator is supposed to be "aluminium". The short answer is "yes".......so is the long answer 80) Cheers, Mick. -- -- Mick Fauchon | Internet: ulmjf@dewey.newcastle.edu.au Reference Section, Auchmuty Library | Ph (intl+61+49) 215861 University of Newcastle, AUSTRALIA | Fax (intl+61+49) 215833 MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM M M M Tasmanian Devil: "#@%!&^*%%...!#@!&**%^@@#$#-+*+*&##@...!!" M M M M Yosemite Sam : "Cut out that Army talk!..Yer in the Navy now!" M M M MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 22:34:35 EDT From: MACFARB@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Re: A small mystery. Message-ID: > My guess: The picture in question does have a clear image of the man's aviator wings.There is always more interest in period photos of subjects where insignia can clearly be seen . ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 20:42:04 -0700 (PDT) From: bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: Victory claims - was Load of old Tosh Message-ID: <199808280342.UAA28122@ednet1.orednet.org> Jim writes: >At one point, when I obviously had too little to do with my time, I sat down >with the various Over/Above/ the Front/Trench/Line aces books and counted up >the number of Allied (and just of aces, remember) claims of Fokker Dr.I's. I >picked the Dr.I for two reasons - it is relatively easy to pick out in the >text listings, and it was the only significant German triplane so there >shouldn't have been too many cases of pilot mis-identification. According to >the claims, almost every Dr.I ever produced was shot down. Either (a) there >was significant overclaiming, or (b) we now have an explanation why there >aren't any surviving examples (I lean toward (a) myself...) Indeed. While I've not been as diligent as you in counting up "official" British triplane "victories", I did note, at one time, that there were at least six "official" British triplane victories awarded during September of 1917. This is, of course, three times as many "official" victories as actual triplane losses and, indeed, three times as many "official" victories as there were Fokker tripes in existence on the front in September, '17. Cheers and all, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org "Everything would have been calm in Franche Comte if ten lawyers had been hanged." ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 14:23:45 +0000 From: "David R.L. Laws" To: wwi Subject: Re: SPAD THINGIES Message-ID: <35E6BD72.513F@webtime.com.au> HI ALL, With Shon-gate over Iv'e return to the Spad XIII project and was wondering if anyone knows if there are decals of Frank Luke's machine about in 1/48 Failing that can one get ( I think it's ) the " Screaming Eagle " motif/ emblem ( hopefully with the b&w checkerboard chevrons per the Windsock data file front cover [revised edition ] depiction ) of the USAS 27th fighter group in a 1/48 decal ? Also interested in any generic Spad Fighter 1/48 decals ( I already have the Aeromaster sheet BTW ) with French Italian and/ or USAS unit emblems and/ or individual a/c markings DAVID ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 14:29:25 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: wwi Subject: RE: SPAD THINGIES Message-ID: <199808280445.OAA25093@mimmon.mim.com.au> David, >Failing that can one get ( I think it's ) the " Screaming Eagle " >motif/ emblem ( hopefully with the b&w checkerboard chevrons per the >Windsock data file front cover [revised edition ] depiction ) of the >USAS 27th fighter group in a 1/48 decal ? i have the PD Decals set with this machine on it, but the checkerboard is interpreted wrongly and needs replacing. >Also interested in any generic Spad Fighter 1/48 decals ( I already have >the Aeromaster sheet BTW ) with French Italian and/ or USAS unit >emblems and/ or individual a/c markings Also have a partial Aeromaster sheet, and some other subjects on Blue Rider sheets. I'll talk to you on the phone, and maybe you can cast an optic over them at poste restante Shane ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 27 Aug 1998 23:48:02 -0500 From: Dave Watts To: Subject: eBay item Message-ID: <199808280450.XAA04272@sam.on-net.net> Flugsport. 1916. Over six hundred pages and profusley illustrated with photos and drawings. Solid very good bright and clean condition. Buyer pays $4.00 postage. Insurance included. All forms of payment accepted except cash. Saw this on eBay. Last week they had Flugsport 1918, I bid up to $365.00, and had to leave town on business before the auction was over, and was outbid by one bid. I hope someone on the list got it. I'm still bummed. The bid is up to $125. on this one. Go to it, I'm not going to bid on this one. These are great pubs., similar to England's Flight magazine, or Janes' All the World's Aircraft. Very, very rare. Good luck! Best Wishes, Dave W. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 00:11:04 -0500 From: Dave Watts To: Subject: eBay Message-ID: <199808280513.AAA04830@sam.on-net.net> I just spotted FLUGSPORT 1915 on eBay, no bid presently. I hope this guy didn't rob a library! Best Wishes, Dave W. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 00:31:14 -0500 From: Dave Watts To: Subject: eBay Message-ID: <199808280533.AAA05224@sam.on-net.net> item Nr.27093225 WWI German Avaition Book 1914 I think you can guess, yes, it's FLUGSPORT 1914. You should check this out, on his auction page he has a photo of the book open to two excellent side views of a Argus flug motor. I'm just waiting to for the other shoe to drop, now that last week I saw 1918 sell, and now I've found 1914, 1915, and 1916 listed for auction,........where is 1917? Give me a little more time. I still can't believe these coming up for sale, they are so damned rare. I only saw these offered once before in Germany about 4 years ago, and they were big bucks, (well, big D Marks). Best Wishes, Dave W. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 16:27:31 +1100 From: Jeff Wilson To: wwi Subject: Flashback W.29 final report... Message-ID: Greetings everyone, well the fruits of my labours can be witnessed at: http://biology.anu.edu.au/central-services/Photo/Drome/The'drome.html The website is under construction, so a few links won't work, but all the photos do. The last couple of weeks finishing this off have been fairly painless, so I have little to add to my previous two-part review. In typical Propagteam style, the decals stick like baby poo to the proverbial blanket. I got the first wing cross on too far back from the leading edge (and it's way too fat, surely?) and there it stays. It refused to move without tearing, so I settled for leaving it where it was. Use lots of water for these, use pools of it and you can slide the decals around for a few seconds to position them. I'll know next time. I used hypodermic needles for the engine exhausts and monofilament for the control surface actuation cables, but aside from that it's all out of the box. Comments on colour accuracy, decals, lozenge etc, are all welcome. I'll be building the Toko W.29 when it's released and I'd like to have a more accurate replica than the Flashback, so say your worst... Have a fine weekend all, I'll read all replies on Monday. Best regards, Jeff Jeffrey Spencer Wilson Photography Unit RSBS Australian National University Acton Canberra ACT 0200 Australia Phone (02) 6249 3635 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 17:44:14 +0000 From: "David R.L. Laws" To: wwi Subject: Re: SPAD THINGIES Message-ID: <35E6EC6E.30A3@webtime.com.au> SHANE THANKs would love to have a squizzy ! DAVID ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 04:25:17 EDT From: TPTPUMPER@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Pfalz D.III radiator colour Message-ID: <38d1de17.35e6696d@aol.com>> HI Tom! FWIW, I'm working on the Marco's 1/24 kit of the D.III. I'm doing the wings as silbergrau and the radiator will be aluminum with a thin wash of black for relief. From what I've seen, the "stock" wing radiator color on Pfalz and Albatros was aluminum. As they say, HTH! Have Fun!! IRA ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 09:57:25 -0700 From: "Sandy Adam" To: Subject: Re: Victory claims - was Load of old Tosh Message-ID: <199808280856.JAA22225@beryl.sol.co.uk> ........... This is, of course, three times as many "official" > victories as actual triplane losses ..... Rather than taking up the usual old rigid position, why not think about it for a moment? What is an "actual triplane loss"? Was the Albatros D.V that Reichspudding was flying on 6 July 1917 an "actual Albatros loss"? He sure as hell was shot down in it - and had the roles been reversed, he would have been a POW and the plane allocated a G number. But because it took place behind German lines it was recovered. Now I don't know the history of that particular plane after 6/7/17 but I think you can see the point. There must have been ooc claims which were recorded by the British as kills, but the planes were not recorded by the Germans as losses because they landed intact and flew again after minor repair. I am not trying to claim that every ooc or "driven down" was a legitimate aerial victory - how could they be? But will you please stop telling us that just because the German records state one thing, then that has to be right. As always these things are open to interpretation. Sandy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 05:21:51 -0500 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Hello and looking for 1/72nd kits Message-ID: <19980828.052304.-258151.3.mbittner@juno.com> On Thu, 27 Aug 1998 19:22:45 -0400 Jeff Wilson writes: >are you sure? I know Toko have the Salamander coming, first I've heard >of >the Dolphin... You may be right. I get so confused with those Sopwith machines...:-) Matt Bittner _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 05:18:08 -0500 From: mbittner@juno.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Italian Nieuport 11 Message-ID: <19980828.052303.-258151.1.mbittner@juno.com> On Thu, 27 Aug 1998 21:14:33 -0400 Kenneth Hagerup writes: >The first Toko Nie.11 I'd like to build is the dark green with >lightning >bolt, No. Ni 1630, Sezione da Difesa, Stazione Dirigiblili di >Grottaglie, covered on the Blue Rider sheet. A couple of questions: > >Did this aircraft have the light-outlined control surfaces? > >Any guesses for match for the dark green? It appears to be a >different >color than the national insignia green. > >Any photos known to exist? There is a color plate in the Italian Intergest Monografie Aeree book on the Nie.11/17. The color plate does *not* show outlined control surfaces, but does show an outlined fuselage. According to Alberto Casirati in Windsock, Vol 5 No 3, the Italian Nie.11/16's had two basic schemes: aluminum (which I am believing more to be CDL) and khaki. According to him: "The khaki colour was applied to all upper surfaces. The shade of the colour is probably close to Humbrol HB12 'Mid Stone', for from the photograph heading this feature (one of the best of its kind, sharp and taken in diffuse lighting conditions) the colour of pilot's uniform, which was khaki, is quite close to the shade of the aeroplane's fuselage. "Under srfaces were clear-doped, and it must be remembered that Italian clear protective varnish gave the linen areas to which it was applied a light brown colour." Matt Bittner _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 1182 **********************