WWI Digest 1141 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) by Shane Weier 2) RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) by Bob Pearson 3) Re: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) by KarrArt@aol.com 4) Re: Nieuport-Delage 29 by Eric Hotz 5) RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) by Shane Weier 6) RPM FT 17 - A closer look by "Leonard Endy" 7) RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) by Bob Pearson 8) THE MAIN CULPRIT SPEAKS!!! by Joey Valenciano 9) Jasta 5 scans, different view by "Steven M. Perry" 10) Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look by Ernest Thomas 11) Re: Jasta 5 scans, different view by Ernest Thomas 12) Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look by "Leonard Endy" 13) Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look by Suvoroff@aol.com 14) Revell DH2 (was: Thanks for your opinions) by martinsc@pipemedia.co.uk (Martin Soilleux-Cardwell) 15) Fokker DR1 by Pedro e Francisca Soares 16) Re: Fokker DR1 by Ernest Thomas 17) Re: Revell DH2 (was: Thanks for your opinions) by "Jeff Curtis" 18) Re: Thanks for your opinions by "Jeff Curtis" 19) Writing a check to Americal today by "Fernando E. Lamas, M.D." 20) Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look by Joey Valenciano 21) Re: Jasta 5 scans, different view by Joey Valenciano 22) Latvian LVG C.VI by "Jeff Curtis" 23) Clear doped linen by "Jeff Curtis" 24) Rigging the Dh-2 by Ernest Thomas 25) RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) by Alberto Rada 26) Re: Jasta 5 scans, different view by Mike Dicianna ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 16:33:08 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: wwi Subject: RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) Message-ID: <199808020648.QAA21459@mimmon.mim.com.au> Hello all, At the risk of being flamed yet again , and of being even further thought a spoilsport and whinger, can I ask if anyone other than me is the least bit uncomfortable about the orgy of Jasta 5 goodies being shipped hither and yon at the moment? Before the fairly recent proliferation of scanners this list was already a wonderful source of research material. One need just ask, and someone, somewhere, would snail mail a xerox of a relevant photo, drawing or chunk of text. This is legal of course, being "fair usage for the purpose of research" Now one need only post a "me too" to receive the entire contents of a copyright work, gratis. This on the other hand is illegal, and worse than that, immoral. My Jasta 5 decals cost me US$25, and I've never used one of them. But they're worth every cent to me for the diligence and accuracy of Glen Merrills research, and the concise summary the booklet provides. But thanks to the 20+ "me too" messages that hit the list in the last few days, and perhaps another few who took their response off line, I figure that Americal may have lost a potential $500 in revenue. Glen is not making a fortune from this - merely paying his costs so that he can continue researching and publishing yet more of this stuff. His audience, the community of WW1 modellers, is small and what we are doing is little better than theft from one of our own. If you think that's too strong ask Bob Pearson (generous to a fault with his own work) whether he'd like us to randomly publish his work, or Barry Stettler (likewise a helpful and generous member of the list) whether he'd like some of Rosemonts resin kits copied and handed about the list for free. There's a very nice conversion kit recently released that might make a cheaper bootleg edition too - if Eric doesn't mind. I should point out that even though I have his email address, and have often corresponded with him, I have not spoken with Glen Merrill about this. What worries me is - has anyone else? I have not posted this lightly, nor without agonising over it for several days. However, as much as I love this forum, and have enjoyed the good humour and generosity of the denizens, I believe an unthinking selfishness is creeping into the list. Please, please, try to be aware of the rights of others, even if simple "convenience" issues like endless *me too* messages fail to stir you. Shane ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 00:34:46 -0700 From: Bob Pearson To: WW1 Mailing list Subject: RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) Message-ID: <07344642914902@KAIEN.COM> Shane quite succinctly writes . . > At the risk of being flamed yet again , and of being even further > thought a spoilsport and whinger, can I ask if anyone other than me is > the least bit uncomfortable about the orgy of Jasta 5 goodies being > shipped hither and yon at the moment? > > Before the fairly recent proliferation of scanners this list was already > a wonderful source of research material. One need just ask, and someone, > somewhere, would snail mail a xerox of a relevant photo, drawing or > chunk of text. This is legal of course, being "fair usage for the > purpose of research" > > Now one need only post a "me too" to receive the entire contents of a > copyright work, gratis. This on the other hand is illegal, and worse > than that, immoral. > I have not posted this lightly, nor without agonising over it for > several days. However, as much as I love this forum, and have enjoyed > the good humour and generosity of the denizens, I believe an unthinking > selfishness is creeping into the list. Please, please, try to be > aware of the rights of others, even if simple "convenience" issues like > endless *me too* messages fail to stir you. Shane raises a good point here. I would suggest that we try to limit future massive posts of scanned publications to items that are either out of print or *very* hard to find (ie Methuen handbook). Things like Windsock et al that are still available should not be made available online as this may ultimately result in no further releases. Having said that I will admit to being one of the guilty in regards to accepting the Js5 post. Regards, Bob Pearson ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 03:43:16 EDT From: KarrArt@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) Message-ID: <7b9e0641.35c41895@aol.com> In a message dated 98-08-02 02:34:43 EDT, you write: << At the risk of being flamed yet again , and of being even further thought a spoilsport and whinger, can I ask if anyone other than me is the least bit uncomfortable about the orgy of Jasta 5 goodies being shipped hither and yon at the moment?>> Depends on the source <> Perhaps I should've read the offer of Jasta 5 scans more carefully- I somehow got it into my head that these were from an ancient magazine article long ago. IF they came from the Glen Merrill decal set- I agree with you wholeheartedly.So far I've given them a quick look-see just to check how they arrived, without paying alot of attention to the details of the drawings. I'm not all that bothered by things like 30 year old magazine pieces or photos that have shown up in many different publications with differing credits over the years. The lineup pics of Jasta 5 came from long out of print C&Cs from the 60s and 70s- not readily available. Another case is the Albatros pubs- I've quit copying and sending anything from Rimell's line simply because it isn't right. It really is taking the bread and butter out of his mouth. Robert K. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 00:50:16 -0800 From: Eric Hotz To: wwi Subject: Re: Nieuport-Delage 29 Message-ID: I have been searching for this aircraft (the Nieuport-Delage 29) for quite a while, but have never seen it listed anywhere. I have the plans for it in 1/72nd scale, so I guess I will have to scratch build it. It does seem odd to me that no one has yet to make this aircraft, in any form, as it was supoosed to be a very good aircraft for its time. Does anyone know anything about late WWI colors for French aircraft? Is the all green Nieuport-Delage 29 a post war color scheme or a new scheme that was introduced too late in the war? Eric Hotz (erichotz@direct.ca) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 20:05:52 +1000 From: Shane Weier To: wwi Subject: RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) Message-ID: <199808021021.UAA22006@mimmon.mim.com.au> Robert, >- I somehow >got it into my head that these were from an ancient magazine article long ago. If this *is* the case, and the material is the Peter L Gray material from Scale Models, I have done everyone an injustice in this instant, but the principle remains. > I'm not all that bothered by things like 30 year old magazine pieces or >photos that have shown up in many different publications with differing >.credits over the years. The lineup pics of Jasta 5 came from long out of print >C&Cs from the 60s and 70s- not readily available. Neither am I, mostly because this is usually a matter of copying a page, or few pages, from a larger work, which is technically legal as research, and morally defensible as well. >Another case is the Albatros pubs- I've quit copying and sending anything from >Rimell's line simply because it isn't right. It really is taking the bread and >butter out of his mouth. And this is where my great fear lies. I'm still not too perturbed at copying a couple of pages from a Datafile because once again it's almost certainly legal as long as the pupose is research - to make a model for ones own collection. But to use it to produce another item, say a kit, for sale, or wholesale copying of in print items is just plain wrong. Your words " taking the bread and butter out of his mouth." may not literally be true in an industry where very few could make a living from their modelling/publishing efforts alone, but it may make continuation by part time manufacturers impossible, and push hard pressed minor publishers like Albatros across the line to insolvency. Shane > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 10:09:37 GMT From: "Leonard Endy" To: wwi Subject: RPM FT 17 - A closer look Message-ID: <35c42f68.1975167@legend.firstsaga.com> Okay, my eyes must have been tricked by the plastic bags the parts were packaged in because after opening them I could not find any flash anywhere. The moldings for this kit are absolutely beautiful. Instructions: In Polish w/exploded views of the assembly steps. Should be easy enough to follow. Exterior paint colors are not by name just color numbers for humbrol paints, H-13 etc. Markings for American and French tanks 1918; Polish tanks 1920; Finland 1921; Spanish Republican Army 1937; French, Morocco 1942; French 1940; and German 1944. The kit has easily 150 + parts, I wasn't going to count them and the number is not mentioned in the instructions, that I could see. Tracks are the one piece vinyl type normally found in armor kits. RPM has a set of injection molded tracks for the FT 17 and a sprue containing eight sections is included w/o any instructions. Sort of a subliminal message. The individually molded links are beautifully molded. Each section is comprised of the track shoe, two connector links, and a pin. If you are interested in super detailing, and have the necessary patience, they are exquisite. The running gear is delicately molded and looks like it may be somewhat fragile when completed. Bending the vinyl tracks around the assemblies to fit could be complicated by this. The driver's compartment has a floor w/tread plate molded in and the seat, pedals, and steering levers are seperate items. The driver's door can be assembled open or closed. The turret, as mentioned in an earlier post, has no rivet detail but the rivets are included for the versions that need them. I agree with who ever commented (Charlie ?) that it would have been better to mold the turret w/the rivets. It would be a lot easier removing them instead of having to add them. This is the French built version and has the round turret as opposed to the American verison that was octagonal in shape. However the Americans used the French built version. The turret door looks like it could be built open but there is no detail inside the turret except for the gun breech. The trenching apparatus attached on the rear of the tank is also extremely well detailed. The kit comes with pioneer tools, a bucket, external storage bin, and some individual-link chain. The links are slightly open on one end and you just push them together. After adding them to the model and painting and weathering you probably wouldn't notice the openings. Although I could not find the copy of the FT 17 plans I have, I still think the rivets are molded slightly undersized when comparing the kit parts to photos of the real thing. IMHO I think that this has got to be one of the best tank models ever produced barring any dimensional errors that may exist. Rosemont probably has the track link set for sale, although I haven't checked, and I have no idea what they cost. The box art shows both of the 1920 Polish versions. They are painted in three color camo. The colors, green, red-brown, and tan look very bright. Toned down some they would probably be close to the WWII German tank colors. If you are a fan of WWI armor I wouldn't miss this one. Now, anyone know where I can find a color illustration of an FT 17 ? Len ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 03:37:10 -0700 From: Bob Pearson To: WW1 Mailing list Subject: RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) Message-ID: <10371066615002@KAIEN.COM> Shane writes in answer to Robert . . > >Another case is the Albatros pubs- I've quit copying and sending > anything from > >Rimell's line simply because it isn't right. It really is taking the > bread and > >butter out of his mouth. > > And this is where my great fear lies. I'm still not too perturbed at > copying a couple of pages from a Datafile because once again it's almost > certainly legal as long as the pupose is research - to make a model for > ones own collection. But to use it to produce another item, say a kit, > for sale, or wholesale copying of in print items is just plain wrong. This is exactly what I was worried about when I first started doing profiles for sale. So I wrote to Ray Rimell and asked permission to use his GAs in my work. His reply was he has no problem with people using his GA drawings as the BASIS of ORIGINAL artwork or kits, what he objects to is people (or companies) copying his profiles or drawings as they appear in Albatros publications. To this end he has succesfully prosecuted at least one European company doing so (he didn't say which one though). Regards, Bob Pearson ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 18:59:00 +0800 From: Joey Valenciano To: wwi Subject: THE MAIN CULPRIT SPEAKS!!! Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980802185900.006d25bc@philonline.com.ph> THE MAIN CULPRIT SPEAKS!! (I hope that opening lines gets you all to read this) Arrrgh! I was planning to type up an email on this very topic but had to go out with the family. Now that I'm back, I see that some talk has been going on about this very subject. I'd like to share a few things I have on my mind just now. 1) I originally reformatted the J5 info for my own use alone. The text was very small and some of it was printed on the coloured covers (very hard to read). I felt the new html format was a very convenient way to access the info w/o wearing out the instruction booklets. 2) I offered to share the reformatted stuff because I felt that it was good info, not really thinking that I'd be taking business away from Americal. How many of us would object to sending out scans of coloured profiles from the Tamiya kits? Obviously, we shell out cash for the kits, not the coloured profiles. Americal is basically in the decal business but as you can see the instruction booklets are far more than just Tamiya color profiles. How do we deal with this then? 3) I'm the last one who'd want to hurt an on topic small scale manufacturer. Some of my previous posts have shown this to be true. 4) I will be requesting Chris B-R (emailing him direct) not to put the files up on his site. Doing so would make the info accessible even to non-listees. 5) I'd have hoped that all who'd request the set would have sent me a "me too" off-list. It would have been a prudent way of requesting the literature. Others have offered scans of articles in the past and I have always requested for a copy off-list, which to me signifies the private exchange of such material between friends (it also hides the fact that I'm such a glutton for the stuff). I'm sure that many or all of us do exchange such info among ourselves. Conducting these transactions off-list is the right way to go. 6) Aha! Shane has Glen Merril's email address! I'd like to know what he has to say. Will he say, "Good, now more know about my products and will buy the decals to make Aircraft# 5.", or will it be, "What?! I actually view the instructions as half the value of the product (or more weirdly, the decals are a come on for you to buy the instructions)." If I knew he could be emailed, I would have consulted him first. Take note that when I offered the J5 set initially, I asked if anyone knew legality (not that I don't want to go to court but I don't want to hurt A/G's business). 7) About thought #6, if Glen's reaction is along the lines of the latter quote, then he really should go into the book business. How many, on-off-list guys would want to see his data formatted ala the old Aircam series? Some text, some photos, a lot of profiles, and he could include his decals as well. I would! Oh yeah, Glencoe's doing that with the Spad but all they did was more or less to reprint the old Aircam book. Those of you who know the caliber of Americal's research will know that it is cutting edge, except where Rodney G. is sourced :-( (well that can be remedied). As for those who have missing files and those who requested too late, what do we do? Probable solution: Go fishing for one of the on-list "me too" guys to slip you the files. Please conduct this sort of thing OFF-LIST as should be done. BTW, those who already have the J5 originals, I'd like you to know that the J5 set I sent out consists of 2 booklets, the J5 booklet and an update booklet. It also contained 5 photos NOT in the booklets that I included because they were relevant. So if you already have the booklets, maybe you don't need the html files, unless, like me, you like the convenience of viewing them on screen.... To continue, I'm STILL interested in borrowing A/G instrcution booklets to turn into html files. Anybody who'd like to share, please let me know off list. ********************************************************************* Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician, joeyval@philonline.com. sitarist Metro-Manila, Philippines "The more you know, the more you don't know." ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 07:12:50 -0400 From: "Steven M. Perry" To: wwi Subject: Jasta 5 scans, different view Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980802071250.006b40b0@pop.mindspring.com> The points about copyrights are in general quite valid, but in the case of the Americal/Gryphon scans which went around recently, I think the list probably did Americal more good than harm. For those who have heard of them but not yet made an order, this is far more likely to generate orders than not. Additionally many of us are regular customers and already own paid for literature sheets from many of the A/G decal sheets. At any rate, for those who have been meaning to write A/G for a catalog, I encourage you to do so and will aid in that endeavor by including their address with my hearty recommendation that you support this fine company. Your models will look the better for it. Americal/Gryphon 4373 Varsity Lane Houston, Tx 77004-6617 USA Diving for friendly lines sp ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 06:49:58 -0500 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi Subject: Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look Message-ID: <35C45266.72CC@bellsouth.net> Leonard Endy wrote: > IMHO I think that this has got to be one of the best tank models ever > produced barring any dimensional errors that may exist. you're gonna force me to go out and buy this kit, aren't you? > Now, anyone know where I can find a color illustration of an FT 17 ? my offer still stands... E. > > Len ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 07:03:03 -0500 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi Subject: Re: Jasta 5 scans, different view Message-ID: <35C45577.47FC@bellsouth.net> Steven M. Perry wrote: but in the case of > the Americal/Gryphon scans which went around recently, I think the list > probably did Americal more good than harm. Thanks. My feelings exactly. My complaint with A/G is that one is forced to order sight unseen. If Mr Merrill would set up a site where one could go and have a sqiz, (like Aeromaster), I think his sales would increase. Just because J.V. send me those scans doesn't mean I'm gonna bootleg a set of decals(i only bootleg stuff from big publishers). Now that I've seen these images, I'm more interested in ordering those decals. 2 sheckels worth... E. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 12:17:20 GMT From: "Leonard Endy" To: wwi Subject: Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look Message-ID: <35c657c4.12308500@legend.firstsaga.com> On Sun, 2 Aug 1998 07:55:08 -0400, you wrote: >you're gonna force me to go out and buy this kit, aren't you? You'll be a happy camper... >> Now, anyone know where I can find a color illustration of an FT 17 ? > >my offer still stands... Is the one in the museum in a camo pattern ? If it is, then I'll take you up on your offer. If it isn't I'll still take you up on your offer. You'll probably get pictures anyway seeing as how it appears you are going to pick-up this kit at some point. TIA Len ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 08:30:32 EDT From: Suvoroff@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look Message-ID: <973e60e0.35c45be9@aol.com> Quoth Mr. Endy; "Now, anyone know where I can find a color illustration of an FT 17 ?" If you can find it (I think it is out of print) there is the Osprey-Vanguard #46, _The Renault FT Light Tank_ by Steven J. Zaloga. This contains 16 colour views, not counting personnel or scrap views. I did the Matchbox 1/76th kit some time ago, and the French playing card symbols look really neat. If you can't find this book, I could send xerox copies of the appropriate illustrations. Yours, James D. Gray ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 14:36:10 +0100 From: martinsc@pipemedia.co.uk (Martin Soilleux-Cardwell) To: wwi Subject: Revell DH2 (was: Thanks for your opinions) Message-ID: <19980802143610.e38ea3f929b411d2b577004f4b00cee4.in@mailrelay.pipemedia.net> >Since you're all so darn helpful, here are a few kits I've snagged over >time. Are any of them suitable for first efforts at a WW I biplane? > > Revell DeHavilland D.H. 2 - Another older kit, but I wouldn't mind giving >this one a try. > This makes up to a very nice model, and a little different. The mouldings and detail on all the four I built were sharp and clear. You can play about and reposition the gravity fuel tank for variation too. It's quite a rare kit now, especially in Britain and I have seen unbuilt boxed copies going for ten pounds sterling. I have full details on 24 Sqn markings early 1916 if you are interested. Martin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 15:09:48 +0200 From: Pedro e Francisca Soares To: "WW1 Modeling List (E-mail)" Subject: Fokker DR1 Message-ID: <01BDBE28.48FDBE00@fei1-p7.telepac.pt> Guys, I've just finished my cockpit bits and pieces for the Revell DR1 but I'd = appreciate if someone would tell me if aside from the cockpit floor = there were also foot rails leading to the rudder bar. I can't find = evidence of this in the drawings I've consulted but since they were = present in the DVIII kit I did, I wonder if the DR1 had them too. Thanks And now for something off topic:=20 Lisbon is really full of interesting things to see thanks to EXPO '98: = Today I went to the harbour to visit several tall ships that are = participating in the Cutty Sark race and those of you who like ships = would certainly have a field day: several dozen tall ships including = such formidable boats as The Mir, the Kreuzenstern, the Americo = Vespucio, our own Sagres, the Gloria, the Alexander Von Humboldt, the = Dar Miodziezy, and many others... so much wood, brass, ropes and = linen.... had a great time. And on top of that, yesterday had the = immense pleasure of going to a Van Morrison concert at the Expo site... = and I can tell you Van is still The Man. (No threads on-list after this = please, I just thought I'd let you know to make your mouths water like = hell ;-). Um abraco Pedro ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 09:24:42 -0500 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi Subject: Re: Fokker DR1 Message-ID: <35C476AA.1740@bellsouth.net> Pedro e Francisca Soares wrote: > I wonder if the DR1 had them too. Yep. E. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 09:36:23 -0500 From: "Jeff Curtis" To: Subject: Re: Revell DH2 (was: Thanks for your opinions) Message-ID: <199808021433.JAA26382@indy1.indy.net> Thanks Martin. I would be most interested in the DH2 documentation you have. I didn't realize this kit had become such a collector's item, but I'll probably build it anyway, especially since I had a bagged version with no box. I also have to give Revell of Germany some credit, the decals are still in perfect condition after all these years. Jeff ---------- > From: Martin Soilleux-Cardwell > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Revell DH2 (was: Thanks for your opinions) > Date: Sunday, August 02, 1998 8:33 AM > > >Since you're all so darn helpful, here are a few kits I've snagged over > >time. Are any of them suitable for first efforts at a WW I biplane? > > > > Revell DeHavilland D.H. 2 - Another older kit, but I wouldn't mind giving > >this one a try. > > > This makes up to a very nice model, and a little different. The mouldings > and detail on all the four I built were sharp and clear. You can play about > and reposition the gravity fuel tank for variation too. It's quite a rare > kit now, especially in Britain and I have seen unbuilt boxed copies going > for ten pounds sterling. I have full details on 24 Sqn markings early 1916 > if you are interested. > > Martin ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 09:45:18 -0500 From: "Jeff Curtis" To: Subject: Re: Thanks for your opinions Message-ID: <199808021437.JAA26545@indy1.indy.net> Ha! Rigging is certainly the most intimidating part about getting into WW 1 modeling, and I've pulled out the DH 2. You're right, there's a ton of it to do. Jeff > > Revell DeHavilland D.H. 2 > > This is a great one to do your first rigging job on. After the 50+pieces > of rigging, it's all down hill from there./%] > > Other than that, I would go spend 4 or 5 bucks on the Testors N.17 and > build that as a 'study' before I started on the Eduard kit. > > Welcome to the list. > > Ernest > heretic & all around troublemaker ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 08:01:58 -0700 From: "Fernando E. Lamas, M.D." To: wwi Subject: Writing a check to Americal today Message-ID: > >My Jasta 5 decals cost me US$25, and I've never used one of them. But >they're worth every cent to me for the diligence and accuracy of Glen >Merrills research, and the concise summary the booklet provides. But >thanks to the 20+ "me too" messages that hit the list in the last few >days, and perhaps another few who took their response off line, I figure >that Americal may have lost a potential $500 in revenue. > >Shane > I disagree on this, Shane. The way I look at it, those scans were the advertisement that Americal should be putting out to drum up business. Americal may put out a great product but, IMHO, it does a poor job in attracting that all-important first sale. At a time when you can shop with the click of a button at the web pages of Rosemont, Squadron, Roll Models, Hannants, etc. or view the product you get at the Aeromaster web page, Americal has you...gasp...write to them via snail mail to request a catalog. Month after month, I kept saying to myself, "One of these days I'll sit down and write that snail mail request to Americal". In the mean time, I spent my hobby money on opportunities that popped up on my computer screen or in my mailbox from aggressive advertisers such as Squadron and bought two of the Aeromaster sheets that were illustrated with color profiles on the Aeromaster web page. After receiving the Americal catalog and browsing through it, I kept telling myself, "One of these days I'm actually going to order something." The catalog has sat around for weeks. I can't recall reading anywhere that the decal sheets came with a research booklet. After the Jasta 5 scans showed me what you get with Americal, the inertia has been broken. Today I will sit down with the Americal catalog, make my choices and write out a check. Fernando Lamas ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 23:28:29 +0800 From: Joey Valenciano To: wwi Subject: Re: RPM FT 17 - A closer look Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980802232829.00727058@philonline.com.ph> >The turret, as mentioned in an earlier post, >has no rivet detail but the rivets are included for the versions that >need them. Probably a limitation of the moulding process? ********************************************************************* Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician, joeyval@philonline.com. sitarist Metro-Manila, Philippines "The more you know, the more you don't know." ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 22:54:33 +0800 From: Joey Valenciano To: wwi Subject: Re: Jasta 5 scans, different view Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19980802225433.00727058@philonline.com.ph> >If Mr Merrill would set up a site where one could >go and have a sqiz, (like Aeromaster), I think his sales would increase. Thinking along these lines, Blue Rider does (did?) have a website. Why wouldn't they have profiles from their instruction sheets in cyberspace? Cost too much maybe? ********************************************************************* Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician, joeyval@philonline.com. sitarist Metro-Manila, Philippines "The more you know, the more you don't know." ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 10:45:11 -0500 From: "Jeff Curtis" To: "WW1 list" Subject: Latvian LVG C.VI Message-ID: <199808021538.KAA28202@indy3.indy.net> I have a sheet of the Blue Rider Latvian Air Force decals. It includes decals for a Sopwith Camel, a Sopwith 1 1/2 Strutter, and the LVG C.VI. I noticed Sierra and Pegasus kit the LVG C.VI, and I'm contemplating purchasing one, probably the Pegasus. My question, the color specs that come with the Blue Rider decals, just show a diamond pattern on the wings and rudder listed as upper lozenge fabric and lower lozenge fabric. These are not included on the decal sheet. References listed are Aviation News Vol 5 #23 & Vol 7 #11, as well as Windsock Datafile 17. As these lozenge patterns available as decals anywhere, or should I just forget the Latvian version of the LVG C.VI? Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 2 Aug 1998 10:46:00 -0500 From: "Jeff Curtis" To: "WW1 list" Subject: Clear doped linen Message-ID: <199808021538.KAA28205@indy3.indy.net> What's the best paint and color to use to represent clear doped linen? Jeff ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 10:53:13 -0500 From: Ernest Thomas To: wwi Subject: Rigging the Dh-2 Message-ID: <35C48B69.29C8@bellsouth.net> Jeff Curtis wrote: > > Ha! Rigging is certainly the most intimidating part about getting into WW > 1 modeling, and I've pulled out the DH 2. You're right, there's a ton of > it to do. I know it sounds kinda nutty, but I wasn't kidding. That's the model that got me focused on WWI in the first place. I was pondering the task of rigging 1/72 biplanes, and built the DH-2 as a study. I just slapped the model together straight out the box and rigged it with black thread. Didn't even paint it. I haven't been intimidated by ANY rigging job since then. Give it a try. However, paint it first. It's easier than trying to do it afterwards./%] E. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 12:17:49 -0400 From: Alberto Rada To: wwi Subject: RE: Jasta 5 (and copyrights) Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.19980802121749.009d2100@argonaut.net> The point brought out by Shane is absolutely correct, and it should be taken more as a cautionary word before things get out of hand than a point to a specific trend. When you focus on a specific trend, in most cases, no one is 100 percent correct, as in the case of Americal, where Fernando has a very valid point, but this should not weaken the point made by Shane. To produce a Magazine, a Datafile, a Book, a model etc. takes a lot of work, time and money and although its understandable that most of us have not enough money for all the books etc. we would like to have, well hard luck, if we want it we have to pay for it. I don't care it this is a legal issue or not, this is a moral issue and we have to respect it, I don't think the line is difficult to draw, I am sure we all know when you are walking from a bona fide information you need and when it's a matter of saving bucks. Whenever a kit, decal, paint ( actual trend on Promodeler ) we have the right to discuss it , criticize or praise it, and this is one of the very valuable assets of this list, we have wonderful modelers that are willing Guinea Pigs and many times save us tons of money, so we avoid buying trash. Another valuable asset of the list is learning where can we buy it cheaper, so we can get more stuff to fill our closets. But we also have the obligation to help those that keep our hobby rolling, and as we have said endless times, they do it more for the fun than for the money they make. SALUDOS Alberto ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 02 Aug 1998 09:44:58 +0000 From: Mike Dicianna To: wwi Subject: Re: Jasta 5 scans, different view Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19980802094458.006b821c@proaxis.com> At 07:12 AM 8/2/98 -0400, you wrote: >The points about copyrights are in general quite valid, but in the case of >the Americal/Gryphon scans which went around recently, I think the list >probably did Americal more good than harm. For those who have heard of them >but not yet made an order, this is far more likely to generate orders than >not. Additionally many of us are regular customers and already own paid for >literature sheets from many of the A/G decal sheets. > >At any rate, for those who have been meaning to write A/G for a catalog, I >encourage you to do so and will aid in that endeavor by including their >address with my hearty recommendation that you support this fine company. >Your models will look the better for it. > >Americal/Gryphon >4373 Varsity Lane >Houston, Tx 77004-6617 >USA > >Diving for friendly lines >sp > >As the other main culprit in this scandal, I have to again really plead ignorance of the potential "Harm" that may have been done. In my new found zeal of finding reference materials, I have made some very exciting (to me anyway) finds of some useful information to my hobby. The members of the list have been very helpful to me with my research and I consider them all "online friends" not just aquaintences. I guess I am just to eager to share my zeal with these friends. The idea of copywrite problems really had not come to mind. Receiving and sending this type of information and scans only intensifies my drive to PURCHASE AS MANY OF THESE PRODUCTS i.e. Americal/Gryphon, Windsocks as I possibly can!! It is great to have this information on file in my WWI Folder on the computer, but I feel it is only an appitizer (sp) to the main course! I know my credit card company believes this. The Mad Scanner (Retired) Mikedc > > ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 1141 **********************