WWI Digest 22 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Subscribe by WhitPUSMC@aol.com 2) Re: Resin kits by Jesse Thorn 3) Re: Resin kits by ci010@freenet.carleton.ca (Jim MacKenzie) 4) Fok F1/DR1 color scheme by Peter Ansoff <72460.1665@compuserve.com> 5) Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme by bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) 6) Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme by The Flying Wrench 7) Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme - errata by The Flying Wrench 8) Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme by bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) 9) Fixing Bad Warps by Charles Stephanian 10) Re: Fixing Bad Warps by bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) 11) Re: Fixing Bad Warps by mindseye@mail.coretech.com (Phil Kirchmeier) 12) Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme by The Flying Wrench 13) Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme by bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) 14) Re: Fixing Bad Warps by The Flying Wrench 15) Fixing Bad Warps by t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) 16) Re: Glenco Pfalz DIII review by t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) 17) Re: Custom Photoetch & Decals by t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) 18) Dave Klaus URL? by t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) 19) Re: Glenco Pfalz DIII review by The Flying Wrench ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 14:53:35 -0500 From: WhitPUSMC@aol.com To: wwi Subject: Subscribe Message-ID: <960203145332_413664591@emout06.mail.aol.com> Subscribe, Subscribe! Thanks, WhitPUSMC@AOL.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 15:23:14 -0500 (EST) From: Jesse Thorn To: wwi Subject: Re: Resin kits Message-ID: I have two 'Czechmaster' kits and both are good - minimum flash, bubbles, warping, pits, etc. The part layout is very much like an injection molded kit with hollow interior. Smaller parts are embedded in a thin sheet of resin and are easily cleaned up. I would but lots of these except they are hard to find and they are very expensive. I have three Tom's Modelworks resin kits and would rate them as expensive and good, also. My only gripe is that you must supply most interior detail which I feel should be included given their cost. Smaller parts are metal and you get some photo-etch with each kit. Cheers, --Jesse P.S. Why are so many people familiar with the Firesign Theater on this list?!?! Is there a casual connection between WWI modeling and FST? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 16:51:42 -0500 From: ci010@freenet.carleton.ca (Jim MacKenzie) To: wwi Subject: Re: Resin kits Message-ID: <199602032151.QAA09086@freenet3.carleton.ca> >--Jesse said> > >P.S. Why are so many people familiar with the Firesign Theater on this >list?!?! Is there a casual connection between WWI modeling and FST? > Oh! Oh! A mis-spent youth rears its head again :-) What is the Firesign Theater? Thanks & Cheers - Jim. ------------------------------ Date: 03 Feb 96 16:59:32 EST From: Peter Ansoff <72460.1665@compuserve.com> To: WWI Modeling List Subject: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme Message-ID: <960203215932_72460.1665_IHD30-1@CompuServe.COM> Greetings, all. I'm working on one of the Wilhelmshaven/Mowe 1/50 card models of the Fokker Dr1. For a card model it is amazingly detailed -- the rotary engine is a little jewel with 57 separate parts, and rotates with the prop as it's supposed to. The instructions state that this is model represents Voss' aircraft. It is colored overall silver-gray and has has the wing skids which aren't correct for Voss's F1. It also has a strange cowling configuration (see below), the wrong serial number and a few other discrepancies. Building this model got me curious about several issues: 1. What *was* the color scheme of Voss' triplane, serial F1 103/17? McCudden's report of Voss's last dogfight describes it as "silvery blue" an other sources refer to it as the "silver triplane." However, the photos I've seen seem to show the standard Fokker factory finish of streaky dark green on the upper surfaces and light blue below. Apparently there is some evidence that it had a yellow rudder -- the Imperial War Museum has a yellow DR1 rudder that is believed to have been donated by McCudden's family. Some sources say that it had a yellow cowling also, though it looks dark in photos. (Yellow, of course, was the marking of Jasta 10, Voss' unit.) 2. In reference to the Fokker triplane scheme in general, what was the basic color over which the streaky green was painted? Some sources say that it was the natural light yellow of the fabric, while others imply that it was light blue (the same light blue as the undersides?) Imrie points out in his book that many triplanes had the light blue extended over the lower fuselage longerons and the edges of the tailplane upper surfaces -- this is clearly visible in his photos and the demarcation lines are sharp. If so, it sounds like the blue was applied *after* the streaks. 3. The cowling on the Wilhelmshaven/Mowe model had curved slots for the cooling vents instead of the round holes that make the "eyes" of Voss's famous "face" markings. A photo on page 34 of the Squadron/Signal book on the DR1 appears to show a triplane with the slot configuration, but does not identify the aircraft except that it was attached to Fl.ABt(A)224. The engine appears to be a standard LeRhone/Oberursel. Has anyone run across other triplanes with this cowling? I'm curious to know why Wilhelmshaven adopted it on their model. Any thoughts from Dr1 aficiados? Peter Ansoff 72460.1665@compuserve.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 16:21:08 -0800 From: bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme Message-ID: <199602040021.AA13488@ednet1.osl.or.gov> Peter Ansoff types: > >Greetings, all. I'm working on one of the Wilhelmshaven/Mowe 1/50 card models >of the Fokker Dr1. -snips- > >The instructions state that this is model represents Voss' aircraft. It is >colored overall silver-gray and has has the wing skids which aren't correct for >Voss's F1. It also has a strange cowling configuration (see below), the wrong >serial number and a few other discrepancies. > >Building this model got me curious about several issues: > >1. What *was* the color scheme of Voss' triplane, serial F1 103/17? McCudden's >report of Voss's last dogfight describes it as "silvery blue" an other sources >refer to it as the "silver triplane." However, the photos I've seen seem to >show the standard Fokker factory finish of streaky dark green on the upper >surfaces and light blue below. Apparently there is some evidence that it had a >yellow rudder -- the Imperial War Museum has a yellow DR1 rudder that is >believed to have been donated by McCudden's family. Some sources say that it >had a yellow cowling also, though it looks dark in photos. (Yellow, of course, >was the marking of Jasta 10, Voss' unit.) > Referring to the Werner Voss "Aces and Airplanes" special by Dennis Hylands provides a few of the answers. The 'silvery-blue' or 'silver triplane' appear to be more legend than fact. The British indicident report on the examination of the wreckage of F.I.103/17 says, "The machine features a new attempt by the enemy a caouflage. The entire upper and side surfaces are doped in various shades of gren, blue and grey which take the form of streaks applied at various angles.....Lower surfaces are a greyish blue." (no mention of silver!) Based upon what he claims is an examination of actual fabric snippets, Hylands interperts this as an overall pale green/blue (Menthuen 26B5/C6) overstreaked with a greyish/green shade (Menthuen 26E3 apprx.) on the upper surfaces and a 'washed out olive' (Menthuen 27E/F5) on the fuselage sides. He perfers a dark olive (Menthuen 4F5) for the solid areas such as the cowling and wheel covers although he acknowledges that some have suggested yellow for these areas. Yellow -would- show up as dark in some types of films used in that era although you'd think something as distinctive as a yellow cowl would have been mentioned in the British incident report and the cowling appears dark in -all- the surviving photos. I'd think dark olive is the best bet at present, pending at least -some- evidence to the contrary. The possible yellow rudder is somewhat problematic. Certainly nothing that looks like anything besides a white rudder shows up in any of the photos. Still, the latest photo that can be dated appears to be September 7 or 8, 1917 so I suppose there is no reason why the rudder could not have been repainted after the photos were taken. Still, there is no mention of a yellow rudder in the British incident report (but, perhaps not surprising - the rudder could have been carted away by souvenier hunters prior to the intellegence officer's arrival) and painting the rudders in squadron colors on Dr. I's does not appear to have been a common method of Jasta identification. I guess at this point, a yellow rudder is only a 'maybe'. But a white rudder -would- be correct, at least prior to 9/7/17. >2. In reference to the Fokker triplane scheme in general, what was the basic >color over which the streaky green was painted? Some sources say that it was >the natural light yellow of the fabric, while others imply that it was light >blue (the same light blue as the undersides?) Imrie points out in his book that >many triplanes had the light blue extended over the lower fuselage longerons and >the edges of the tailplane upper surfaces -- this is clearly visible in his >photos and the demarcation lines are sharp. If so, it sounds like the blue was >applied *after* the streaks. > According to Hylands, the streaky olive/green over blue was only applied to the first three Dr.I's, F101/17, F102/17 and F103/17 while the production Dr.I's used the same streaky green/olive applied over doped fabric. I wouldn't exactly say 'many' of the Dr.I's exhibited the under surface blue overlapping the fuselage longerons and tailplanes but clearly some of them did. With those aircraft, it would be a good surmise that the blue was applied -after- the uppersurface streaks. Yet, Fokker was notoriously lax on matters of markings and camouflage so I wouldn't read -too- much into this. Quite possibly, the blue was applied first on some aircraft and last on others and Tony Fokker many not have even bothered to issue directions on the 'right way' to do it so each individual work team may have done it the way that seemed easiest to them. >3. The cowling on the Wilhelmshaven/Mowe model had curved slots for the cooling >vents instead of the round holes that make the "eyes" of Voss's famous "face" >markings. A photo on page 34 of the Squadron/Signal book on the DR1 appears >to show a triplane with the slot configuration, but does not identify the >aircraft except that it was attached to Fl.ABt(A)224. The engine appears to be >a standard LeRhone/Oberursel. Has anyone run across other triplanes with this >cowling? I'm curious to know why Wilhelmshaven adopted it on their model. While there is, apparently, a 'standard' Dr.I cowling, lots of variations show up in the photos. And note that the cowling on Voss's F.I is distinctly different than the standard Dr.I cowling although the holes are the standard round and not the weird shape in the photo to which you refer. I've never seen another one like that in any of the photos so I'm guessing it was some sort of field modification, possibly by an 'erk' with a sense of humor. > >Any thoughts from Dr1 aficiados? > Them are mine. Cheers, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org -or- aw177@Freenet.Carleton.ca - "Cave ab homine unius libri!" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 15:56:32 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme Message-ID: <199602040056.PAA28089@anchor> At 04:59 PM 2/3/96 -0500, Peter Ansoff wrote: The Flyin Wrnch responds: >Greetings, all. I'm working on one of the Wilhelmshaven/Mowe 1/50 card models I always enjoyed paper models where can I obtain a list or catalogue of the Wilhelmshaven/Mowe collection? >1. What *was* the color scheme of Voss' triplane, serial F1 103/17? McCudden's >report of Voss's last dogfight describes it as "silvery blue" an other sources >refer to it as the "silver triplane." However, the photos I've seen seem to >show the standard Fokker factory finish of streaky dark green on the upper >surfaces and light blue below. Apparently there is some evidence that it had a >yellow rudder -- the Imperial War Museum has a yellow DR1 rudder that is >believed to have been donated by McCudden's family. Some sources say that it >had a yellow cowling also, though it looks dark in photos. (Yellow, of course, >was the marking of Jasta 10, Voss' unit.) According to the sources I have read on the colour confusion, which I admittedly found to be rather vague, Voss's aircraft was actually the factory streaked green fininsh throught including the cowling, the tail was all white with the black Maltese cross centered on it and the bottom was a light blue that apparently dirtied up quite quickly. This was evidently a standard paint scheme when the DR.I was delivered from the factory (this information seems the most widely accepted). The aircraft Voss was flying during his last battle was in fact a borrowed aircraft with another pilot's colour scheme. This was the silver blue scheme to which you refer. This is where the question arises as there is appearently no conformation as to the actual colour shade employed on this aircraft. The descriptions I have found range from blue to silver with silvery/blue being the most common. Perhaps this was aluminized silver dope with a shade of blue painted over it. I have never heard of a yellow cowling on Voss's aircraft. Apparently Voss took a factory painted aircraft and applied his personal markings, the "face" on the cowling and flew it as such. >2. In reference to the Fokker triplane scheme in general, what was the basic >color over which the streaky green was painted? Some sources say that it was >the natural light yellow of the fabric, while others imply that it was light >blue (the same light blue as the undersides?) Imrie points out in his book that >many triplanes had the light blue extended over the lower fuselage longerons and >the edges of the tailplane upper surfaces -- this is clearly visible in his >photos and the demarcation lines are sharp. If so, it sounds like the blue was >applied *after* the streaks. I have heard that two vesions of the streaked paint scheme. The first and most often encountered was the aircraft being painted a light shade of green and then brushed over with a darker shade of green The second version was the natural linen, again brushed over with dark green. Your blue with dark green is now the third version I've encountered. One concept that does seem to reoccur in DR.I paint descriptions was that the dark green was brushed on over the other color. As far as your photo's are concerned, Mr. Ray Rimmel of Windsock fame is constantly warning about the hazards of trying to determine a color from the photographs of that era. The Orthographic film used at that time was notoriously inconsistant in its results. There are different photo's from that period that have what appears to be totally different colour schemes on the same aircraft. >3. The cowling on the Wilhelmshaven/Mowe model had curved slots for the cooling >vents instead of the round holes that make the "eyes" of Voss's famous "face" >markings. A photo on page 34 of the Squadron/Signal book on the DR1 appears >to show a triplane with the slot configuration, but does not identify the >aircraft except that it was attached to Fl.ABt(A)224. The engine appears to be >a standard LeRhone/Oberursel. Has anyone run across other triplanes with this >cowling? I'm curious to know why Wilhelmshaven adopted it on their model. The cowling of which you speak was an experimental attempt to improve the cooling of the Oberusel Interestingly this style of cut-out have been employed on several reproductions of the DR.I to enhance cooling to the radial engines mounted on these replicas. As radials do not rotate like rotaries (rotate-rotary", see the connection?) they are more difficult to cool. In fact, some replica builders cut out the entire front of the cowling to facilitate proper cooling, leaving just the shell around the outside of the engine. Voss had the circular cut-outs on his aircraft cowling Flyin' Wrench "What this country needs is more unemployed politicians" Edward Langley - 1980 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 16:36:01 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme - errata Message-ID: <199602040136.QAA29560@anchor> The Flyin Wrench recants: According to the sources I have read on the colour confusion, which I admittedly found to be rather vague, Voss's aircraft was actually the factory streaked green fininsh throught including the cowling, the tail was all white with the black Maltese cross centered on it and the bottom was a light blue that apparently dirtied up quite quickly. This was evidently a standard paint scheme when the DR.I was delivered from the factory (this information seems the most widely accepted). The aircraft Voss was flying during his last battle was in fact a borrowed aircraft with another pilot's colour scheme. This was the silver blue scheme to which you refer. This is where the question arises as there is appearently no conformation as to the actual colour shade employed on this aircraft. The descriptions I have found range from blue to silver with silvery/blue being the most common. Perhaps this was aluminized silver dope with a shade of blue painted over it. I have never heard of a yellow cowling on Voss's aircraft. Apparently Voss took a factory painted aircraft and applied his personal markings, the "face" on the cowling and flew it as such. The borrowed aircraft story is one I have heard from several sources and I appearently state this as a fact. As we all know history is not what actually happened but what someone thought actually happened. I do not want to "factulize" a story that may or may not be accurate. It is simply one of the variations I have heard that lends credence to the silver/blue colour scheme description that so often occurs. I will say this in defense of the story however. I have spent many years spotting aircraft while flying. I can't imagine describing an aircraft painted the shades of gray/green and dark olive green or any of the combinations I have seen on Voss's aircraft as silver, blue, or silver/blue. In the air it is unimaginable that such a mistake could be made to describe such colors in the manner that was reported. Especially when there were multiple witnesses present. Something unexplained happened during Voss's last battle. Somewhere during that fight there was a light coloured aircraft that fits the oft repeated silver/blue description. After all the green was a type of ground camouflage. Such a color would have to have a dark apperance in the air. If your ever around a tactcal fighter base, take a look at the A-10 or similarly painted aircraft and try to describe it to yourself as light colored in any manner. I firmly feel that there was a silver or silver/blue aircraft in the battle, wether it belonged to Voss or not, as that color is quite unmistakeable in the air. I would expect the sheen that accompanies such colouring to be the deciding factor in describing such a colouring scheme. Such colouring could not be confused with a matt dark green, even in the heat of battle. The fact that such moments invariably stand out clearly in the mind of the individuals that experienced such action leaves little doubt in my mind as to the silver/blue description. That is why I repeated the borrowed aircraft scheme. To me it has more credence than "I saw a dark, olive green aircraft that I mistakely thought was silver/blue" line of reasoning. However doubt about such an aircraft being borrowed by, belonging or even being piloted by Voss at his last battle still remains. Flyin' Wrench "What this country needs is more unemployed politicians" Edward Langley - 1980 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 19:09:40 -0800 From: bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme Message-ID: <199602040309.AA07367@ednet1.osl.or.gov> > >The Flyin Wrnch responds: > >The aircraft Voss was flying >during his last battle was in fact a borrowed aircraft with another pilot's >colour scheme. I've gotta respectfully disagree with this assertion. There were -only- two Dr.I's (or, rather, F.I's, as they were then designated) at the front at this time - F.I 102/17 which was used by MvR and F.I 103/17 which was used by Voss. Voss's use of 103/17 seems quite well documented, there are several photos of Voss with 103/17 and the British incident report on the wreckage clearly refers to the aircraft as "number 103/17". F.I 103/17 -was- Voss's regular aircraft, is the aircraft shown in -all- the photos, and is the aircraft he was flying when shot down by McCudden, et al. Voss -may- have flown F.I 102/17 at some time but Kurt Wolff was shot down in 102/17 on September 15, 1917 so the only F.I available on September 23rd when Voss was shot down and killed -was- F.I 103/17. This was the silver blue scheme to which you refer. This is >where the question arises as there is appearently no conformation as to the >actual colour shade employed on this aircraft. >The descriptions I have found >range from blue to silver with silvery/blue being the most common. Perhaps >this was aluminized silver dope with a shade of blue painted over it. I have >never heard of a yellow cowling on Voss's aircraft. Apparently Voss took a >factory painted aircraft and applied his personal markings, the "face" on >the cowling and flew it as such. Certainly the assumption that Voss's a/c was a standard factory scheme with the personal marking field applied is reasonable. Yet, I think there is -no- evidence for a 'silver' component in the camouflage colors of 103/17 -except- the quoted McCudden comment (which I've been frantically looking for to verify the accuracy of - alas, I can't find it.) However, I'd submit that observations of pilots in the heat of combat are often more inaccurate than otherwise. Caldwell, the B flight leader, referred to the triplane as "blue grey" not silver - perhaps a reference to the undersurface color, perhaps just another inaccurate color recollection of what occured while the tracers were flying. In any case, Hylands claims to have examined actual swatches from 103/17 and he finds -no- trace of silver. The RAF incident report on the wreckage contains -no- mention of silver. And, streaked olive over silver would be a camouflage scheme totally unknown in any other Fokker a/c. I'd be -real- suspicious of the claimed olive/green over silver for 103/17 or any other tripe. -snips- Cheers, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org -or- aw177@Freenet.Carleton.ca - "Cave ab homine unius libri!" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 19:52:11 -0800 (PST) From: Charles Stephanian To: wwi Subject: Fixing Bad Warps Message-ID: I'm building the Revell/Germany 1/28 Spad XIII...The top wing has a real bad warp to it. Instead of being straight just about the whole wing warps up. Since this is 1/28, it's quite a thick piece of plastic. I've been running it under hot water and then laying it on a flat surface with *lots* of weight on top.. but this is hardly putting a dent in it. Any helpful tips on curing this? Thanks! Charles Stephanian csteph@itsa.ucsf.edu ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 20:11:17 -0800 From: bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: Fixing Bad Warps Message-ID: <199602040411.AA12215@ednet1.osl.or.gov> > > > >I'm building the Revell/Germany 1/28 Spad XIII...The top wing has a >real bad warp to it. Instead of being straight just about the whole >wing warps up. Since this is 1/28, it's quite a thick piece of plastic. >I've been running it under hot water and then laying it on a flat >surface with *lots* of weight on top.. but this is hardly putting a dent >in it. >Any helpful tips on curing this? > >Thanks! > Try -boiling-, not just hot water. (Test it on a piece of sprue first to make sure the plastic can take boiling water - I've never run accross styrene that can't take boiling water but I've heard from others that some can't. Better safe than sorry.) Something like a 9' x 12' cake pan where you can submerge the entire part for a minute or two works best. Then pluck it out and try the heavy weights trick. But, the SPAD XIII kit is still generally available - why not just take it back to your friendly hobby shop and ask for an exchange? You've obviously been sold a defective kit - they don't all have a warped wing so it'd seen like they should make it right for you. Cheers, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org -or- aw177@Freenet.Carleton.ca - "Cave ab homine unius libri!" ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 23:37:33 +0000 From: mindseye@mail.coretech.com (Phil Kirchmeier) To: wwi Subject: Re: Fixing Bad Warps Message-ID: <1388731843-2633963@mail.coretech.com> Charles wrote: >I'm building the Revell/Germany 1/28 Spad XIII...The top wing has a >real bad warp to it. Instead of being straight just about the whole >wing warps up. Since this is 1/28, it's quite a thick piece of plastic. >I've been running it under hot water and then laying it on a flat >surface with *lots* of weight on top.. but this is hardly putting a dent >in it. >Any helpful tips on curing this? You could try immersing the whole wing in a pan of boiling water thats removed from the heat and stood for a minute or two, until the whole wing is pliable to bend. Then cooling on a flat surface with a weight on top. The trick is to keep it in just long enough to be pliable without destroying detail. An alternative may be to immurse or pour the water over just the warped area until it becomes pliable. If your unsure, test the methods with some scrap first until you feel confident enough to try the actual wing. In some cases, if the warp is too bad it can spring back, then you'll be forced to use a strengthing rod of brass or steel buried along its length, a harder and more time consuming fix. I've used both methods with success. Good luck. Phil K. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 21:06:01 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme Message-ID: <199602040606.VAA09222@anchor> At 10:10 PM 2/3/96 -0500, Bill Shatzer wrote: > > >> > >>The Flyin Wrnch responds: >> >>The aircraft Voss was flying >>during his last battle was in fact a borrowed aircraft with another pilot's >>colour scheme. The Wrench Toadies: Bill did you receive my other post? I disavow all knowledge of the "borrowed aircraft" theory if I am caught being historically inaccurate. (I must have been writing it as you were writing this.) I bow to your research on this matter as you have clearly studied the matter in much greater detail than I have. I believe your research. But I still think there was a silver/blue/grey triplane present during the battle. Other aircraft were present as there is a description of an Albatros with red markings trying to assist Voss, this aircraft was shot down as well. Ah well at least this is more refreshing than the dreary old "Red Baron" Sheeeesh! Even the name has beome hoary with overuse. Thanks for the description. The best I have read to date. >"Cave ab homine unius libri!" How does this translate - Out of unity comes liberation? The Flyin'Wrench ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 3 Feb 1996 22:58:04 -0800 From: bshatzer@ednet1.osl.or.gov (Bill Shatzer) To: wwi Subject: Re: Fok F1/DR1 color scheme Message-ID: <199602040658.AA19468@ednet1.osl.or.gov> The Flyin' Wrench dutifully typed: >>"Cave ab homine unius libri!" >How does this translate - Out of unity comes liberation? > >The Flyin'Wrench > Tee-hee! Nah, it roughly translates as, "Beware the man with only one book." It's kinda a political comment but it does have some application to WW1 research as well. So many books, so little time! (When I was much younger, this aphorism was 'so many women, so little time!' but, alas......) :-) Cheers, -- Bill Shatzer - bshatzer@orednet.org -or- aw177@Freenet.Carleton.ca - "Cave ab homine unius libri!" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 00:42:34 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Fixing Bad Warps Message-ID: <199602040942.AAA16893@anchor> At 10:50 PM 2/3/96 -0500, Charles Stephanian wrote: >Any helpful tips on curing wing warps in the top wing of Revell/Germany 1/28 SPAD XIII? The Wrench instructs: Here is a method that I used to cure the problem on that very Revell 1/28 SPAD wing of which you speak: Note that this was the American kit with a mild warp not the AG kit with the potatoe (You know I still wonder about the vice president spell checker I obtained from that shareware company) potatoe chip wing. The AG kit I returned to the store for a refund. However, had I not already posessed the other kit, I would have used this technique as I have often done so successfully with many other kits. I use steam from a teapot to remove warpage. I Fill a teapot with about two inches of water, so it doesen't take all day to boil and it gives a good head (no off-colour comment's please) of steam. Then I take the offending part and run it over the steam SPOUT. You will note that the piece bends away from the steam source when this is done; that is due to the uneven expansion of the plastic. The hot side expands more and thus bends away from the steam source. In five seconds or so the part warps completely the other way. However if you remove it from the steam at this point the part will assume the original warped shape. What must be done is to steam BOTH sides of the warp completely and evenly. Then hold the part in the position that is the reverse of the original warped direction. In this case the wing curls upward so you want to steam both sides completely and then finish with the hot side curving the wing downward, then hold the wing in that downward curved position and run the wing under cold water for a minute or two until the plastic is thourghly cooled. When I lived in the tepid water state of Taxas, I used ice water in a shallow pan to cool the part. Although the plastic has now cooled with a downward curl, after several minutes to several hours and in a few, very rare, cases a day, (depending on the plastic) the wing will bend upward again and assume the proper flat position. If you cool the plastic in the flat position it will resume an upward curl, just not as severely as the original warp. Each warped area must be attended to separately, as attempting to cure multiple warps simultaneously simply leads to frustration. It takes a bit of practice, but this method has yet to fail me. More importantly I have never ruined a part using this method, with one exception. I once put the component to close to the heat source because I was using too small a teapot, and melted the scallops on a 1/72 SPAD wing. But this was due to my neglect, not to the method of warping. If the part does not assume the proper shape just do it again until the desired curve is achieved. I recently used this method on the wing of the DML D.VII which is quite thick. It took three trys but it finally became flat. I always seem to have a problem leaving enough reverse curve in the part for it to return to flat. But again its no big deal just steam the part again. Remember: The thinner the plastic, the easier it is to reshape. Caveat: Watch the fingers, steam will burn! I never ruined a part, but I have burned my fingers several times. Normally I know this isn't done here, but just this once I have to give you the WEB site of the day, month or who knows? Perhaps millennium. Here it is: www.teleport.com/%7Eboydroid/gold.htm. It is a very lengthy treatise, but read the whole text. I guarantee you will be shocked, maybe amazed, perhaps even entertained and if it's true who, knows what will happen to you. Enjoy. And a note to Bill about "Cave ab homine unius libri!" - Dang it Bill now you've gone and told everyone my secret. Ahem - PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE MAN BEHIND THE CURTIN SPEAKING LATIN! The Flyin' Wrench A little more tired at the close of day, A little less anxious to have our way; A little less ready to scold and blame; A little more care of a brother's name; And so we are nearing the journey's end, Where time and eternity meet and blend. Rollin J. Wells - "Growing Old" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 05:04:35 -0800 From: t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) To: wwi Subject: Fixing Bad Warps Message-ID: <199602041304.FAA11176@ix9.ix.netcom.com> Having recently (and successfully!) dealt with the same problem on the Revell Camel, here's how I solved the wing warpage problem: Tape the wing to a flat surface (I used a piece of scrap 1x4 lumber) with masking tape. Get a blow dryer and set it on "hot". The blow dryer will produce enough heat to take out the warp but not enough to melt the plastic. DO NOT use a heat gun! After applying heat for a few minutes, stop and let the plastic cool, then untape it and see if it's straight. If not, tape it back down and try again. Regarding taking it back to the store and exchanging it: forget it. The're ALL probably warped. Good luck! Give us feedback on which method works. Tom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 05:32:22 -0800 From: t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) To: wwi Subject: Re: Glenco Pfalz DIII review Message-ID: <199602041332.FAA14158@ix9.ix.netcom.com> I put the kit together last Sunday while waiting for the Super Bowl to begin. I only noted three problems: Excessive lower wing dihedral: Someone on the list mentioned this recently as a problem with the kit. The cause is too-long cabane struts or too-short interplane struts which, if left uncorrected, in the short run will give the lower wing too much dihedral and in the long run will bow the upper wing. My suggestion is to shorten the cabane struts which look too long anyway. Radiator pipe: Too short. It doesn't reach from the front of the engine to the hole provided in the upper wing. Make a new one out of copper wire. Strut locator holes: Too small for the pins - need to be enlarged. Other than that the kit goes together very well. Tom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 05:48:12 -0800 From: t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) To: wwi Subject: Re: Custom Photoetch & Decals Message-ID: <199602041348.FAA19147@ix7.ix.netcom.com> >Joe Boeke wrote: >Has anyone had any custom photoetching or decals done? Any advice on >vendors, or on the process? What about cost? How cost prohibitive are >these methods? There was a similar thread last March in the rec.models.scale newsgroup. Here are two sources highly recommended by Steve Edgar: Howard McLean Arrow Graphics R.R. No. 1 York, Ontario N0A 1R0 Leading Edge 1232 17th Ave, S.W. 2nd Floor Calgary, Alberta T2T 0B8 Tel/Fax: 403-245-9394 Caveat: I have no personal knowledge of these companies. Tom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 05:51:30 -0800 From: t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) To: wwi Subject: Dave Klaus URL? Message-ID: <199602041351.FAA24385@ix8.ix.netcom.com> Doesn't Dave Klaus of IPMS Color Guide fame have a web page? Anyone know the URL? Tom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 4 Feb 1996 09:24:36 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Glenco Pfalz DIII review Message-ID: <199602041824.JAA29005@anchor> At 08:30 AM 2/4/96 -0500, Thomas Eisenhour wrote: The Wrench reconsiders: >Excessive lower wing dihedral: Someone on the list mentioned this >recently as a problem with the kit. The cause is too-long cabane struts >or too-short interplane struts which, if left uncorrected, in the short >run will give the lower wing too much dihedral and in the long run will >bow the upper wing. My suggestion is to shorten the cabane struts which >look too long anyway. Interestingly I found this to be the very problem I encounterd with the DML D.VII except the wing struts were too long after I straightend the upper wing. Problem was I discovered this too late. A bit of gap filling cyanoacrylate fixed the slightly short cabanes right up though. I took the lower wing warp out with the method I described, but I think I'm going to try the blow dry method but mount the part on glass which is usually flatter than lumber. I haven't tried the struts yet but I agree the cabane struts look absurdly long. like maybe two or three scale feet from fuselage to upper wing long. >Radiator pipe: Too short. It doesn't reach from the front of the engine >to the hole provided in the upper wing. Make a new one out of copper >wire. I never even thought to use the plastic one supplied with the kit. >Strut locator holes: Too small for the pins - need to be enlarged. Only one of mine had this problem the others were a nice tight fit. >Other than that the kit goes together very well. In fact the kit goes together so well that I assembled it without glue! Maybe a few screws to complete the assembly? No I'm not sure I really want to complete this one however. New problem noted lack of raised cowling around engine, the front portion of the raised cowling is moulded on the fuselage but the sides are absent. Due to the lack of cockpit detailing, the tiny engine mounted in the huge fuselage hole (how do you fill in al that space?) and the many other errors already noted wheels, guns etc. I think I'll Let the neighbor kid build this one and I will wait for the Eduard version. Of course I will keep the decals as the Eduard set will probably not be as nice. It's rather ironic to note that one often pays as much for a decal set as we paid for this entire kit! So I feel I got a neat toy that took me back to yesteryear when I was much happier with such models because I didn't know the difference. The Flyin' Wrench Pull out a gray hair and seven more will come to its funeral. ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 22 ********************