WWI Digest 79 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Kit sale followup by hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) 2) Latest from Rosemont by "Matt Bittner" 3) Re: Latest from Rosemont by "STEVE HUSTAD" 4) new to WWI by jim lyzun 5) Re: new to WWI by hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) 6) Re: new to WWI by bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) 7) Re: 1/1 Albatros logo by mnelson@compusmart.ab.ca (Mark K. Nelson) 8) Re: new to WWI by bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) 9) Re: new to WWI by "Matt Bittner" 10) Re: new to WWI by "Matt Bittner" 11) Re: new to WWI by Jesse Thorn 12) Re[2]: new to WWI by stonto@seaccc.sccd.ctc.edu 13) Re: new to WWI by "Matt Bittner" 14) Re[2]: new to WWI by stonto@seaccc.sccd.ctc.edu 15) Re: Re[2]: new to WWI by "Matt Bittner" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 13:00:27 -0700 From: hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) To: wwi Subject: Re: Kit sale followup Message-ID: Larry, A suggestion for file formats for those of us asking for different ones. Open your kit list file and then choose the "save as" option under the file heading in the menu bar. There should be options there that will allow you to save the file either as earlier forms of Word or as ASCII file formats. You shouldn't need any other "conversion" software to do this. Another option would be to dump the whole thing into your mail software and send it out as a regular post and each of us can convert is as we like, perhaps not the best option though. Hope this helps, look forward to seeing your list. Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu > Thanks to all of you who responded to my kit sale notice. I'll get >the lists mailed this weekend. (I've had the flu, and am only at work >today because my head customer service person has it too.) Those of >you who need a different document format: it may take a little longer. > I'm not the most sophisticated user. However, I believe I have a >(currently not installed) conversion program that may work for this. >One way or another, I'll respond. > If your server doesn't give headers and you didn't get my e-mail >address from the first post, it is larmin@ix.netcom.com. (That's a >lower case "ell", not a "one".) > Larry Armin, Aurora, CO ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 12:56:00 -0500 From: "Matt Bittner" To: WW1 Modelers Subject: Latest from Rosemont Message-ID: <199603281256.MAA28614@cso.com> For those who care, the next three Mini-Datafiles are due in "at any time". These are: #4 - SPAD A.2 #5 - Morane Saulnier A.1 #6 - Vickers Guns That's the latest scoop, unless you care about 1/72nd Russian Armor... Now a question: I can't remember, but what do those who picked it up think about the Mini-Datafile on the Lewis Guns? Worth it? TIA! Matt -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Matthew Bittner O- WW1 Modeler, ecto subscriber meba@cso.com PowerBuilder developer; Omaha, Nebraska Loreena McKennitt; Jewel; suddenly, tammy!; jehova waitresses Disclaimer: opinions expressed by me are mine, mine, mine! "Some people can tell what time it is by looking at the sun. But I have never been able to make out the numbers." - Anonymous -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ ------------------------------ Date: 28 Mar 1996 15:42:15 GMT From: "STEVE HUSTAD" To: wwi Subject: Re: Latest from Rosemont Message-ID: What!!! No German, or A.H. mini-Datafiles in this new list?!?!?! For those who care, the next three Mini-Datafiles are due in "at any time". These are: #4 - SPAD A.2 #5 - Morane Saulnier A.1 #6 - Vickers Guns That's the latest scoop, unless you care about 1/72nd Russian Armor... Nope! Geeez! I'm getting crabby in my old age! ;-) Steve H. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 22:57:25 -0500 From: jim lyzun To: wwi Subject: new to WWI Message-ID: <199603290357.WAA26211@mail.cwconnect.ca> I'm not a new modeller but have never really got into the stick and string stuff until now. I was inspired by an old Aurora Breguet 14 I just found. Where do I look for colour schemes/detail shots - or is this kit worth doing at all? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 23:40:13 -0700 From: hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) To: wwi Subject: Re: new to WWI Message-ID: Jim Lyzun (new to WW I) wrote: >I'm not a new modeller but have never really got into the stick and string >stuff until now. I was inspired by an old Aurora Breguet 14 I just found. >Where do I look for colour schemes/detail shots - or is this kit worth doing >at all? Well, you came to a good source for information. The only dedicated source of information I can think of for this kit is one in the old red PROFILE series. I'll have to check at home to see which number it was. There were a set of drawings of this machine done in Scale Models a long time ago as well. For all of the WW I dedicated publications produced by Albatros Publications in England in the last 10 or so years, this machine has been mostly overlooked. Basically there were two schemes for these, earlier production machines were painted an overall mustard yellow color on the fabric, usually with a similar color for the metal cowling panels. Later in the production run machines were painted with a 5 color camouflage scheme including black, a couple of greens, a tan and a brown. The WWW page for this group has some more specific information for the colors used by the French on Breguets and SPADs finished in this scheme. The URL for the web page (in case you haven't been there) is: http://pease1.sr.unh.edu/ I haven't really held the bits to this kit up to a set of drawings to compare their accuracy, has anyone else on the list built this one lately ?? Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 21:23:02 -0800 From: bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: new to WWI Message-ID: <199603290523.AA09174@ednet1.orednet.org> jim lyzun writes: > >I'm not a new modeller but have never really got into the stick and string >stuff until now. I was inspired by an old Aurora Breguet 14 I just found. >Where do I look for colour schemes/detail shots - or is this kit worth doing >at all? > Of -course- it's worth doing although you should know that these kits carry a current Kit Collectors' Value Guide suggested value of $80 and up - you might be money ahead selling it to a collector type and picking up a couple of Eduard Albatroses (Albatri?) or Hannovern. But, as I recall, the Breguet was not a bad kit for the era although unless you've got the K&B edition or can scratch build the bomb racks, your stuck with doing the Bre 14A2 rather than the sexier Bre 14B2. As I recall, the principal problem with the kit was the wing ribs which are perpendicular to the leading edge of the swept-back wing rather than the correct arrangement of being perpendicular to the line of flight - a real bear to correct if you're a stickler for correctness. The other problem is lack of a cut out and clear parts for the observer's windows - although some A2's dispensed with these windows entirely so depending on the aircraft you're doing, you could just putty in the engraved window on the fuselage and let it go at that. There's about 31 different 'flavors' of Breguet 14's with variations in ailerons, radiators, louvers, engines, and other details so other corrections may be required depending on the specific aircraft you're modeling. And, of course, all the old Aurora kits would benefit by adding detailing. But it -would- make an impressive model! Cheers, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org -or- aw177@Freenet.Carleton.ca - - Cave ab homine unius libri! - ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 22:36:31 -0700 From: mnelson@compusmart.ab.ca (Mark K. Nelson) To: wwi Subject: Re: 1/1 Albatros logo Message-ID: ... >Would anyone on the list (or off list if you can vouch >for them...) be interested in a new printing of the logo? ... >If they work out, maybe some 1/1 scale Pfalz or Roland >or Sopwith logos. >Brian Nicklas >NASAD003@SIVM.SI.EDU I would. _____________________________________________________________________ Mark (An Employee at Kites & Other Delights in West Edmonton Mall) ------------------------ mnelson@compusmart.ab.ca ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 28 Mar 1996 22:11:58 -0800 From: bshatzer@orednet.org (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: new to WWI Message-ID: <199603290611.AA05374@ednet1.orednet.org> Charles Hart wrote: > > Well, you came to a good source for information. The only dedicated >source of information I can think of for this kit is one in the old red >PROFILE series. I'll have to check at home to see which number it was. Number 157. > Basically there were two schemes for these, earlier production >machines were painted an overall mustard yellow color on the fabric, >usually with a similar color for the metal cowling panels. Actually, most of the metal cowlings on the 'yellow' Bre 14's appear to be a dark color which definitely does not match the fabric areas. The illustrations in the Profile shows 'em as a medium gray but they look even darker than that in the photos - I'm guessing dark gray, dark green, or even black. (Anybody have more definitive info?) >Later in the >production run machines were painted with a 5 color camouflage scheme >including black, a couple of greens, a tan and a brown. Well, maybe, but a quick check of my sources seems to indicate that if there were 5-color Bre-14's, they must have been rara aves indeed 'cause I can't find a single Bre-14 photo which is clearly 5-color. (though I -did- find some USAAS Sopwith one and one half strutters in 5-color!) Cheers, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org -or- aw177@Freenet.Carleton.ca - - Cave ab homine unius libri! - ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 06:52:19 -0500 From: "Matt Bittner" To: wwi Subject: Re: new to WWI Message-ID: <199603290653.GAA10629@cso.com> On 28 Mar 96 at 22:55, jim lyzun typed diligantly: > I'm not a new modeller but have never really got into the stick and string > stuff until now. I was inspired by an old Aurora Breguet 14 I just found. > Where do I look for colour schemes/detail shots - or is this kit worth doing > at all? Welcome! Here you'll find the best selection of modelers available. A friendly crowd, especially if you don't bring up that dreaded 109 type aircraft. :-) However, I can see that you're off to the *wrong* scale already. ;-) Seriously though, any scale is welcome, just as long as you're building WW1 stuff. However, the highest deity smiles on those who build 1/72nd.... Matt -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Matthew Bittner O- WW1 Modeler, ecto subscriber meba@cso.com PowerBuilder developer; Omaha, Nebraska Loreena McKennitt; Jewel; suddenly, tammy!; jehova waitresses Disclaimer: opinions expressed by me are mine, mine, mine! "Some people can tell what time it is by looking at the sun. But I have never been able to make out the numbers." - Anonymous -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 06:58:37 -0500 From: "Matt Bittner" To: wwi Subject: Re: new to WWI Message-ID: <199603290659.GAA10686@cso.com> On 28 Mar 96 at 22:55, jim lyzun typed diligantly: > I'm not a new modeller but have never really got into the stick and string > stuff until now. I was inspired by an old Aurora Breguet 14 I just found. > Where do I look for colour schemes/detail shots - or is this kit worth doing > at all? Whoops!! Forgot to list the references I come up with on the Brequet. Cross and Cockade International (C&CI): Vol 12 No 4, and Vol 21 No 2 Over the Front: Vol 2 No 2 WW1 Aero: #105 Windsock: Vol 1 No 4; Vol 3 No 1; Vol 6 No 1; Vol 7 No 5; Vol 8 No 5; Vol 10 No 4 Not sure if you can get these anywhere, but if you can, try to find the C&CI and WW1 Aero at least (the WW1 Aero has cockpit photo's), and the last two issues of Windsock has color plates of the 14. HTH. Matt meba@cso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 10:30:25 -0500 (EST) From: Jesse Thorn To: wwi Subject: Re: new to WWI Message-ID: On Thu, 28 Mar 1996, jim lyzun wrote: > I'm not a new modeller but have never really got into the stick and string > stuff until now. I was inspired by an old Aurora Breguet 14 I just found. > Where do I look for colour schemes/detail shots - or is this kit worth doing > at all? Cool kit. I made copies of drawings by Ian Stair from the 3 volume Aircraft Archives of WWI series from Motorbook Int. The kit compares well in shape and outline. Others have pointed out the main problems with the kit. For us 1/48th "Scale of Kings" modellers these are not that difficult to correct, IMHO. An evening with some sandpaper and strip styrene and you have corrected the wing rib problem. A bit of Dremel work and you have opened the observers windows and inserted some clear sheet plastic windows. Some references that come to mind that have not been mentioned here include: - the above mentioned book of drawings & photos has a chapter on the Breguet - Color Profiles of WWI Aircraft - has a chapter on the Breguet - Various old WWI era rigging and maintenance guides available from the WWI Aero archives. - I have some old English aviation magazine that has a feature on markings of the Breguet. Aviation Monthly or some such thing. Build this kit - don't let it collect dust in your closet! --Jesse ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Mar 96 07:45:03 PST From: stonto@seaccc.sccd.ctc.edu To: wwi Subject: Re[2]: new to WWI Message-ID: <9602298281.AA828114393@SCCCGATE.seaccc.sccd.ctc.edu> jim lyzun writes: > >I'm not a new modeller but have never really got into the stick and string >stuff until now. I was inspired by an old Aurora Breguet 14 I just found. >Where do I look for colour schemes/detail shots - or is this kit worth doing >at all? > Of -course- it's worth doing although you should know that these kits carry a current Kit Collectors' Value Guide suggested value of $80 and up - you might be money ahead selling it to a collector type and picking up a couple of Eduard Albatroses (Albatri?) or Hannovern. Really! Those old Auroras are collectors items. I think that the ones in the original famous fighters series are getting more and more rare if they aren't re-issues of the old kits. Is that a "Famous Fighter Series"? The person who posted ahead of me has the right idea; if you're into building then sell that kit and pick up some (more than one) newer kits. If you are just getting into it, a word of caution: these Eduard Albatross' (es?) are really nice but if you haven't done photo-etched before they are intimidating. You might start with something a bit less ambitious and work your way up to the Eduard and DML/Dragon stuff. If you've done photoetch before, then jump right in with the Eduard Albatross DV; that's their nicest one to date in my opinion. It doesn't have the entire frame of the interior in brass, but the molding is far superior to their previous offerings. Good luck! ----Stephen Tontoni ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 09:43:51 -0500 From: "Matt Bittner" To: wwi Subject: Re: new to WWI Message-ID: <199603290944.JAA13136@cso.com> On 29 Mar 96 at 10:28, Jesse Thorn typed diligantly: > Some references that come to mind that have not been mentioned > here include: Hey, if memory serves, isn't a Datafile on this being released this year? Matt meba@cso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Mar 96 07:54:59 PST From: stonto@seaccc.sccd.ctc.edu To: wwi Subject: Re[2]: new to WWI Message-ID: <9602298281.AA828114903@SCCCGATE.seaccc.sccd.ctc.edu> However, I can see that you're off to the *wrong* scale already. ;-) Seriously though, any scale is welcome, just as long as you're building WW1 stuff. However, the highest deity smiles on those who build 1/72nd.... Matt Matt Matt Matt.... theology on a Friday? C'mon man... As a born again agnostic the only thing that looks down on me for sure is the IRS. And it smiles. It leers. It ogles my paycheck. (Oh... IRS is Internal revenue Service.... the tax man. Whats the UK, OZ and other equivalent to that?) And my paycheck is 90% 1/48 scale. Have a good weekend all. See some of you tomorrow at the Seattle IPMS Spring show. ---Stephen Tontoni ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Mar 1996 10:09:20 -0500 From: "Matt Bittner" To: wwi Subject: Re: Re[2]: new to WWI Message-ID: <199603291010.KAA13641@cso.com> On 29 Mar 96 at 10:53, stonto@seaccc.sccd.ctc.edu typed diligantly: > Have a good weekend all. See some of you tomorrow at the > Seattle IPMS Spring show. And the best of luck to all those attending and entering. May your rigging stay taught, and the judges have a clue. Matt meba@cso.com ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 79 ********************