WWI Digest 17 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: Revell 1/28 D VII - AARRGGHH!! by t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) 2) Re: WWI digest 16 by bciciora@pitneysoft.com (Bill Ciciora) 3) READ ME: Call for Papers Change of Date by Brian Nicklas 4) Latest FSM by "Matt Bittner" 5) Re: Latest FSM by aew (Allan Wright) 6) Re: Latest FSM by Randy J Ray 7) Methuen Handbook of Colour by hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) 8) Re: Latest FSM by "Matt Bittner" 9) Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour by "Matt Bittner" 10) Aviation Usk by "Matt Bittner" 11) Revell 1/28 Fokker DVII by "WILSON, TIMOTHY" 12) Decals for 1/28 Spad by Charles Stephanian 13) Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour by Jesse Thorn 14) Re: Revell 1/28 D VII - AARRGGHH!! by Jesse Thorn 15) Re: Necessities, Necessities - Photoetched 1/48 by Jesse Thorn 16) Re: WWI digest 16 by The Flying Wrench 17) Re: Latest FSM by The Flying Wrench 18) Re: Revell 1/28 Fokker DVII by The Flying Wrench 19) Re: Help!!! by "Joseph R. Boeke" 20) Exerpt by docc@aristotle.net (Dr. Larry J. Crabb) 21) Re: Revell 1/28 Fokker DVII by "WILSON, TIMOTHY" 22) Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour by "Gerald P. McOsker" 23) Gizmology by hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) 24) Re: Decals for 1/28 Spad by hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) 25) Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour by hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 06:13:20 -0800 From: t_eisen@ix.netcom.com (Thomas Eisenhour ) To: wwi Subject: Re: Revell 1/28 D VII - AARRGGHH!! Message-ID: <199601301413.GAA24847@ix11.ix.netcom.com> Wrench wrote: > >>Franz und Emil >Wasn't this generic terminology for U-Boat sailors? Maybe, but it's also the nickname for the pilot and observer team. I think the term originated as a comedy routine along the lines of Laurel and Hardy. > >Oops! I guess my feelings about Taxas slipped out again. You lived here for a while, didn't you? I know you mentioned dusting in the Rio Grande Valley. Now let me move on to more pleasurable matters. I take it your association with our fair state was not entirely pleasurable? By the what part of central Taxas do you reside in? Austin. > >I am continually amazed at the level of knowledge >exhibited on this forum. I bought the D.VII (paid exactly $29.95, >no sales tax) and thought "pretty neat", other then the moulded detail. >Just look at the starting mag, I've seen paintings with more depth! I think Shane was the one who first planted that idea in my head about this being a project that Revell started in the late '50s and abandoned. At the time it seemed far-fetched but after looking at the way various things on the kit are handled, I'm believe it. Things that manufacturers don't do anymore, like the oil pump and throttle molded in low relief on the fuselage walls. Things like the framework in the engine compartment molded integral with the fuselage. But the thing that clinches it for me is the humped upper wing. When accurate drawings have been available for years, WHY would Revell use the old Nieto drawings as the basis for this kit? The answer is obvious: because the dies for the wings were cut when the Nieto drawings were generally accepted as gospel, i.e. the 50s, when you, I, and a lot of other people thought Aurora kits (also based on Nieto's drawings) were pretty cool. But then I read this post and I find I don't even know what an anti buffet screen is let alone that a D.VII had one behind the seat. I take it though that is that little canvas bulkhead with the hole in it that ostensibly kept the wind in >the open cockpit from buffeting the fabric internally. The Dr. I kit should have one but doesn't. >Now the intake manifold. Forget that intake manifold and look at the exhaust. >The horn is reversed and gives the appearance of the early exhaust that >protruded from the side of the cowling. The "saxophone" look is definitely >missing. We never even got to the exhaust manifold. After discovering the problem with the wing, we kind of lost interest, you know? Ok louvers - I can handle louvers. The actual aircraft in the data file was a apparently a Fokker product with a few extra louvers. That's what I thought at first, but look at pictures of other 6000/8000 series OAW-built D.VIIs and you'll notice the engine panels have a louver config very similar to late Fokker-built a/c. The engine panels on the kit don't _exactly_ match any known manufacturer I have ever seen. OTOH, I've seen so much variation in D.VII panels, that at this point I'll accept anything close. But wait! I note that the entire lower wing is warped severely downward. When I bend the top piece of the upper wing it begins to take on the correct taper. Perhaps if we sand the alignment pins off and warp the top piece of the upper wing to its correct contour and then fit and glue the lower piece of the upper wing and sand the slightly mismatched edges, we can come up with a presentable piece. If you lay the upper wing on a flat surface you can see just how warped >it is, when you pin it flat you will see the correct taper begin to reveal >itself. Wishful thinking, old man! Sorry, but someone needs to vacform a correct wing. Any takers? >Now, who is this guy Nieto and why should I know about his drawings? I believe he was associated with _Model Airplane News_ from back in the late 40s. Some of the r/c guys should know. > >On a scale of one to ten, I give it a five - I like the beat, but I can't >dance to it. > I agree, the kit is NOT a total waste. Most of the problems are minor, like the anemic (as Greg so elegantly put it) intake manifold, but until someone fixes the wing, I'd put it on the shelf. In the meantime I'm going to keep working on my Camel! Shoes for industry, comrade! Tom (Franz) Eisenhour ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 96 09:31:57 EST From: bciciora@pitneysoft.com (Bill Ciciora) To: wwi Subject: Re: WWI digest 16 Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jan 1996 Carlos wrote: >4. The main difference was that the D.III's guns were buried beneath the > top decking and thus couldn't be unjammed in flight, while the > D.IIIa's were conventionally exposed and within reach of the pilot. Does this imply that I don't need to run out and get aftermarket MGs, since only the barrels will be visible? The instruction drawings are little help as to the MG mounting positions. Will holes need to be cut into the fuselage? How much of the barrels should stick out? Also, for anyone on the list, where does one get one of these Methuen color references? I did a lookup on my regional public library dialup database and came up empty. Bill Ciciora - bciciora@pitneysoft.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 96 11:17:34 EST From: Brian Nicklas To: Subject: READ ME: Call for Papers Change of Date Message-ID: <199601301617.LAA23814@pease1.sr.unh.edu> *** Resending note of 01/29/96 16:22 From: Aeronautics & Aerospace History Date: Mon, 29 Jan 1996 16:24:28 -0500 Reply-To: Aeronautics & Aerospace History Sender: Aeronautics & Aerospace History From: Carl Bobrow Subject: READ ME: Call for Papers Change of Date To: Multiple recipients of list AEROSP-L OOPS!!!! Well excuse mmmeeee! Do I have egg on my face or what? As observed the date for the submissions was posted as Jan 10, 1996 it should read February 25th, 1996 sorry for the mistake. Call for Papers/Presentations for the 1996 National Meeting of the League of World War I Aviation Historians June 21-23, 1996 Washington, D.C. You are invited to submit an presentation for the 1996 National Meeting of the League of World War I Aviation Historians If your presentation is selected: You get the opportunity to contribute to an exciting field of aviation history. You increase your visibility and credibility. You will receive up to $300.00 reimbursement for expenses and participation. You will share an unforgettable experience with fellow aviation enthusiasts. Proposals must reach the Meeting Organizing Committee by February 25th, 1996 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 10:12:45 -0600 From: "Matt Bittner" To: WW1 Modelers Subject: Latest FSM Message-ID: <199601301102.LAA24460@cso.com> Well, the latest FSM with their 'net article is out. Don't know about the rest, but I'm a bit disappointed. It was great that the home page URL was included, but there were no pictures, and no info on subscribing to the list. Bummer. There is a Blueprint 1/24th Fokker E.III in the Reader Gallery. Wonderful job. Good news for those "blind", 1/48th builders. Koster has just released a SSW D.IV "multimedia". Turns parts of the major components are in *resin*. Wow! If anybody buys and builds this, I would be interested in hearing on what it's like. Not that I'm going to go out and get one, it would just be interesting to know. ;-) Funny, but the Meikraft ad has been missing for a number of years. :-o. Someone was asking about the Fokker D.II; well, some "rumors" has it that Meikraft is planning on doing this in injected. Hah. Hahah. Bwahahahahahahahahaha. That's right after he releases the Lloyd Triplane, right? Matt -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Matthew Bittner WW1 Modeler, ecto subscriber, semi-new dad, meba@cso.com PowerBuilder developer; Omaha, Nebraska Disclaimer: opinions expressed by me are my responsibility only. "You cannot make anything foolproof, because the fools are so ingenious." - Christian Walters -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 11:35:43 -0500 (EST) From: aew (Allan Wright) To: wwi Subject: Re: Latest FSM Message-ID: <199601301635.LAA28213@pease1.sr.unh.edu> > Well, the latest FSM with their 'net article is out. Don't know > about the rest, but I'm a bit disappointed. It was great that the > home page URL was included, but there were no pictures, and no info > on subscribing to the list. Bummer. I haven't seen the new FSM yet, but if what Matt says is true I a bit pissed off. I offered to do an extensive article for them not only on my page but modeling on the net with screen captures of the pages, etc. It's too bad they had to do a half-adssed job when I specificly offered to to a top-notch one for them for free. -Al =============================================================================== Allan Wright Jr. | I'm not left handed either! - The Man in Black University of New Hampshire+--------------------------------------------------- Research Computing Center | WWI Modeling mailing list: wwi@pease1.sr.unh.edu Internet: aew@unh.edu | WWI Modeling Mosaic Page: http://pease1.sr.unh.edu =============================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 09:39:56 -0700 (MST) From: Randy J Ray To: wwi Subject: Re: Latest FSM Message-ID: <9601301639.AA06113@voodoo.ecte.uswc.uswest.com> >Well, the latest FSM with their 'net article is out. Don't know >about the rest, but I'm a bit disappointed. It was great that the >home page URL was included, but there were no pictures, and no info >on subscribing to the list. Bummer. I suppose I am a little disappointed. I haven't seen the issue yet, but when I first heard that they were going to do this, I wrote Bob Hayden offering to fill him in a little on the history of the newsgroup, and the trials and such we went through. Call me silly, but having done all the work for getting rec.models.scale created, not to mention its predecessor alt.models, I thought I could offer something. Even though his message was basically, "We'll get back to you," it did sound sincere, and I believed him at the time. *shrug* Randy -- ^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^v^ Randy J. Ray -- U S WEST Technologies IAD/CSS/DPDS Phone: (303)595-2869 Denver, CO rjray@uswest.com I don't suffer from insanity. I enjoy every minute of it. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 10:54:15 -0700 From: hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) To: wwi Subject: Methuen Handbook of Colour Message-ID: Bill Ciciora writes: > >Also, for anyone on the list, where does one get one of these >Methuen color references? I did a lookup on my regional public library >dialup database and came up empty. > Bill (and others), you want to look for "The Methuen Handbook of Colour" published by: Methuen London Michelin House 81 Fulham Road London SW3 6RB England The copy I have is a 3rd edition, printed in 1989. I believe that it has been re-published at least once since that time. To offer words of encouragement, these books are EXTREMELY hard to find. I had been looking for about 7 years before obtaining a copy from Leo Opdyke at WW I Aeroplanes (Leo is presently looking hard for more copies, apparently in vain). I have never seen this book in a used book store, though I looked very hard in such places. I have also never found it in a library, though I looked less hard there. One friend of mine had the idea to check in artist supply houses, something I had not thought of, I don't know if he had any success there. If anyone on this list goes a lookin' for this book, I for one would be interested in learning of your progress (or lack thereof) in this quest. GOOD LUCK. Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 10:52:07 -0600 From: "Matt Bittner" To: wwi Subject: Re: Latest FSM Message-ID: <199601301141.LAA25029@cso.com> On 30 Jan 96 at 11:36, Allan Wright typed diligently: > I haven't seen the new FSM yet, but if what Matt says is true I a bit > pissed off. I offered to do an extensive article for them not only on > my page but modeling on the net with screen captures of the pages, etc. > It's too bad they had to do a half-adssed job when I specificly offered > to to a top-notch one for them for free. Believe me, Al, you would have blown their socks off. The article falls short in so many areas it's not funny. There's some text by one of the authors that goes into how he was able to get some help from Italy and Finland on building one of those "other war" aircraft. Well, he never went into who he contacted, how he know how to contact that person, etc. Basically, "I got help from so-and-so, so nyah nyah". Might be a bit off, but that's the impression I got. Ah well, others will come to their own conclusions. At least FSM put something in, I guess... Matt ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 11:02:56 -0600 From: "Matt Bittner" To: wwi Subject: Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour Message-ID: <199601301152.LAA25155@cso.com> On 30 Jan 96 at 11:41, Charles Hart typed diligently: > If anyone on this list goes a lookin' for this book, I for one would > be interested in learning of your progress (or lack thereof) in this quest. > GOOD LUCK. Or, what are the chances of someone scanning the one the have, for inclusion on the web page? Maybe a page a .gif, or some such? Just a thought. Matt ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 11:14:37 -0600 From: "Matt Bittner" To: WW1 Modelers Subject: Aviation Usk Message-ID: <199601301204.MAA26151@cso.com> Someone was asking about Aviation Usk info. Well, in perusing the "smaller" ads in the back of the latest FSM, they have a web page: http://www.spokane.net/models However, I just tried it, and it doesn't exist. Maybe they're working on it, who knows. I'll try again some other time. Matt ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 12:14:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "WILSON, TIMOTHY" To: wwi Subject: Revell 1/28 Fokker DVII Message-ID: <01I0MDM4N0YQADC88Z@psulias.psu.edu> At 09:49 PM 1/29/96 -0500, Greg Springer (Franz und Emil?) wrote: >Guten Abend Meine Damen und Herren! > >It's a balmy night here in central Texas. A few minutes ago Eisenhour >arrived to witness the ceremonial opening of the first Revell 1/28 >scale D VII to arrive here and for which I just plunked down 30 >sponduliks. So here goes: > >Cockpit: Pretty much a copy of the old Dr I. Fuselage frame is > depicted by raised detail on inner surface of fuselage. > This I can fix. Seat is nice. Remove molded-in > harness. Anti-buffet screen behind seat is provided. > What needs to be fixed re: the fuselage frame? I'll admit I'm not an expert on DVII interiors. I was planning to put a real fuel pump on the starboard side as opposed to that wierd flat thing. By real I mean something more three dimensional, before any smart alecs respond with "Wouldn't a real pump be too big?" >Engine: Very nice. Intake manifold is anemic but this I can fix. > Prop is not an Axial. Possibly a Steiniger?? Fuselage frame > around the engine is molded into the panel openings on the > sides of the fuselage a la the old 1/32 Spitfire kit. The > side panel louvres as molded don't match the photo of the > original a/c on page 19 of the Datafile. > What about various wiring and tubing (gizmology) on the engine? I have detailed WWII aircraft in this fashion, but not WWI types. Is there a good profile showing interior guts/hints for this? >Decals: For Franz Buchner's aircraft of Jasta 13. Upper surfaces of > both upper and lower wings and horizontal stab.are in lozenge. > Lower surfaces are to be painted light blue. Green nose, blue > fuselage, white fin and rudder. Checkered belly band and > werewolf face. Four color lozenge looks a bit off and lower > surface lozenge is not provided. Here's a business opportunity > for some decal company! This is wierd. I bought my DVII in Germany (came to about $20.00 US) My plans say the underside colors are light green. I must admit this sounds really odd to me. Does your kit say they are to be light blue, which makes more sense? > >The Upper wing: Oh woe! Oh bitter gall! Tom is recalling the rumor > that went around claiming that this was a 1950's kit > which was never released. The upper wing is a > disaster. The lower surface is dead flat and the > upper surface is humped like Quasimodo never dreamed > of being. This kit appears to have been made from > the old Joe Nieto drawings with their incorrect > depiction of the 'cathedralled' upper wing surface. > It doesn't look fixable to me. Someone call up Bob > Norgren and tell him to get to work. I'll fork over > the bucks for a correct vac-form wing. The rest of > the kit is OK. What bugs me the most about the upper wing (I'll admit the hump problem is a bit of a revelation to me) is that you have to glue the lower half to the struts (so you can attach the fuselage control cables) and THEN put on the upper half. This sounds like a recipe for frustration! Also, I noticed that this particular DVII is an AOG (Albatros) built aircraft. Did they differ in any spectacular way from the standard models? Just wondering... >Bah! Donnerwetter! > >Franz und Emil Der Motor funktioniert nicht mehr! Die verdammte Englaender haben mich runtergeschossen! Waaaaaahh!!!!!! Tim Wilson Grad-Modern European History Penn State University ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 09:30:30 -0800 (PST) From: Charles Stephanian To: wwi Subject: Decals for 1/28 Spad Message-ID: Does anyone know of any aftermarket decals for the 1/28(7) Revell Spad ? Also, other than Tom's Modelworks p/e sets, are there any detail items for the Spad ? I'm going to attempt to build this kit, my first time building anything larger than 1/48. Any tips on dealing with it are most appreciated. Thanls! Charles Stephanian csteph@itsa.ucsf.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 13:05:06 -0500 (EST) From: Jesse Thorn To: wwi Subject: Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour Message-ID: > Bill Ciciora writes: > > > >Also, for anyone on the list, where does one get one of these > >Methuen color references? I did a lookup on my regional public library > >dialup database and came up empty. The Art Department Library at the local university here has a copy of this book. If there is a state university near you you may as a citizen have library privileges at the university library system. I find lots of incredibly good stuff in the UNC Chapel Hill library system. This includes a complete set of Flight and Aeroplane Mechanic dating back to 1912(?) and including all of the the WWI years and after on microfilm. They also have many bound collections of interesting aviation and US military magazines that are of interest to modellers. These feature manufacturer ads with clear photos or illustrations of aircraft components as well as photos of aircraft. UNC is part of a inter-university library loan group. This has allowed me to borrow books from participating libraries from around the region. They have an electronic card catalog that also includes the catalogs of these other universities. --Jesse ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 13:19:19 -0500 (EST) From: Jesse Thorn To: wwi Subject: Re: Revell 1/28 D VII - AARRGGHH!! Message-ID: On Tue, 30 Jan 1996, Thomas Eisenhour wrote: > > I think Shane was the one who first planted that idea in my head about this being > a project that Revell started in the late '50s and abandoned. At the time it Didn't Aurora make large scale Fokker D.VII and SE 5 kits way back? These large styrene birds were assembled using screws! I saw one at an IPMS contest a few years back and the vendor wanted way too much money for it. I remember the detail being similar to what has been described here - cheesy bas relief cockpit detail. Gist for the Rumor Mill: Could this Revell kit be from the old Aurora molds? OK. I admit to also having lived in Texas at one point. Houston in 1973. Apart from the excellent Tex-Mex food and the cheep drunk afforded by a $3 case of Buckhorn or Pearl beer, I found nothing else to convince me to stay! Of course, I now live in North Carolina so what do I know? --Jesse ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 13:40:52 -0500 (EST) From: Jesse Thorn To: wwi Subject: Re: Necessities, Necessities - Photoetched 1/48 Message-ID: On Mon, 29 Jan 1996, Matt Bittner wrote: > > Well, let's see. Tom's Modelworks has photoetch stuff out. IMNSHO, Don't forget FotoCut > > And lastly did someone mention an injection LFG Roland > > C.II in 1/48? I thought I saw this in a recent post but I can't > > seem to locate such a post now. > Merlin makes one. Thsi was discussed in the recent Merlin models thread. --Jesse ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 09:59:38 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: WWI digest 16 Message-ID: <199601301859.JAA01798@anchor> At 10:22 AM 1/30/96 -0500, Bill Ciciora wrote: >On Tue, 30 Jan 1996 Carlos wrote: > >>4. The main difference was that the D.III's guns were buried beneath the >> top decking and thus couldn't be unjammed in flight, while the >> D.IIIa's were conventionally exposed and within reach of the pilot. > >Does this imply that I don't need to run out and get aftermarket >MGs, since only the barrels will be visible? The instruction drawings >are little help as to the MG mounting positions. Will holes need to be >cut into the fuselage? How much of the barrels should stick out? I guess this depends on your attitude of scale representation. Some are happy with a general representation of an aircraft. Some concern themselves with accurate color schemes more than anything else, as if the airframe were simply a way to exhibit the paint scheme. And some want the pucker marks reproduced on the seat for complete accuracy. I would the latter are overwhelmingly represented on this forum, at least looking at some of the 1/72 miniatures posted on this forum gives me that impression. I'd say you probably need to show the barrel fronts of the Spandaus. But then again, as I view my 1/24 Scale Pfalz I would say that there is no need to bother with the guns as only the barrels are visible and that is looking at the aircraft head on, from the side there is no portion of the gun that is visible. Then again here are variation that have the front half of the barrels showing. In any case there is plenty of room to glue them up under the cowling but remember you need a reasonable facsimile of a Spandu to do this, the ones supplied in the kit aren't worth bothering with. Probably the best bet is to decide on the representative aircraft you are going to build, then go to the photographs to determine how you will handle the guns. A fair reference book for this aircraft is "Scale Aircraft Drawings" form the publishers of the "Model Airplane News". Also you could spend a little time detailing the engine like the installation of an intake manifold would help greatly. Shazaam! I feel like Bill Clinton after that waffel house reply. Well at least I'm not married to Hillary. > >Also, for anyone on the list, where does one get one of these >Methuen color references? I did a lookup on my regional public library >dialup database and came up empty. > Hard to find. I've been looking for a copy of the book for quite sometime now. I hear there is a repub of it, I just can't seem to find it. "The Flying Wrench" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 10:27:35 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Latest FSM Message-ID: <199601301927.KAA02865@anchor> At 11:58 AM 1/30/96 -0500, Matt Bittner wrote: >On 30 Jan 96 at 11:36, Allan Wright typed diligently: > >> I haven't seen the new FSM yet, but if what Matt says is true I a bit >> pissed off. I offered to do an extensive article for them not only on >> my page but modeling on the net with screen captures of the pages, etc. >> It's too bad they had to do a half-adssed job when I specificly offered >> to to a top-notch one for them for free. > >Believe me, Al, you would have blown their socks off. The article >falls short in so many areas it's not funny. > >There's some text by one of the authors that goes into how he was >able to get some help from Italy and Finland on building one of those >"other war" aircraft. Well, he never went into who he contacted, how >he know how to contact that person, etc. Basically, "I got help from >so-and-so, so nyah nyah". Might be a bit off, but that's the >impression I got. Pretty Bizarre considering everyone and their mother now gives a web address for everything including the dog washers of America - Dogwash@doggy.com/whocares. As for FSM, I didn't bother with the last issue as I saw nothing of interest in it. I don't know call it snobbery or call it rationality, but I just can't get into detailing a 68' Pontefract "Maniac". The car slogan: "If this doesn't kill you, you must already be dead" Pontefract's company slogan: "Remember - Safety is everybody's business but ours". Hell, I even lost interest in building the real thing many years ago. I mean where does this fit in a historical perspective? It's just a bunch of guys reliving their misspent youth. Here we maintain the lofty ideal of reliving someone else's misspent youth - somehow that makes it much better. >Ah well, others will come to their own conclusions. At least FSM put >something in, I guess... Yes I did, but I didn't have to spend mony to reach a conclusion, I just read it standing in front of the magazine stand. 'The Flying Wrench" This ain't the Louve; if it was you would't be here. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 10:43:50 -0900 From: The Flying Wrench To: wwi Cc: Multiple recipients of list Subject: Re: Revell 1/28 Fokker DVII Message-ID: <199601301943.KAA03348@anchor> At 12:26 PM 1/30/96 -0500, WILSON, TIMOTHY wrote: >What needs to be fixed re: the fuselage frame? I'll admit I'm not an >expert on DVII interiors. I was planning to put a real fuel pump on the >starboard side as opposed to that wierd flat thing. The moulding is a good representation of the pump - if you dropped it in the mud. I believe you are speaking of the hand pump used to pressurize the fuel system until the engine driven pump comes online. It was also used as an emergency pump in case of engine pump failure. >What about various wiring and tubing (gizmology) on the engine? I have >detailed WWII aircraft in this fashion, but not WWI types. Is there a good >profile showing interior guts/hints for this? Gizmology? And you said you weren't an expert. >What bugs me the most about the upper wing (I'll admit the hump problem is >a bit of a revelation to me) is that you have to glue the lower half to the >struts (so you can attach the fuselage control cables) and THEN put on the >upper half. This sounds like a recipe for frustration! Oh great! Now I have something else to deal with. I think I'll put this one away as a collector's item as representative of models designed in the fifties. > >Also, I noticed that this particular DVII is an AOG (Albatros) built >aircraft. Did they differ in any spectacular way from the standard models? AOG, This means "Aircraft On Ground" in my Lexicon. What does it mean in German? And you said you wern't an expert. Tsk. Tsk.> "The Flying Wrench" Have you seen my Albatros anywhere? Silly me, here it is around my neck. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 14:18:09 -0500 From: "Joseph R. Boeke" To: " List, WWI Modelers" Subject: Re: Help!!! Message-ID: <9601301915.AA19802@coral.bucknell.edu> Just got this in my mailbox... - Joe boeke@bucknell.edu >Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 11:10:53 -0800 >To: "Joseph R. Boeke" >From: cmoody@spokane.net (Carla Moody) >Subject: Re: Help!!! > >Hi Joseph, > >Sorry for the confusion. Actually, what you saw is correct -- >unfortunately, the site is not yet up and running. We're still working on >making everything perfect. Please check back in the near future -- I'm sure >the folksa at Aviation Usk will be glad to know they are creating interest >already!! > >Carla Moody >Marketing Director >InterLink Services, Inc. +==================================+===================================+ | Joseph R. Boeke | The best executive is one who has | | Manager, Prospect Information | the sense enough to pick good men | | Bucknell University | to do what he wants done, and the | | (717) 524-3200 | self-restraint enough to keep | | (717) 524-3610 (fax) | from meddling with them while | | | they do it. | | boeke@bucknell.edu | -- Theodore Roosevelt | +======================================================================+ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 14:15:53 -0600 From: docc@aristotle.net (Dr. Larry J. Crabb) To: wwi Subject: Exerpt Message-ID: Exerpt from: "The Flying Wrench" >He had grown up in a country run by politicians who sent the pilots to man >the bombers to kill the babies to make the world safer for children to grow >up in. >Ursula K. le Guin - 1971 ">The Lathe of Heaven" To paraphrase; He grew up in a country run by politicians who sent the pilots to man the bombers to kill the bastards to that kill that killed the babies that never grew up. Ursala K. le Guin must have been a dreamer and never read "The Holocaust" ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 15:08:49 -0400 (EDT) From: "WILSON, TIMOTHY" To: wwi Subject: Re: Revell 1/28 Fokker DVII Message-ID: <01I0MJV2LOQCADCGB3@psulias.psu.edu> At 1446 30 Jan 96, the Flying Wrench wrote: "AOG, this means "Aircraft on Ground" in my Lexicon. What does it mean in German? And you said you weren't an expert. Tsk. Tsk." Hmm. There was "LVG" which was Luftverkehrgesellschaft "AEG" Allegemeinelektrisitaetsgesellschaft "DFW" Deutscheflugzeugwerk Yes, the Germans like compound words. Don't blame me for it. In response to the Wrenchmeister's pithy comments about AOG, I may have gotten it wrong-- AOW is perhaps more accurate, standing for Albatros (something) Werk. But hey. I'm at work and don't have my handy-dandy reference sources with me. Yes, I was referring to the hand pump on the starboard fuselage. It is a tad on the flat side, or "dropped in the mud" as you put it. I think scratchbuilding something more substantial should be a snap. My question had more to do with is it the right type of pump on the right side, as Emil and Franz commented that the interior was a copy of the DrI, rather than a DVII. As far as Gizmology goes, it's important. I'm always afraid that when I "get creative" somebody will be looking at my model and go, "Hey, your frammis-pin-maxi-float-ring is all wrong." I'm going to stick with this DVII, as I've started work on it anyway. I can always send it to the "Great Spare Parts Box in the Sky" if things don't work out. Not to change the subject, but what does anybody out there think of the 1/32 scale "Hobbycraft" WWI stuff? I have their Nieuport 17 and apart from the undetailed instructions, it looks like it has potential. T. Wilson Grad-Modern European History Penn State Univ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 15:25:38 -0500 From: "Gerald P. McOsker" To: wwi Subject: Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour Message-ID: <310E7EC2.1065@pcix.com> Charles Hart just posted a reference to teh Methuen Hanbook of = Colour- Forget it! It is again out of print and my British = connections say that Methuen isn=B9t interested in reprinting yet- = Sorry! ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 15:12:55 -0700 From: hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) To: wwi Subject: Gizmology Message-ID: T. Wilson wrote: > >In response to the Wrenchmeister's pithy comments about AOG, I may have >gotten it wrong-- AOW is perhaps more accurate, standing for Albatros >(something) Werk. But hey. I'm at work and don't have my handy-dandy >reference sources with me. > Perhaps you mean OAW, which stands for Ostdeutsch Albatros Werke. Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 15:18:04 -0700 From: hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) To: wwi Subject: Re: Decals for 1/28 Spad Message-ID: Charles Stephanian asks: >Does anyone know of any aftermarket decals for the 1/28(7) Revell Spad ? >Also, other than Tom's Modelworks p/e sets, are there any detail items >for the Spad ? > >I'm going to attempt to build this kit, my first time building anything >larger than 1/48. Any tips on dealing with it are most appreciated. > Americal/Gryphon sheet #15 features French cockades for boththe Revell 1/28 SPAD XIII and 1/40 Heller (now SMER) SPAD VII. Quite a few years ago there was a decal sheet sold (given away ?, I can't remember, I just know I have one) at an IPMS Nationals that had markings for all three Revell 1/28 kits, no national markings but I know that the one for the SPAD was for Guynmer's "Vieux Charles". No, my sheet isn't for sale. Other than that I think that you are on your own. Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Jan 1996 15:25:12 -0700 From: hartc@spot.Colorado.EDU (Charles Hart) To: wwi Subject: Re: Methuen Handbook of Colour Message-ID: >On 30 Jan 96 at 11:41, Charles Hart typed diligently: > >> If anyone on this list goes a lookin' for this book, I for one would >> be interested in learning of your progress (or lack thereof) in this quest. >> GOOD LUCK. > to which Matt replied: >Or, what are the chances of someone scanning the one the have, for >inclusion on the web page? Maybe a page a .gif, or some such? Just >a thought. > Well, you could do such a thing and post it on the web. Then you would have umpteen dozens of downloads to as many different color monitors, each set to a slightly different interpretation of a color, thus a "standard" color will be given many representations, none of which match the original. Color theorist Josef Albers put it this way: You could ask a room full of 30 people to think of the color red and they would think of 30 different reds. You could then say the words Coca Cola, and while they would all have the same logo in their collective minds, they would still be thinking of 30 different reds. I think the two scenarios are analogous. Charles hartc@spot.colorado.edu ------------------------------ End of WWI Digest 17 ********************