WWI Digest 328 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Airfix to the rescue? by DavidL1217@aol.com 2) 15 November 1916: Hoeppner named to command German Air Force by "Peter Kilduff, University Relations, 2-1791" 3) Re: Airfix to the rescue? by Joseph Gentile 4) Re: Airfix to the rescue? by "Valenciano . Jose" 5) RE: Airfix to the rescue? by Shane Weier 6) Re: Airfix to the rescue? by lothar@ncw.net (mark) 7) RE: Airfix to the rescue? by "Valenciano . Jose" 8) RE: Airfix to the rescue? by "Brian Bushe" 9) Re: Mimmi and cap strips by meba@cso.com 10) Re: 15 November 1916: Hoeppner named to command German Air Force by t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour) 11) German colors by meba@cso.com 12) Werner Voss by "Peter Kilduff, University Relations, 2-1791" 13) Re: German colors by SHUSTAD@email.usps.gov 14) Re: German colors by aew (Allan Wright) 15) Re: Airfix to the rescue? by Sandy Adam 16) Wednesday, 15 November 1916, Pau by "Marian Hollinger, Bradley Omanson" 17) Re: German colors by Charles_A._Duckworth@notes.up.com (Charles A. Duckworth) 18) Re: Eduard 1/48 DFW-28 Floh..need help! by boeke@bucknell.edu (Joseph R. Boeke) 19) Re: German colors by hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) 20) Re: 15 November 1916: Hoeppner named to command German Air Force by Bill Bacon ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 14 Nov 1996 20:43:23 -0500 From: DavidL1217@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Re: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: <961114204322_1350991551@emout12.mail.aol.com> Can anybody supply me with Airfix' address in Old Blighty? If they can do beautiful post WWII Spitfires and Seafires in 1/48, they can right some ancient wrongs by releasing accurate renditions in 1/48 of the Brisfit, and the SE5a. I am assuming that DML will put out the Camel (please, I beg you) once it has relocated to a new home in the British Empire. I would like to start a letter campaign for this cause. Who's in? David ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Nov 1996 21:18:13 -0500 (EST) From: "Peter Kilduff, University Relations, 2-1791" To: wwi Subject: 15 November 1916: Hoeppner named to command German Air Force Message-ID: <961114211813.22e3ec4b@CCSUA.CTSTATEU.EDU> The Wolff'schen Telegr.-Bureau reported "Appointment of a 'Commanding General of the Air Force'" Supreme Headquarters, 15 November. The growing significance of the air war has made it necessary to combine all aerial combat and anti-aircraft units of the Army in the field and at home into one service. Standardizing the conversion and assembling of this instrument of war has been entrusted to a "Commanding General of the Air Force" [Kommandierender General der Luftstreitkraefte]. Charged with the responsibility of Commanding General of the Air Force is Lieutenant General von Hoeppner, previously commander of a Reserve Division. + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + Note: Generalleutnant Ernst von Hoeppner, born on 14 January 1860, came up through the cavalry system. He reorganized the fragmented 'Fliegertruppe' [Flying Service], which had been distributed throughout the various Army units. He doubled the number of fighter units [Jagdstaffeln] from 40 to 80 by the time of the Spring 1918 offensive. Hoeppner was awarded Prussia's highest bravery award, the 'Orden Pour le Merite.' He died on 24 September 1922. A good mini-biography of Hoeppner can be found in the book _Pour le Merite-Flieger_ by Walter Zuerl (Curt Pechstein Verlag, Munich, 1938). It should be noted, however, that that otherwise very helpful book is shamefully lacking in a chapter on Ltn. Wilhelm Frankl, a 20-victory fighter ace and the only Jewish recipient of the "Pour le Merite" (also known as "the Blue Max"). -- Peter Kilduff ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Nov 1996 20:44:51 -0600 (CST) From: Joseph Gentile To: wwi Subject: Re: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: <199611150244.UAA12199@Walden.MO.NET> At 08:44 PM 11/14/96 -0500, you wrote: >Can anybody supply me with Airfix' address in Old Blighty? > >If they can do beautiful post WWII Spitfires and Seafires in 1/48, they can >right some ancient wrongs by releasing accurate renditions in 1/48 of the >Brisfit, and the SE5a. I am assuming that DML will put out the Camel >(please, I beg you) once it has relocated to a new home in the British >Empire. > >I would like to start a letter campaign for this cause. Who's in? > >David > Did I hear Brisfit in 1/48??? I'll belly up to the bar. Joe ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 12:45:33 +0800 (GMT+0800) From: "Valenciano . Jose" To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: On Thu, 14 Nov 1996 DavidL1217@aol.com wrote: > Can anybody supply me with Airfix' address in Old Blighty? > > If they can do beautiful post WWII Spitfires and Seafires in 1/48, they can > right some ancient wrongs by releasing accurate renditions in 1/48 of the > Brisfit, and the SE5a. > > I would like to start a letter campaign for this cause. Who's in? I'm in. How to go about this? ********************************************************************* Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician, joeyval@pusit.admu.edu.ph sitarist tel. (632) 921-26-75 Metro-Manila, Philippines "The more you know, the more you don't know." ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 16:00:31 +1100 From: Shane Weier To: "'wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu'" Subject: RE: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: <01BBD30E.22702B80@pc087b.mim.com.au> Joey, David, Joe, On Thu, 14 Nov 1996 DavidL1217@aol.com wrote: >> Can anybody supply me with Airfix' address in Old Blighty? > >> If they can do beautiful post WWII Spitfires and Seafires in 1/48, they can >> right some ancient wrongs by releasing accurate renditions in 1/48 of the >> Brisfit, and the SE5a. > >> I would like to start a letter campaign for this cause. Who's in? >I'm in. How to go about this? Brisfit/ BRISFIT? You do realise that this means I'm now going to have to kill you ? ;-) Shane n.b. 1/48 Bristol F.2b scratchbuild ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 14 Nov 1996 22:43:48 -0800 From: lothar@ncw.net (mark) To: wwi Subject: Re: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: <199611150643.WAA25290@concord.televar.com> >At 08:44 PM 11/14/96 -0500, you wrote: >>[snippage] >>I would like to start a letter campaign for this cause. Who's in? >> >>David >> >Did I hear Brisfit in 1/48??? I'll belly up to the bar. > >Joe Same here! Mark ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 14:57:23 +0800 (GMT+0800) From: "Valenciano . Jose" To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: RE: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: On Fri, 15 Nov 1996, Shane Weier wrote: > Joey, David, Joe, > > Brisfit/ BRISFIT? You do realise that this means I'm now going to have to kill you ? ;-) > > Shane > > n.b. 1/48 Bristol F.2b scratchbuild Shane, you can still buy the kit for the decals :-) ********************************************************************* Joey Valenciano WW1 modeller, teacher, jazz musician, joeyval@pusit.admu.edu.ph sitarist tel. (632) 921-26-75 Metro-Manila, Philippines "The more you know, the more you don't know." ********************************************************************* ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 09:32:27 +0000 From: "Brian Bushe" To: wwi Subject: RE: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: <199611150935.JAA23469@itl.net> re: RE: Airfix to the rescue? > >I'm in. How to go about this? > > Brisfit/ BRISFIT? You do realise that this means I'm now going to have to kill you ? ;-) > > Shane > > n.b. 1/48 Bristol F.2b scratchbuild > I wish you'd finish the bloody thing. you know no one's going to announce it til a week after you finish yours :-) Brian ps I have a spare ticket for the NZ Barbarians v England at Twickers if anyone wants to come. Brian Bushe syclone@itl.net Syclone Systems Denmark Street (44) 1628 789 470 Maidenhead Fax 789 513 Berkshire England ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 06:53:10 -0500 From: meba@cso.com To: WW1 Modelers Subject: Re: Mimmi and cap strips Message-ID: <199611150651.GAA27271@cso.com> On 14 Nov 96 at 6:01, Charles A. Duckworth typed diligantly: > One can paint the lettering white (or yellow) and then outline > with a Micron Pigma waterproof pen. The source I have for > these pens is Art Mart in St. Louis but most art stores would > carry. I use this pen a lot in this hobby, they make a .005 > tip and it allows for many applications such as defining nail > heads and illustrating the small wood cap strips seen on the > rib stations as used on the Bleroit XI and MS types. The pens > come in many sizes and colors (black, red, blues and brown). > I've used the brown to illustrate the light/dark wood in > propellers by painting the prop with Testors wood and then > going over with the brown pen. I have been using Micron markers for quite some time. Before I started using oils (just recently) I also used these for panel line enhancement. They are quite wonderful. Matt meba@cso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 04:58:48 -0800 From: t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour) To: wwi Subject: Re: 15 November 1916: Hoeppner named to command German Air Force Message-ID: <199611151258.EAA29379@dfw-ix1.ix.netcom.com> Peter wrote: (big ol' snip) >It should be noted, however, that that otherwise very helpful book is >shamefully lacking in a chapter on Ltn. Wilhelm Frankl, a 20-victory fighter >ace and the only Jewish recipient of the "Pour le Merite" (also known as >"the Blue Max"). What about Voss? Wasn't he Jewish? Perhaps the Nazis "hid" his religion out of convenience. . . Tom -- Tom Eisenhour t_eisen@ix.netcom.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 07:33:16 -0500 From: meba@cso.com To: WW1 Modelers Subject: German colors Message-ID: <199611150731.HAA00208@cso.com> Does anybody have a close-enough match for the Polly Scale line for the "typical", early red/brown and dark green camoflage? I'm about ready to start painting the Roland D.II, and was wondering. Or, if no specific Polly Scale, how about a close-enough FS equivalent? I'm not picky about being spot-on, but I would like a place to start at. General question: does anybody on the list have both the Methuen and FS 595, and are willing to do "close-enough" color matches? Does anybody know of any kits for the Roland D.I? How about references for the Roland D.III? The D.II Datafile mentioned it in passing, but never supplied anymore detail. Thanks, one and all! Matt meba@cso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 9:16:45 -0500 (EST) From: "Peter Kilduff, University Relations, 2-1791" To: wwi Subject: Werner Voss Message-ID: <961115091645.22e479e3@CCSUA.CTSTATEU.EDU> In response to t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour) To: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: 15 November 1916: Hoeppner named to command German Air Force >Peter wrote: >(big ol' snip) >>It should be noted, however, that that otherwise very helpful book is >>shamefully lacking in a chapter on Ltn. Wilhelm Frankl, a 20-victory fighter >>ace and the only Jewish recipient of the "Pour le Merite" (also known as >>"the Blue Max"). > >What about Voss? Wasn't he Jewish? Perhaps the Nazis "hid" his religion out of >convenience. . . > >Tom This question comes up from time to time (and I sure wish it would go away!), so let's see if we can put it to rest once and for all. For what it's worth, Ltn. Werner Voss listed his religious affiliation as "evangelisch" (Lutheran). Any earlier heritage has not come to light -- but does it matter? The same question has surfaced re: Adolf Auer (a Jasta 40 pilot I was in touch with for a long time). Like Voss, Auer had a family name that was the same as many Germans of Jewish heritage. He, too, was a Christian, even though his Fokker D.VII was decorated with a Star of David -- as a result of a cruel joke directed at Willy Rosenstein (who was, in fact, Jewish). Pardon this crass "plug," but Auer's story (and Hermann Goering's being his usual stupid self vis-a-vis Rosenstein) is all in my new book, _Over the Battlefronts_. To speak more directly to Tom's question -- i.e., did the Nazis "hide" Voss' heritage -- I think there was nothing to hide. An interesting book in the 1920s, _Juedische Flieger im Weltkrieg_ (Jewish Fliers in the World War) by Felix Theilhaber, gave a pretty full account of the men for whom the book is named. Had Werner Voss been Jewish, Theilhaber would have given him plenty of coverage in the book. Indeed, Theilhaber's research was so complete that he openly criticized Wilhelm Frankl for not practicing his faith. I don't mean to sermonize, folks, but in light of the incalculably monstrous atrocities associated the 3rd Reich Holocaust, I've become sensitive to questions dealing with who "was" or "wasn't" Jewish. It just contributes nothing to aviation history. PK ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:27:46 -0500 From: SHUSTAD@email.usps.gov To: "(u)wwi" Subject: Re: German colors Message-ID: <0033000001883039000002*@MHS> Matt, etal, The dark greens I've usually seen represented are dark and tending toward olive typically, though I've seen some strange looking lighter green shades too. WW II RLM 83 Dark Green, or RLM 71 Dark Green might be a good starting point. Humbrol #30 would work too. As to the red/brown color this is more difficult. I asked the question when I first got on this list as to why Herr Rimell paints this as a true *dark* *red*dish/brown (Humbrol #160 or so), but the methuen reference is for a much lighter, yellower, chestnut brown color (like Humbrol #63, but a bit darker). Nobody replied to my inquiry then, and I'm still confused as to Rimell's intentions here. (but I'm usually confused anyway!). Steve H. (The Mad Norseman!) ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Does anybody have a close-enough match for the Polly Scale line for the "typical", early red/brown and dark green camoflage? I'm about ready to start painting the Roland D.II, and was wondering. Or, if no specific Polly Scale, how about a close-enough FS equivalent? I'm not picky about being spot-on, but I would like a place to start at. General question: does anybody on the list have both the Methuen and FS 595, and are willing to do "close-enough" color matches? Does anybody know of any kits for the Roland D.I? How about references for the Roland D.III? The D.II Datafile mentioned it in passing, but never supplied anymore detail. Thanks, one and all! Matt meba@cso.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 10:41:36 -0500 (EST) From: aew (Allan Wright) To: wwi Subject: Re: German colors Message-ID: <199611151541.KAA13704@pease1.sr.unh.edu> > Does anybody have a close-enough match for the Polly Scale line > for the "typical", early red/brown and dark green camoflage? I'm > about ready to start painting the Roland D.II, and was > wondering. Or, if no specific Polly Scale, how about a > close-enough FS equivalent? I'm not picky about being spot-on, > but I would like a place to start at. I use The new Fokker Green for the green and Venician Dull Red for the brown tending towards the Redder Rimmel interpretation. Works pretty well, in my eyes. -Al =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | You fell victim to one of the 'classic' blunders! University of New Hampshire+--------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling WWW Page: http://pease1.sr.unh.edu =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 17:04:23 +0000 (GMT) From: Sandy Adam To: wwi Subject: Re: Airfix to the rescue? Message-ID: On Thu, 14 Nov 1996 DavidL1217@aol.com wrote: > > If they can do beautiful post WWII Spitfires and Seafires in 1/48, they can > right some ancient wrongs by releasing accurate renditions in 1/48 of the > Brisfit, and the SE5a. I am assuming that DML will put out the Camel > (please, I beg you) once it has relocated to a new home in the British > Empire. > > I would like to start a letter campaign for this cause. Who's in? Count me in - what do I have to do? Sandy. PS - I refuse to belly up to the bar (I think!) ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 13:19:52 -0800 From: "Marian Hollinger, Bradley Omanson" To: wwi Subject: Wednesday, 15 November 1916, Pau Message-ID: <328CDE78.553E@host.dmsc.net> Poor sort of day. Impossible to fly. Conferences all day! Am working hard every spare moment these days over work for Major Parker. Wrote to Leah Wood. Two nice letters from dear little Mother written last month from Ossining. Also letter from Bill DeLancy. Mr Glendowning here this afternoon with Comd't Balsam. Wonder if I could get the Military Medal as well as the War Cross thru Lieut. Belbize. No harm in trying anyway. **************************** from the diaries of E.C.C. Genet, Escadrille Lafayette ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 11:41:57 -0500 From: Charles_A._Duckworth@notes.up.com (Charles A. Duckworth) To: wwi Subject: Re: German colors Message-ID: <1996Nov15.113735.1155.864356@uprr-internet.notes.up.com> Someone may want to check the new Accuflex Acrylic railroad colors for various red-browns they are releasing, there are several different shades of 'boxcar red' and one may find a close match to the German red-brown. The model railroad crowd is picky on wanting to ensure when a Sante Fe boxcar is painted that is the right shade of boxcar red hence Accuflex enteringthe model railroad scene with different hues of red/brown. Examples are 'Light Tuscan Brown' Dark Tuscan Brown etc., I picked up their 'Milwaukee Brown' for a possible PC12 match but I'm still not totally sure it's the color I'm looking for I may end up adding some green to it and using it for PC10. I found the paint easy to airbrush and it does not have to be thinned with a special thinner. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 18:01:12 GMT From: boeke@bucknell.edu (Joseph R. Boeke) To: wwi Subject: Re: Eduard 1/48 DFW-28 Floh..need help! Message-ID: <9611151802.AA14730@mail.bucknell.edu> In rec.models.scale, scottfking@aol.com (Scottfking) wrote: >Hi, >They are openings in the fuselage. The only reference I have seen for >this aircraft is in the Windsock "World War One Warplanes, Volume One". >It is still available from the publisher, Albatros Productions. The kit >depicts the later version of the (only) prototype. No one seems to know >what color the a/c was actually painted for sure. I have seen it >described as being (pale) grey, blue, tan, or off-white. The kit matches >pretty well with Colin Owers' drawings in the Windsock reference, except >the fuselage might be a whisker short at the stern compared to the >drawings (big deal). Good luck and enjoy! > >Skippy >IPMS USA 32139 >MMCL ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 12:12:56 -0700 From: hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) To: wwi Subject: Re: German colors Message-ID: Charlie Duckworth writes: >Someone may want to check the new Accuflex Acrylic railroad colors for various >red-browns they are releasing, there are several different shades >of 'boxcar red' and one may find a close match to the German red-brown. The >model railroad crowd is picky on wanting to ensure when a Sante Fe boxcar is >painted that is the right shade of boxcar red hence Accuflex enteringthe model >railroad scene with different hues of red/brown. Talk about the most pampered, catered-to crowd in modeling ! Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu > >Examples are 'Light Tuscan Brown' Dark Tuscan Brown etc., I picked up their >'Milwaukee Brown' for a possible PC12 match but I'm still not totally sure >it's the color I'm looking for I may end up adding some green to it and using >it for PC10. I found the paint easy to airbrush and it does not have to be >thinned with a special >thinner. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 13:35:57 -0600 From: Bill Bacon To: wwi Subject: Re: 15 November 1916: Hoeppner named to command German Air Force Message-ID: <328CC61D.D94@netjava.net> Thomas Eisenhour wrote: > > Peter wrote: > (big ol' snip) > >It should be noted, however, that that otherwise very helpful book is > >shamefully lacking in a chapter on Ltn. Wilhelm Frankl, a 20-victory fighter > >ace and the only Jewish recipient of the "Pour le Merite" (also known as > >"the Blue Max"). > > What about Voss? Wasn't he Jewish? Perhaps the Nazis "hid" his religion out of > convenience. . . > > Tom > > -- > > > > Tom Eisenhour t_eisen@ix.netcom.com > Tom, Peter has answered your question very well. Concrete evidence of VVoss' religion can be foun in _Lt Werner Voss, Germany's Greatest Teenage Ace_ by Walter A. Musciano, Hobby Helpers Publications, New York, 1962. This is long out of print but itdoes contain a reprduction of Voss' service book. I will gladly send you a copy of the document if you will give me your snail mail address. One source of the incorrect information is Lou Camern's _Iron Men with Wooden Wings_, Belmont Books, New York, 1967. Again long out of print. What was your source other than word of mouth? Peter may have other sources. Best, Bill Bill Bacon wbacon@netjava.net ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 328 *********************